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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ Why would anyone have a Homunculus Ally Spirit

Posted by: BigKnockers Oct 13 2003, 10:59 AM

Don't get me wrong, I really like the sounds of it, but it seems like a lot of extra trouble (ie Making the focus) for nothing more than a big limitation (Physical World only)

Posted by: wienerwürstchen Oct 13 2003, 11:08 AM

a Iron Homunculus das 8 points dual armor - not bad at all

Posted by: BigKnockers Oct 13 2003, 12:42 PM

But it's slow and dual natured. Also, a normal Spirity Ally would have immunity to normal weapons when it's manifested.

Posted by: Lantzer Oct 13 2003, 02:33 PM

Does it hinder the homunculous? Hell yes.

That's the point. It's to keep the thing under control. Allies have this chance of going free just when you need them most (you've just been KO'd). It's less likely to just run off to the metaplanes without you.

Think of how some mages treat their allies. Do you think the thing _wants_ to hang around?

(Also, golems are just cool.)

Posted by: Pistons Oct 13 2003, 02:52 PM

You could file it under "flavor," but the Jewish qabbalistic tradition would most likely only use homunculi as ally spirits. So, if you were to play a Qabbalist, you'd be playing true to the character to use a homunculus.

Posted by: GunnerJ Oct 13 2003, 03:23 PM

Investing an ally spirit in a sword is pretty damn cool.

Posted by: Bearclaw Oct 13 2003, 03:26 PM

A spirit with the drain essence ability, and you could call it Stormbringer

Posted by: Stormdrake Oct 13 2003, 03:47 PM

What would putting a Ally Spirit in a sword do to the swords damage ability? Could a mage create such a weapon and then give it to a phyad?

Posted by: BigKnockers Oct 13 2003, 03:51 PM

He could, but it wouldn't make it a better sword.

See I have a huge visualisation problem with a homunculus sword of it crawling across the floor like caterpillar. Thats not glamorous at all, although it may make your enemies laugh themselves to death

Posted by: Stormdrake Oct 13 2003, 09:19 PM

What about making the sword a weapon focus? Could you even do that? I know entering the realm of D&D but players will ask this.

Posted by: snowRaven Oct 13 2003, 09:43 PM

Yes, you can make the sword a weapon focus - just as you'd made any type of stacked focus. Since the homunculus part of it is actually a focus, you you can stack any other type of focus with it. Now, if it's worth it is another story...

Posted by: Cain Oct 14 2003, 01:07 AM

Evil GM thought here... is there anything preventing an Imp from posessing an Inhabiting focus? I'm thinking more what happens if someone tries to summon an ally into the focus and fails... the focus is Inhabited by something, but would the mage know that he got an Imp instead of his ally?

Posted by: Kanada Ten Oct 14 2003, 01:31 AM

QUOTE

is there anything preventing an Imp from posessing an Inhabiting focus?

No... <chuckling madly>

QUOTE

I'm thinking more what happens if someone tries to summon an ally into the focus and fails... the focus is Inhabited by something, but would the mage know that he got an Imp instead of his ally?

The summoner would know he or she got something else, but not what (it wouldn't feel like an Ally or have the same powers)...

Also, can Imps possess a focus that is currently bonded, or do they require an open focus?

I like this idea though...

Posted by: Cain Oct 14 2003, 04:47 AM

Well, here's the thing... if the summoner tried and failed to summon an aly, would he realize that he got an Imp, or would he think that his Ally went free? Or would there just be no way of telling, and it all comes down to Perception?

Posted by: Kanada Ten Oct 14 2003, 05:00 AM

QUOTE

Cain
Well, here's the thing... if the summoner tried and failed to summon an aly, would he realize that he got an Imp, or would he think that his Ally went free? Or would there just be no way of telling, and it all comes down to Perception?

Humm... Wouldn't the summoner retain their magic point if the summoning failed? I would think that would be a dead give-away to the Ally's failed creation. But since the summoner remains bound to the focus, he or she would already be under the sway of the Imp...

Either way, he or she would know that an Ally didn't Inhabit the homunculus because the astral imprint wouldn't match... unless the Imp used its Aura Masking to appear as an Ally (I have no idea if they can, but unique powers are not unheard of). I guess it all comes down to Perception after all.

Usually, Imps hide inside a focus but don't prevent normal function... What if the Summoner succeeded in summoning the Ally and got an Imp as well? Just a thought.

The Imp itself may want the focus to have movement powers, or other abilities... perhaps forcing the summoner it conjure another being into it (offering a metamagic in the process)?

Posted by: snowRaven Oct 14 2003, 06:38 AM

An Imp can occupy a focus whether it's bonded or not - it's just easier for it to occupy an unbonded focus.

Considering the control an Imp has over the foci it inhabits, could it also control the ally spirit? And here's an interesting idea - "Imps can also impede the use of a focus, temporarily reducing the focus' Force by the imp's Force rating [...] If a sustaining focus is reduced in this manner, any spell it is maintaining is also immediately reduced in Force." Would this apply to the Ally spirit as well? A temporary decrease in Force because the homunculus focus can't sustain an ally spirit of higher force than it's rating. If so, this would ve a very good blackmailing technique on the imp's part...

Posted by: Herald of Verjigorm Oct 14 2003, 07:39 AM

You must consider what happens to the reduced force of the spell, is it destroyed in an odd way, or harmlessly dissipated into the astral.

If your game chooses the first option, a homunculus whose force is reduced while a spirit is within it (semi)permanently reduces the spirit's force.
If your game chooses the second option, then the two most sensible results are: the spirit is ejected and takes a (force difference)D wound resisted by force; or the spirit is split into one portion in the homunculus and another out of it. You could reconcile both by giving the spirit a chance to exit the homunculus to avoid being severed.

There is precedent for what happens when a free spirit is severed (neither portion is subject to the True Name of the whole, and both are free), but what happens when a fully bound spirit is severed is debateable.

Posted by: Friggas Ring Oct 14 2003, 04:28 PM

What do you supopse would happen if a mage had a full cyber-body built. All cyberware, so to speak, and had an ally inhabit it. Would it make a faux-person? It'd be cheesy, and only some of the cyberware, if any, would work, but it might be useful.

Posted by: snowRaven Oct 14 2003, 08:28 PM

Unless I am mistaken (which I might be...) there are instances where spirits can temporarily have their force reduced.