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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ RL Tech: Cybereyes

Posted by: eidolon Apr 17 2006, 04:29 AM

We're getting there:

http://rdu.news14.com/content/top_stories/default.asp?ArID=82612

Posted by: nick012000 Apr 17 2006, 08:43 AM

And soon afterwards, we'll get rigging, too. We already have the control cyber, now we just need the sensory stuff.

Posted by: El_Machinae Apr 17 2006, 07:52 PM

This kinda startles me - I was just listening to an article on how this is being experimented on using rabbits. I'm stunned to see that it's being done in humans already.

Posted by: BookWyrm Apr 18 2006, 02:10 AM

Oh hell yeah. Once these become more like SR-style, with IR and rangefinder/targeting, I'm SO in the doc's office! (does monumentally bad Rocky impression: "Cut me, mick, cut me!")

Posted by: El_Machinae Apr 19 2006, 01:36 AM

Start saving, because you'll certainly live to see it (if current progress trends can be encouraged to continue, which requires luck and wisdom). Pushing associated R&D through consumer power will speed its development as well.

Posted by: Dale Apr 19 2006, 02:03 AM

I figure in 20 years we could get an actual pair of cybereyes for $20,000.

Posted by: Kyuhan Apr 19 2006, 03:42 AM

With the way nanotech and regenerative medicine is going, cyber may go the way of the Dodo before it even gets here.

Posted by: eidolon Apr 19 2006, 04:40 AM

If you're talking about "cyberware" as merely medical answers to disabilities and the like, then possibly. But even then, I doubt it.

Posted by: Kremlin KOA Apr 19 2006, 05:55 AM

they're already here
scientists predict 10 years before usable resolution is achieved

Posted by: Oracle Apr 19 2006, 06:31 AM

Is there another source for this story to verify it?

Posted by: Crusher Bob Apr 19 2006, 06:57 AM

There are numberous sources about the doctor (William Dobelle, who died in 2004) describing him working on 'artificial vision research' and a few sources mentioning partial restoration of sight in blind volunteers.

Posted by: El_Machinae Apr 20 2006, 04:19 AM

QUOTE (Kyuhan)

With the way nanotech and regenerative medicine is going, cyber may go the way of the Dodo before it even gets here.

This will only occur if we proactively continue to foster a society of progress and advancement. If we piss away our resources too quickly (and not find replacements fast enough), we might not make it.

The real trick is to make sure to not spend your money foolishly, on wasteful products, but to spend it wisely (or save it if there's nothing to spend wisely on)

Basically, purchasing products that requite similar R&D to produce will speed this type of progress.

Posted by: nezumi Apr 20 2006, 03:02 PM

Err... What? The only thing I read that has relevance to the line quoted is that we should buy stuff based on similar R&D. Can you rephrase?

Posted by: Chrome Shadow Apr 21 2006, 08:39 PM

I have see photos of one of the volunteers o this project. The cables that go from the computer to the skull look just like they do in Shadowrun, but very ordinary. They really are like 2 or 3 cables strapped together. It looks very similar to a datajack... Exactly like one...

The Story appear in the cover (and inside) of a mexican magazine called Muy Interesante (Very Interesting). Sorry I can't scann it...

Posted by: cx2 Apr 22 2006, 03:47 AM

Just don't expect blind people to disappear, even if these were made available to everyone.

People born blind aren't comfortable with the concept of being able to see most of the time, they're used to being blind and they don't want to change it. There's quite some fear in the blind community that governments will force blind people to take these and cut off their benefits.

My personal fear is lack of understanding. I've been blind for a (very) few years now, due to messed up optic nerves (leber's optic atrophy to be exact). There would be nothing usable to connect eye replacements to in my case. I'm worried that if these things come about people won't accept why I can't have one. I already have enough trouble explaining why I don't have a guide dog (only a couple thousand here in the UK, probably similar numbers elsewhere. They seem more because they're so obvious, but they're not suitable for everyone by a long shot).

On the other hand, if I could use them I'd only go for them if they had thermo
I've got set in my ways... and I'm only 22 at that.

Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Apr 22 2006, 07:12 AM

cx2, they don't interface with the optic nerve. As I understand it, they're directly stimulating the portions of the brain that interpret visual imput.

And would you take ones with an imagelink, if they lacked thermo?

Posted by: nick012000 Apr 22 2006, 07:17 AM

...

If you're blind, how are you reading these forums?

Also, I'll point out that as long as the visual portion of your brain is intact, this stuff will work.

Posted by: Thanee Apr 22 2006, 08:39 AM

QUOTE (nick012000)

If you're blind, how are you reading these forums?

That's actually possible... the page gets read to you, using some special software.

Bye
Thanee

Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Apr 22 2006, 09:13 AM

Wonder how it handles forums?

Posted by: Aku Apr 22 2006, 01:21 PM

its also possible to be "legally blind" and still be able to see withthick ass glasses. Thanks to some harsh astigmatism, i feel like i am every morning i wake up before i put my contacts in.

Posted by: emo samurai Apr 22 2006, 03:21 PM

What does the software read? It would suck if it read "Running Target Linebreak Group: members."

Posted by: eidolon Apr 22 2006, 07:10 PM

QUOTE (cx2)

There's quite some fear in the blind community that governments will force blind people to take these and cut off their benefits.

No offense intended, but do you really mean to tell me that those people would rather be blind and receive a monthly stipend, than be able to see the world around them?

Windows has a program that will read text to you. It's not the greatest, but if any of you are inclined to mess around with it, just go to Start>speech.

Posted by: Aku Apr 22 2006, 07:30 PM

i think the fear would be to see shittily, and not get the payments... then again, i also think cx as talking about people born blind, and in that case, i can see it being a "scary" propisistion for them.

Posted by: El_Machinae Apr 24 2006, 05:11 PM

QUOTE (Oracle)

Is there another source for this story to verify it?

See, I knew that the story I heard was with regards to animals (it was rats, not rabbits)

Here is a podcast with a discussion with the researcher. He thinks there will be human trials in 2 years (the interview with him starts at minute 22ish). http://media.libsyn.com/media/sciencefriday/scifri-2006040711.mp3

The device connects to a 'lower' level of optic cells, cells that are often not ruined during eye degeneration.

Here is a summary page on his project. At the bottom there is a picture that describes how the device works. http://www.stanford.edu/~palanker/lab/retinalpros.html

Posted by: Platinum Apr 24 2006, 05:50 PM

There were a few articles in journals from a year or so ago, where someone who lost his site, gained some of it back with an 81 pixel camera which fed into his cortex. there is a picture of him doing a burnout in a mustang. (and he was able to make out a few faces even with such a low resolution) I cannot find the link for the life of me. In order for this procedure to work, the patient must have been able to see before.

Posted by: cx2 May 2 2006, 01:19 PM

Okay...

First, lol, I wouldn't mind an imagelink if I could bring myself to use such a thing.

Second, I'm using Jaws for Windows 4.51. The main players are:
http://www.freedomscientific.com Jaws reader and Magic Magnifier
http://www.gwmicro.com Window Eyes reader
http://www.dolphinuk.co.uk Lunar/Lunar plus magnifier, Hal reader and Supernova reader/magnifier combo
http://www.aisquared.com Zoomtext magnifier

All readers can support braille displays (handy for the deaf-blind, yes they do use PCs). THere are also software and hardware solutions around for mobile phones (Symbion only in software) and PDAs (Windows Mobile only for software solutions). Narrator stinks, don't bother with it (the one in Windows that is). There are free demos of most software out there for this purpose, certainly all the companies above make demos of their PC software.

Third, I'm not sure even I would go for it if it camt out. The money from the government isn't exactly to live on, it's par tof the initiatives usually in place to help people with disabilities get back into work. It helps pay for things like my speech software and so on. As for the DLA (disability living allowance) that exists in the UK I get about £120 a month, and I need to use it for when costs are higher. If I want a usable microwave it costs £200 as opposed to £40, there are things like atlking kitchen scales and jugs (about £30-40), liquid level indicators (to tell when your cup's full, you can use a finger but not with hot coffee), my long cane (white stick, they don't last for ever) and so on and so forth. It's because living costs are higher.

It isn't that we sponge. I lost my sight from pretty much full to pretty much nothing in the space of about 3-4 years, I coped but because I had no choice. It can really play hell with your self identity, and whilst if it happened naturally I think I could cope I'm not sure I could bring myself to go through another big change like that of my own doing. It's a *lot* to expect. I'm just getting comfortable with myself (something I used to find hard at the best of times), and to turn it upside down again... I'm not sure I could handle it. Don't underestimate the psychological impact of a change like losing your sight.