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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ Ares Alpha and gas vents

Posted by: Silent Recoil May 4 2006, 03:57 AM

Is it possible to mount a gas vent system in the Alpha? According to the letter of the rules, it seems like it can:

Pg 308, the Ares Alpha states that it has a special chamber design that gives 2pts of recoil compensation.

Pg 311, Gas vent systems cannot be added to a weapon with built-in gas vent systems.

Pg 301-302, internal accessories do not take up a mount point.

What says everyone?

Posted by: HMHVV Hunter May 4 2006, 04:05 AM

QUOTE (Silent Recoil)

Pg 311, Gas vent systems cannot be added to a weapon with built-in gas vent systems.

Except that the 2 points of recoil compensation don't come from gas vents; they come from a chamber design. Therefore, Gas Vents are allowable.

Keep in mind I don't have SR4, but these are my thoughts.

Posted by: Squinky May 4 2006, 04:07 AM

I agree.

Posted by: Big D May 4 2006, 04:41 AM

That's the way that I read it, which gives the Alpha a distinct advantage over other ARs.

Or you can slap on a sound suppressor and a bipod instead, for long range stealthy covering fire.

Posted by: Glyph May 4 2006, 04:52 AM

Yes, the Ares Alpha gets two extra points of recoil compensation - it is intended to have an advantage over other assault rifles.

Posted by: Voran May 4 2006, 06:44 AM

I guess the balancing factor is that when you pull that out, you increase your chances of being focused on as a primary target. After the mage, of course.

Posted by: The Jopp May 4 2006, 07:34 AM

QUOTE (Voran)

I guess the balancing factor is that when you pull that out, you increase your chances of being focused on as a primary target. After the mage, of course.

Yup, you might become a target, hopefully they will remember to duck from the full auto storm of bullets heading their way before they try to shoot you though.

Posted by: Voran May 4 2006, 08:08 AM

Heh, or just send their drones at you

Posted by: TheOneRonin May 4 2006, 02:15 PM

QUOTE (Voran)

I guess the balancing factor is that when you pull that out, you increase your chances of being focused on as a primary target. After the mage, of course.

Not really. When you are under fire, you aren't going to care (or likely even notice) that one of your opponents has an Ares Alpha, while the rest have M-23s or Ingram Smartguns. Having the sec team focus fire on you just because you have an Alpha is poor form, and not even close to how such a team would react under fire. Having them focus on the 9' tall, 400kg troll, yes. Having them focus on the guy with light pouring from his eyes and fire engulfing his hands, yes. Having them pickout a target because it's got a different AR than the rest is bullshit at best, and a ruiner of "suspension of disbelife" at worst.

Posted by: Roadspike May 4 2006, 04:00 PM

If, of course, you drop two or three of their companions with well-aimed bursts, while the huge troll is vainly trying to break their ork friend and the glowy-handed freak is scattering spells across their mage's spell defense; well, then you stand a good chance of becoming target number one.

Posted by: TheOneRonin May 4 2006, 04:43 PM

Being an accurate shot and the only un-engaged target will make you a priority. Not the weapon you carry (in this particular case).

Posted by: ixombie May 4 2006, 08:21 PM

The way that the alpha is balanced as the very best AR is that it's harder to get, more expensive, and forbidden rather than just restricted so there's a stiffer penalty if you're caught with one. That said, the grenade launcher and extra recoil make any other rifle essentially worthless in comparison.

Posted by: emo samurai May 4 2006, 08:26 PM

Why geek the mage first? So he can kill you with one blast; so can a gun, with higher frequency.

Posted by: Thanee May 4 2006, 08:27 PM

The GL is actually why it's forbidden. Without that it would only be restricted.

Bye
Thanee

Posted by: Vaevictis May 4 2006, 08:42 PM

Actually security teams to have a good reason to geek the guy with the Alpha "sooner" rather than later -- the grenade launcher.

Anyone with a grenade launcher is pretty high up on my target priority list, and I expect the same goes for any SecForce you may run into.

Posted by: James McMurray May 4 2006, 09:27 PM

QUOTE (emo samurai)

Why geek the mage first? So he can kill you with one blast; so can a gun, with higher frequency.

Killing is one of the weaker things a mage can do to you. summon a high force spirit that's immune to your weapons is bad, and mind controlling people to start killing each other is also pretty scary.

Posted by: Big D May 5 2006, 12:51 AM

Yup... a mage can potentially dish the most out (especially with spirits or mind control) and take the least. That pretty much equates to highest-value target.

Plus, then your mage has a free shot with *his* mind control spells.

Posted by: Kyoto Kid May 5 2006, 03:23 AM

QUOTE (James McMurray)

....tell me about it. Especially getting the guards or grunts to shoot each other up. As GM, that one really chafes my hide.

I hate the idea of having to put a mage or two in nearly every encounter just to keep the PC mages from running amok on the poor mundanes.

Posted by: James McMurray May 5 2006, 03:32 AM

You could ban mind control. Other than that most of their combat tricks can be duplicated by mundanes, sometimes better, sometimes worse.

Posted by: Kyoto Kid May 5 2006, 03:43 AM

QUOTE (James McMurray)

You could ban mind control. Other than that most of their combat tricks can be duplicated by mundanes, sometimes better, sometimes worse.

I've been toying with doing that, not only with mind control but MindRape..er...Mindprobe as well.

Posted by: KB12 May 5 2006, 03:52 AM

I think that if the people realized that one of the runners had an AA that would give them a reason for them to shoot you over the guy with a less lethal gun. The problem is realizing this. I have a feeling that in most fast combat, especially when much of it may happen with poor vision, people will never realize what kind of guns people have.

Granted, if you start shooting off grenades, they'll probably shart shooting at you, but that's because you're launching grenades, I doubt it's because it occured to them you have an AA....

Posted by: James McMurray May 5 2006, 03:58 AM

I agree, in an otherwise balanced firefight, the guy with the scarier gun will become the primary target. Most firefights aren't balanced equally between the participants, and most security gaurds wouldn't have the perceptiona nd knowledge skills to recognize an alpha compared to an AK.

Posted by: Silent Recoil May 5 2006, 05:04 AM

Not to mention in a good firefight with cover on both sides, your going to take shots at whomever steps out from cover, regardless of the weapons involved. Why shoot at the guy with the AA behind the corner that you can't hit, when the dwarf with the Pred just stepped out from behind his tree?

Posted by: Kremlin KOA May 5 2006, 06:05 AM

Mind Probe + alter memory for Teh Win