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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ Random (but Topical) Trivia

Posted by: Aaron Apr 25 2006, 12:21 PM

So, I was digging for some information on "standard" building specs, since one of my players needed to know how far it was from the fourteenth floor to the ground, and I thought I'd share what I discovered, since it might be useful.

The standard height of a single residential storey (floor) of a building is around 3 meters.

The standard height of a single commercial or business storey is around 4 meters.

The standard height of a storey intended for machinery (heat, air conditioning, air circulation, elevator equipment, etc.) is about 6 meters.

Posted by: Moon-Hawk Apr 25 2006, 02:42 PM

Good stuff, thanks.

Posted by: nezumi Apr 25 2006, 05:38 PM

Keep in mind, much of this is no longer relevant with the introduction of trolls. Building heights will have (officially) increased, although this won't always be the case.

Posted by: Kremlin KOA Apr 25 2006, 05:52 PM

Uh nezumi, no
By Canon Building heights have usually NOT increased.

This is one of the disadvantages of being a troll

Posted by: Tiralee Apr 27 2006, 09:52 AM

You know, random trivia crap like that saves me as a GM.

Thank you, I'd sort of cobbled together the heights from badly-remembered building diagrams, but I'd forgotten the Heat/Machinery height and there were some unsubtle queries at how they could fit all that elevator stuff into a 3m tall room...

Again, thanks.

-Tir

Posted by: Oracle Apr 27 2006, 10:16 AM

A better topic description would help to keep this useful though.

Posted by: Daddy's Little Ninja Apr 27 2006, 02:16 PM

We always just said 10' floor as the average. So to do a 14 story building- 140 feet. A special building like a warehouse or an auditorium needs more work.

Posted by: Lindt Apr 27 2006, 03:08 PM

Thats a really good question. How much would IBC change because of Trolls? I mean seriously, the number of trolls would greatly out number the number of people in wheelchairs, and its requireed by law to provide acess to them, reguardless of cost.

Posted by: Dog Apr 27 2006, 03:10 PM

Sure, but how long were there people in wheelchairs before society got around to accomodating them?

Posted by: Lindt Apr 27 2006, 06:15 PM

Erh... todays date minus 21 years?
I just saying, all it would take is one person sueing, and things would get changed. Look at Vegas, they recently bought 2, extra-high capacity ambulances, for heart atta... erh patitents over 400 lbs.

Posted by: Kanada Ten Apr 27 2006, 06:31 PM

True, but they're charging more for those patients, too. Oh, how Humanis would fight "the Troll toll." Can't you just hear them outside city hall, right now?

Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Apr 27 2006, 06:36 PM

Nope.

I hired a Rigger to drop a nice fat napalm bomb on them.

I do, however, smell the smell of a victorious morning.

Posted by: Dog Apr 27 2006, 06:41 PM

QUOTE (Lindt @ Apr 27 2006, 06:15 PM)

Erh... todays date minus 21 years?

I don't follow that comment. Could you explain, please?

Meanwhile, I'll rephrase mine. People with disabilities have been told "screw you, just deal with it" by society for many generations, I'll dare to say hundreds of years, before anyone started to support them enough in their fight to be accepted and accomodated. It's only when enough decent lawyers get behind behind a lawsuit that it's gonna work. And it's only when enough voters get behind a decision that the law is gonna change. (Well, that's how it's supposed to work, anyway.)

Or to draw a closer analogy: Even when the law recognizes all ethnic backgrounds (or to put it inaccurately, 'races') as being equal, that's still a far cry from the infrastructure of a civilization being redesigned to allow for a small fraction of the population who are regarded by most as being big, scary and stupid.

However, I prefer the analogy of the physically challenged instead of ethnic differences, because what we're talking about is a significant physical difference, not a cultural one.

And It'd take more than one law suit. It's easier to pay off one upstart a couple of million than to tear down corporate headquarters and rebuild it on a bigger scale.

Besides, I think the writers make a point of saying that racism is alive and well in Shadowrun. If it's not inconvenient to be a troll, everyone'd be doing it.

That's probably more than needed to be said...

Edit: The next three posts say it better than me, anyway.

Posted by: mmu1 Apr 27 2006, 07:55 PM

So, let's say you do re-build everything so that it's convenient for trolls.

Now that you're done, better get ready for lawsuits from the pissed off majority, who have to constantly deal with the discomfort of living in a world built for someone about 60% taller - falling down troll-sized stairs, getting hit in the head by doorknobs, falling off of chairs trying to reach things that're now too high for them, getting all sorts of repetitive stress / back injuries, because of being forced into unhealthy postures, etc.

I think what'd really happen is that the various dystopian SR governments simply wouldn't give a shit about accomodating trolls (corporations certainly wouldn't, except for the odd troll that managed to make VP, or something, and scored his own bathroom) - after all, there's plenty of places in the world now where people with disabilities get the short end of the stick... why would it get any better when the corporations take over and everything is circling the drain?

Posted by: Kanada Ten Apr 27 2006, 07:59 PM

Don't forget extraterritorality. Corporations can claim (and manufacture studies which agree) that higher ceilings, especially in residential environments, cause depression and the like. It's segregation by nessecity. Trolls need to stay in reinforced buildings so they don't fall through the floor during a dance party. They need special clothing stores, special vehicles, and so on. There's no reason for them to mingle with normal workers since it creates tension and decreases productivity. There will be places sized for trolls, special places with little signs on the doors that say, "Troll Ready".

[e]Man, it took me forever to make that post and mm1 gets it in better, faster, harder, stronger...

Posted by: Birdy Apr 27 2006, 08:18 PM

There are some differences between the handicapped and the trolls:

+ Handicappeds have a "oh that poor guy/gal" factor, people in general feel sorry for them. Trolls have the "oh that monster" factor, people in general feel for their .50AE.

+ Re-Building a house for handicapped persons is only necessary if you serve them or you are an official institution. I.e if your clothing shop does not sell "trollware", you don't have to rebuild

+ Re-building a house for handicapped is adding some ramps (most relevant buildings are either one story or have lifts already). Re-Building for Trolls means "Tear down, build new". This includes major parts of the infrastructure (Subways, Trams, Road-Bridges due to higher trams....)

+ Don't know the US but in Germany you can get around re-building. Quite a few shops/pubs/cinemas are not handicapped-enabled

+ This is 2050+. Do-Gooders and Tree-Huggers are on the red list of dying species.

Posted by: fistandantilus3.0 Apr 29 2006, 05:05 AM

back on track for random trivia...

the average human skeleton wieghs 20 lbs.

Posted by: Pallantides Apr 29 2006, 01:25 PM

It's easy to underestimate the racism in Shadowrun society; I see very few corporations and private organizations redesigning their buildings just for dwarves and trolls, even if they are built only recently. Humanis has a lot of pull in the world.

A public facility on the other hand could be accomodating; I just don't think that they'd be very common.

Posted by: Shrike30 May 1 2006, 10:43 PM

Someone want to explain to me how you simultaneously redesign building specs to accomodate trolls AND dwarves?

Posted by: Kanada Ten May 1 2006, 10:58 PM

QUOTE (Shrike30)

Someone want to explain to me how you simultaneously redesign building specs to accomodate trolls AND dwarves?

Well, stairs are kinda easy, since you have to increase the depth of the stair for trolls, you can partition one edge (the inside edge) with triple steps inside the depth. Ramps might actually become standard instead. Obviously, elevators could have two panels. And urinals would all be ceramic to the floor up, ending around the average human head. Dwarves can use normal toilets, like children, though to save money - or if space permits only one toilet - the toilet seats could stagger in size allowing for multiple sizes (though few would be comfortable). Doorknobs would come off, and a press panel would replace them - in the few areas that access is more important than security - otherwise using RFID, voice control, etc. Dwarves and trolls have natural thermo, so lighting isn't a problem. Food service could use a Farris Wheel or screw style carousel. Generic stools would have some neat height control options and fold-out extending seat (like some tables, today)... Expensive.

Posted by: Fire Hawk May 1 2006, 11:00 PM

See my answer was going to be:

"With an Improbability Drive?"

Posted by: hyzmarca May 2 2006, 12:27 AM

QUOTE (Birdy)

+ This is 2050+. Do-Gooders and Tree-Huggers are on the red list of dying species.

There are still plenty of DoGooders and Tree-Huggers arund, its just that they're more likely to protest with trucks full of nitrocelulose and canisters of nerve gas than with picket signs.

Posted by: Birdy May 2 2006, 02:11 AM

QUOTE (hyzmarca)

QUOTE (Birdy @ Apr 27 2006, 03:18 PM)

+ This is 2050+. Do-Gooders and Tree-Huggers are on the red list of dying species.

There are still plenty of DoGooders and Tree-Huggers arund, its just that they're more likely to protest with trucks full of nitrocelulose and canisters of nerve gas than with picket signs.

But in the 2050's "He was a greenie" is finaly valid reason of self defence.

Makes SR kind of a positive Utopia.