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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ Evil overlording it over the peasants.
Posted by: emo samurai May 22 2006, 04:28 AM
One of the things about SR that I really like is its very nuanced portrayals of bureaucratic tyrannies and how to run them effectively. The corps aren't really held down by ideology when dealing with the SINless, so they have leeway to be really creative in keeping them from banding together and blowing up the Arc with black market explosives. Paying them to kill each other, providing the guns they do it with, flooding the market with whatever they want short of the necessities of life, etc. Circuses without the bread. Pretending not to be the government.
What other things have the writers at FanPro and Fasa taught you about burninating the peasants?
Posted by: Dog May 22 2006, 04:49 AM
One theme I see is that people (and organizations: corporations, etc.) are becoming concerned only with what sort of person they appear to be, and to hell with worrying about what sort of person they really are. This is an expansion of the "it isn't illegal if you don't get caught" thinking, and by and large, shadowrunners seem to be the exception. It's like law has somehow replaced integrity, and so those with integrity are outside the law. I don't know if that's what I gathered from the fiction, or if it's something I've interjected without realizing it.
Posted by: emo samurai May 22 2006, 05:02 AM
One thing I learned from 2XS is that corporations are in general really ambiguous.
Also, always have a dragon to slay. When you think about it, knights are defenders of an oppressive feudal society; they're rich at the expense of the peasants, violent at the drop of a hat, and have the right to kill commoners who insult them. And yet they are regarded as heroes. Why? Because they kill dragons and barbarians. The only difference between the ogre and the knight is that the knight gets the girl. So do your best to be the knight, a piece of advice Ares has taken well.
Posted by: hyzmarca May 22 2006, 08:02 AM
Getting the girl isn't always a good thing. I read a comic strip once in which a knight was trying to rescue a virgin princess from a dragon who had already eaten several virgin sacrifices. He attempts to distract the dragon with a whore while he rescues the princess. It works. Of course, he gets to marry the princess as the knight does at the end of such stories. But the princesses true personality soon becomes obvious and the knight is doomed to spend the rest of his life with someone he really hates. The dragon and the whore, on the other hand, live happily ever after. The dragon never bothers the kingdom again because he was just looking for some satisfaction.
I don't think that shadowrunners necessarilary have integrity. Most of them probably don't. There are just a few rules that you have to follow to stay alive. The first rule of being a runner is 'don't put yourself into a position where you are likely to be mortally wounded'. Most of what appears to be integrity falls under this rule. Don't betray your teammates becasue paranoid teammates will kill you if you do and ectcetera.
The thing about shadowrunners is that they are free. They can choose which jobs they do and if they can't then they've made a big mistake. No one else, except for the highest powerplayers (who are also the highest shadowplayers) is really free.
Some people on Dumpshock have stated that the famous decker Fastjack is Damien Knight. He certainly has the skills for it. He was one of the members of Ecco Mirage.
The current Empress of Japan did some shadow-work during her rebellious phase and she probably still has some contact with the AI Mirage. Lowfyr has been involved in some shadowruns. The Draco foundation controls Assets, Inc. and Ryan Mercury regulary plays with the nipples of a UCAS Vice President.
The lower echelons of shadowrunners do not have much of a life expectancy or much of a life. However, the line between the best and the brightest shadowrunners and the Sixth World's real political power is very thin. In some places, it doesn't exist at all. I see two reasons for this.
First of all, the people who write the novels and the metaplot books tend to think big. Big and epic adventures sell more, quite frankly.
The second reason is a bit more complex. Power is fleeting. Absolute power is the most fleeting. The more powerful one becomes the more difficult it is to hold onto that power. The powerful need to take certain personal risks to keep themselves afloat. They need to decieve their enemies. They need as much information as they can possibly get. They need to destroy those who wish to destroy them. Most importantly, they need people who aren't going to betray them to do this. To ensure their safety they either use a complex series of cut-outs and middle men who ultimatly prove untracable or they cultivate strong relationships within the shadow community. The latter is safer in the long run since any of the middle men can turn traitor.
Likewise, to actually obtain power you have to be willing to take risks and do some things that might not be legal. This itself usually involves shadow-work and those who are willing to run the shadows are likely to claw their ways past the privilaged but complacent if given the chance. And, of course, in the case of Lowfyr there are just some things that you have to do yourself when you are one of the most powerful magical beings on the planet.
Posted by: Dog May 22 2006, 02:42 PM
| QUOTE (hyzmarca) |
| I don't think that shadowrunners necessarilary have integrity.... |
Neither do I, but I was suggesting that many people with integrity become shadowrunners because they don't fit the system. And like I said, it's just a theme that I've noticed, not a rule.
Posted by: Wounded Ronin May 22 2006, 10:51 PM
Well, for me the overall SR world was more of an 80s pastiche and less of something that would be economically or politically viable. It's not to say that I totally disregarded economic or political viability but instead those things were just a bit less important with me.
Therefore, the oppressed masses are usually too stoopid to see what's going on and in terms of corporate control and environment I like to rip off incoherent bits of the novel The Running Man and Blade Runner and ninja movies.
Posted by: emo samurai May 23 2006, 12:45 AM
Did we ever find out who FastJack was? And would a technomancer be able to kick FastJack if she was submerged and had really high level complex forms?
Posted by: James McMurray May 23 2006, 01:00 AM
Fastjack in a game would either be a statless "this guy is an unstoppable badass" or a statted "this guy is a nigh unstoppable badass." If it's the latter then he could be beaten by somebody with high enough skills and gear, whether they're a technomancer or not. If it's the first then he's only beatable if the GM decides it would be beneficial to the game for him to be beaten.
Posted by: BookWyrm May 23 2006, 01:02 AM
Sometimes you have to compromise. Situations, people, your own morals.
What appears evil isn't necessarilly evil, except for toxic & insect shamans, toxic & insect spirits, and shedim.
The 'happy ending' (hero gets the girl, everyone gets paid, no-one dies, ect.) 98% happens ONLY in a trid-show.
Survive by being smarter than your opponents.
If you can't trust your team, don't 'run with them.
Don't trust Mr./Ms. Johnson as far as you could physically pick said person up & throw them.
Do the job right, or don't 'run.
Posted by: Dawnshadow May 23 2006, 01:07 AM
| QUOTE (BookWyrm) |
| Don't trust Mr./Ms. Johnson as far as you could physically pick said person up & throw them. |
Don't trust Mr/Ms Johnson as far as you could toss a Great Western Dragon. Remember, those trolls are strong.
Posted by: mfb May 23 2006, 01:11 AM
| QUOTE (BookWyrm) |
| What appears evil isn't necessarilly evil |
fixed!
Posted by: Voran May 23 2006, 01:26 AM
Fastjack mentions in the SR4 prologue that people think he was invovled with Echo Mirage, but he claims he wasn't. How much you can trust him on that, its unclear. Heh what is clear is that he's like 71 years old (if he was telling the truth of his birthdate) and he still would knock the crap outta the 'hot new things' in 2070.
It's not reflected so much in the material directly, but in my own experiences playing runners, I find it hard NOT to end up 'the man' as you get more powerful/wealthy/influential. In games where I've ended character runs due to changes in edition, length of time, whatever, they've usually ended up high up in the fixer/johnson kinda role. It seems like a natural, logical progression as you've spent your time gaining contacts, rep, cash, etc.
Posted by: Smilin_Jack May 23 2006, 01:50 AM
| QUOTE (mfb) | ||
fixed! |
Fixed
Posted by: SL James May 23 2006, 02:03 AM
| QUOTE (BookWyrm @ May 22 2006, 07:02 PM) |
| What appears evil isn't |
Now, it's fixed.
| QUOTE |
| Don't trust Mr./Ms. Johnson as far as you could physically pick said person up & throw them. |
So, basically what you're saying is that the only people who could trust a Johnson are probably stupid enough to do so anyway, being trolls and all.
Posted by: FanGirl May 23 2006, 02:24 AM
| QUOTE (emo samurai) |
| Did we ever find out who FastJack was? And would a technomancer be able to kick FastJack if she was submerged and had really high level complex forms? |
The only problem with this is that FanGirl has no intention of kicking FastJack. If she ever gets to meet FastJack, she'll live up to her name by letting out a brief squeal of joy and then bombarding him with a great many breathless adulations ("OMG, you're so awesome!") until he takes his leave. Glomphing (or attempted glomphing) might or might not be involved.
Posted by: Wounded Ronin May 23 2006, 02:34 AM
| QUOTE (FanGirl) | ||
The only problem with this is that FanGirl has no intention of kicking FastJack. If she ever gets to meet FastJack, she'll live up to her name by letting out a brief squeal of joy and then bombarding him with a great many breathless adulations ("OMG, you're so awesome!") until he takes his leave. Glomphing (or attempted glomphing) might or might not be involved. |
You mean you'd hack all his favorite websites to redirect to your AOL site complete with floating pastel hearts and too many animated .GIFs? You MONSTER!
Posted by: FanGirl May 23 2006, 02:42 AM
| QUOTE (Wounded Ronin @ May 22 2006, 09:34 PM) |
| You mean you'd hack all his favorite websites to redirect to your AOL site complete with floating pastel hearts and too many animated .GIFs? You MONSTER! |
You don't know what glomphing is, do you? If you don't, http://www.instantattitudes.com/shirts/t018artbig.jpg.
Posted by: Wounded Ronin May 23 2006, 02:55 AM
| QUOTE (FanGirl) | ||
You don't know what glomphing is, do you? If you don't, http://www.instantattitudes.com/shirts/t018artbig.jpg. |
Well, I figured a redirect to an AOL homepage would be the on-line equivalent of that.
Posted by: Kanada Ten May 23 2006, 02:58 AM
| QUOTE (Wounded Ronin) | ||||
Well, I figured a redirect to an AOL homepage would be the on-line equivalent of that. |
Not when simsense is the medium.
Posted by: emo samurai May 23 2006, 03:08 AM
Dude, his icon's a blurry man who you can't focus on. I'm not sure you can hug it.
Posted by: FanGirl May 23 2006, 03:09 AM
When I glomph FastJack, rest assured that he'll be able to revel in every bone that snaps within his chest, every cubic millimeter of air that is forced from his lungs, every reverberation of exquisite pain that he sustains from the force of my obsessive ardor. 
EDIT:
| QUOTE (emo samurai) |
| Dude, his icon's a blurry man who you can't focus on. I'm not sure you can hug it. |
Not among those whom he considers to be his friends.
Posted by: Wounded Ronin May 23 2006, 03:14 AM
| QUOTE (emo samurai) |
| Dude, his icon's a blurry man who you can't focus on. I'm not sure you can hug it. |
Lol, he's a Displacer Beast.
Posted by: emo samurai May 23 2006, 03:48 AM
Dude, you solved the riddle of the ages.
Posted by: mfb May 23 2006, 03:52 AM
| QUOTE (FanGirl) |
| Not among those whom he considers to be his friends. |
as of when?
Posted by: Wounded Ronin May 23 2006, 03:56 AM
| QUOTE (emo samurai) |
| Dude, you solved the riddle of the ages. |
This thread should cut to a scene of Fastjack the displacer beast sitting like a dog while wearing a pair of boxer shorts with several doggie bowls filled with mountain dew scattered around him. He's got a cyberdeck plugged into his blurry ole head and is executing a DOS attack to bring down DSF before the truth gets out.
Posted by: mfb May 23 2006, 04:00 AM
boxer shorts? dude, Fastjack invented decking naked.
Posted by: Wounded Ronin May 23 2006, 04:06 AM
Ooooh, so that's why it's Fastjack...
Posted by: FanGirl May 23 2006, 05:16 AM
| QUOTE (mfb @ May 22 2006, 10:52 PM) | ||
as of when? |
According to the Sixth World Wiki, FastJack "is also known to have another icon among those he considers as friends, a bland, but hyperrealistic, brown-haired, brown-eyed Caucasian male wearing a leather jacket and jeans" (http://wiki.dumpshock.com/index.php/FastJack).
Sounds glompable to me.
Posted by: mfb May 23 2006, 05:44 AM
oh yeah, forgot about that. regardless, i'm not sure how well that'd work in the Matrix.
Posted by: emo samurai May 23 2006, 05:45 AM
You could modify blackhammer to simulate getting crushed to death; that'd be basically the same thing, simsense-wise.
Posted by: mfb May 23 2006, 06:45 AM
and then defeat Fastjack in Matrix combat.
my god, i'm arguing about the canonocity of glomphing Fastjack. what the hell?
Posted by: FanGirl May 23 2006, 06:47 AM
Or I could just ask him nicely to hold still....
"Considering all the people who want to geek you, I'd think that someone who wants to glomp you would be a welcome change!"
Posted by: Wounded Ronin May 23 2006, 09:11 PM
| QUOTE (FanGirl) | ||||
According to the Sixth World Wiki, FastJack "is also known to have another icon among those he considers as friends, a bland, but hyperrealistic, brown-haired, brown-eyed Caucasian male wearing a leather jacket and jeans" (http://wiki.dumpshock.com/index.php/FastJack). Sounds glompable to me. |
So in other words he looks like a hero out of an 80s movie sporting the combat-proof jeans and leather jacket combination. (See American Ninja).
Posted by: emo samurai May 23 2006, 09:17 PM
So FastJack is Michael Dudikoff! Holy shit!!!
And his nemesis would be Sho Kosugi!
Posted by: Wounded Ronin May 23 2006, 09:22 PM
| QUOTE (emo samurai) |
| So FastJack is Michael Dudikoff! Holy shit!!! And his nemesis would be Sho Kosugi! |
I believe his enemy would in fact be Tadashi Yamashita, but I suppose I'll have to double check on that to be totally sure.
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