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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ Toto

Posted by: Tomothy Feb 22 2007, 02:42 PM

I haven't played Shadowrun before, this is one of my first attempts at a character. I haven't written out the whole lot, just the min-max side. I was wondering what anyone thought?

Toto
Class - Physical Adept
Race - Troll
Stats - B9 A4(5) R5(7) S9
Skills - Blades (Axe) 6(+2)
Qualities - Adept, Mentor Spirit (Bear), Toughness
Gear - Force Focus Combat Axe (Rating 6), Full Body Armour (w/Helmet)
Powers - Improved Agility (1), Improved Reflexes (2), Mystic Armour (4)

Notes:
+1 Natural Armour
+4 Mystic Armour
+3 Dice for resisting Physical Damage

He should be a meat-axe in close combat. I don't think he'd be super hard to shoot, but hopefully he'll soak up all the damage with armour and damage resistance. Plus he'll have guns of his own too so y'know he'll be shooting back and stuff.

Edit: Oops, Bear Totem is only available to Mystic Adepts.. Well I guess I could make him a mystic adept...

Posted by: toturi Feb 22 2007, 03:23 PM

QUOTE (Tomothy)

There is no class. This is not "the game that shalt not be mentioned".

Posted by: psykotisk_overlegen Feb 22 2007, 03:46 PM

QUOTE (toturi)

QUOTE (Tomothy @ Feb 22 2007, 10:42 PM)

There is no class. This is not "the game that shalt not be mentioned".

Ppht, My Sr characters have loads of class.

Posted by: toturi Feb 22 2007, 03:53 PM

Touche.

Posted by: toturi Feb 22 2007, 03:55 PM

Double post

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Feb 22 2007, 04:10 PM

...Availability only allows for a maximum force rating of 2 for a Weapon Focus at chargen (x5 avail per rating).

Full Body Armour is also above the availability cap ( I believe avail. 14).

Even with standard Jacket/Helmet combination and his Toughness quality he will be a tank (15 B / 13 I) I am not sure where he gets the additional + 3 dice for resisting damage (Adept Power?).

To really make him rude, I would suggest taking the Increased Pain Tolerance quality. this shifts the negative modifiers up on the condition monitor by one damage box per level so at rating 3 he would not take a -1 modifier to skill tests/initiative until he took 7 boxes of damage on both the stun or physical tracks.

With his weapon focus (at force 2) he has a total DP of 19 (including reach). Pretty respectable for a starting character. His real threat is in the damage he will dish out with a starting DV of 7 (don't remember if the Axe has a -1 or -2 AP).

Since he's a Troll I would suggest taking skill in Bow weapons for a ranged weapon.

Posted by: Unarmed Feb 22 2007, 05:15 PM

Aww man, I thought this post was going to be about the band toto.

Also, shouldn't a character's class be determined by their lifestyle? You know, upper class, bourgeoise, etc.

Posted by: lorechaser Feb 22 2007, 05:49 PM

QUOTE (Tomothy @ Feb 22 2007, 08:42 AM)

He hears the rain down in Aaaaaaaafricaaaaaaa.....

If you want to be really twinking, don't take Improved Agility. Either go with Ability Boost (Agility), or pickup Muscle Toner 2. It costs the same point of magic (via essence loss), but gets you +2 agi, and still leaves you at 5.4 essence.

That's another .4 of bioware, .7 of cyberwear, or a combination of both.

For a tank, I'd highly recommend picking up Platelet Factories (.2 essence, leaving you at 5.4) to soak damage, and then either Damage Compensator (4) to ignore 4 boxes of damage penalties, Orthoskin 2 (.2 ess) to get 2 more boxes of armor, or Muscle Toner 2. If you make all of them alphaware, you can get Muscle Toner 2, Platelet Factories, Muscle Augmentation 2, and either Orthoskin 1 (+1 armor), Damage Compensators 2 or a reflex recorder (axe) and damage compensators 1, or skillwires 2, if you want to be able to add some flexibility.

You will spend a chunk of BPs doing it that way, but you get a much better return on it.

Posted by: thewolf Feb 22 2007, 06:28 PM

Yeah, Adept + Bioware = Maximal Twinkification

Attributes
B: 8
A: 4(5)
R: 3(4)
S: 7(9)

Qualities
Adept
High Pain Tolerance III

Cyberware
Plastic Bone Lacing, Alpha

Bioware
Muscle Aug II
Muscle Toner I
Platelet Factories

Adept Powers
Improved Reflexes I
Combat Sense (3)
Critical Strike (2)

For defense you roll: Reaction 4 + Combat Sense 3 + (optional Dodge) = 7 dice
For damage soaking you roll: Body 8 + Armor 8 + Bone Lacing 1 = 17 dice
Unarmed Combat base damage: 8P ouch!

I think your average security guard could empty his light pistol into him to no effect.

Posted by: Moon-Hawk Feb 22 2007, 06:28 PM

QUOTE (Unarmed)

Aww man, I thought this post was going to be about the band toto.

QUOTE (lorechaser)

He hears the rain down in Aaaaaaaafricaaaaaaa.....

Oh good, I was afraid it was just me.

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Feb 22 2007, 06:43 PM

QUOTE (Thewolf)

Unarmed Combat base damage: 8P ouch!

...I know, Hurricane Hannah has a base 8DV punch with Killing hands. If she rolls good on her her Boosted Strength power, it can go as high as 9 or 10DV (and that is for a human).

Add Penetrating Strike to this and an unarmed combat adept becomes real scary.

Posted by: ShadowDragon Feb 22 2007, 06:54 PM

You're missing mental and special stats. Intuition, Logic, Charisma, Willpower, Edge, and Magic. I'd also take more skills to make him well rounded. Shadowrun isn't just about combat (in fact in my games, most of the time if you get into combat you've done something wrong). You should at least be competent with some time of firearm. Melee weapons, while they have style, just aren't as effective as guns in most situations.

You don't want to make him a mystic adept. They're really tough to make effective characters with. You'd be better off sticking with adept and taking extra ranks in mystic armor, attribute boost, or even sacrificing some essence and magic for cyber/bio if you want those extra damage soaking dice.

Posted by: Butterblume Feb 22 2007, 07:01 PM

My mundane dwarf also had 8P melee damage (strength 7(9) and bone density 4).

This post is just an excuse to tell the world, I have to find my toto cd (dune soundtrack).

In addition to what Shadowdragon said, perception is a really important skill, which beginners often neglect.

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Feb 22 2007, 09:26 PM

QUOTE (ShadowDragon)

You should at least be competent with some time of firearm. Melee weapons, while they have style, just aren't as effective as guns in most situations.

...being a Troll with a high strength, Bows or even Thrown Weapons would be just as good as a firearm.

QUOTE (ShadowDragon)

You don't want to make him a mystic adept. They're really tough to make effective characters with. You'd be better off sticking with adept and taking extra ranks in mystic armor, attribute boost...

...agreed, I have one player with a mystic adept and he does well only because of his experience running spellcasters and the tradition he chose. Since they must split their MA between spellcasting and adept powers they fall short in both categories. Also, they cannot astrally perceive (without buying the adept power at 1 PP) or project which are two essential abilities for an effective spellcaster/summoner. If you cannot perceive, you cannot use assensing which is a skill that comes in awfully handy.

QUOTE (Butterblume)

In addition to what Shadowdragon said, perception is a really important skill, which beginners often neglect.

...all too true. I always make sure to have a couple of BPs available for Perception. This skill has saved my characters' lives several times over.

Posted by: lorechaser Feb 22 2007, 09:39 PM

QUOTE (Kyoto Kid)

QUOTE (ShadowDragon)

You should at least be competent with some time of firearm. Melee weapons, while they have style, just aren't as effective as guns in most situations.

...being a Troll with a high strength, Bows or even Thrown Weapons would be just as good as a firearm.

All you'd need is Thrown Weapon (Knives) 1 (3) to roll 8 dice, which is fine. Or Pistols (Semi-Automatic) 1 (3)

QUOTE (Kyoto Kid)

I've found the only effective mystic adept is the one that's built not to be a spellcaster at all, or to really be an adept. Building an MA with the idea of casting a few specific, low hit spells (1 magic allowing overcasting to force 2 is enough for a few things, like levitate, mana static, etc) and possibly summoning a minor force 2 spirit can work. Then you pick adept powers to supplement your primary focus (gunslinging, coding, or stealth are all good - 3-4 points in those goes a long way).

You can get 8 dice to roll pretty easily with a spellcasting focus 1, a mentor spirit, and a specialization, for relatively low bp (10 for skills + 5 for spirit + focus).

Posted by: fool Feb 22 2007, 09:39 PM

rrufff rufff grrrrrr.

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Feb 22 2007, 09:44 PM

...down, mon cherie, down...

Just an observation. that's all.

Posted by: Sir_Psycho Feb 22 2007, 10:05 PM

Take some general points in throwing weapons, so you can kill people with bricks AND throw grenades when you need to.

Posted by: Glyph Feb 23 2007, 06:41 AM

The trouble with only seeing the "max" part is that we don't see how much you may have sacrificed in other areas for it. If you had the whole build, you would be able to get more comprehensive advice such as "You need a higher Edge" or "You can use gymnastics to dodge". But looking at what's there:

Stats-
Your relevant stats are high, as they should be. But that leaves only 50 points, max, to spend on your four mental stats. If you think you can get by, starting with low mental stats in your game, then that's not bad. Low stats are cheaper to raise later. But if you need to scrounge more points for them, then lower Strength to 7 (which only reduces your base damage by 1).

Skills-
There's no penalty for maxing out one skill, so getting it at 6 is good. The specialization is also good. But a combat axe may or may not be that practical, depending on your campaign. If your GM looks at enforcement zones and concealability, then your troll could get into trouble if he tries walking around an upscale residential neighborhood with a bulky axe poorly hidden under his jacket.

Qualities-
It's not worth taking the mystic adept quality just to get a mentor spirit bonus, since you need to spend at least one point of Magic on your Magician side. Toughness is also another quality that really isn't worth the 10 points, not for a piddling one-die bonus solely for damage resistance.

Gear-
Problems with availabilty have been pointed out. The best you can do is a Rating: 2 Weapon Focus for the weapon, and an armor jacket and helmet for armor. But you can pimp out that armored jacket with some (or all ) of the armor modifications, so that you are more resistant to fire, acid, electricity, etc.

Powers-
Improved Reflexes: 2 is almost a given for most combat builds. Mystic Armor: 4 is also good. Improved Agility: 1 is weak for what you're spending on it, though. I would get an Essense point's worth of bioware instead, or a mix of cyberware and bioware. One of the many possible options: muscle augmentation: 2, muscle toner: 2, and a platelet factory. This gives you +2 to Agility and Strength, as well as damage reduction.

Posted by: Tomothy Feb 23 2007, 11:36 PM

Thanks for the comments. I guess I will get rid of the Full Armour and get a Force 2 Weapon Focus. With the left over points I can get some bioware to replace the Improved Agility. For the essence cost I was thinking I would go with Muscle Toner (2) and Bone Density Augmentation (2). I might also replace two levels of Mystic Armour with Orthoskin (2), Enhanced Articulation and Platelet Factories if I have the nuyen.

This is what his full list looked like when I made my first post:

RACE: TROLL (40 BP)

ATTRIBUTES (265 BP)
B9 A4(5) R5(7) S9 C2 I3 L1 W3 M6 E1

Essence: 6
Initiative: 8 (10)
Initiative Passes: 1 (3)
Physical Damage Track: 13
Stun Damage Track: 10

ACTIVE SKILLS (74 BP)

Blades (Axe): 6 (2)
Dodge (Ranged Combat): 1 (+2)
Etiquette (Street): 1 (+2)
Intimidation (Physical): 2 (+2)
Pistols (Semi-Automatics): 4 (+2)
Throwing Weapons (Grenades): 1 (+2)
Unarmed Combat (Brawling): 1 (+2)

KNOWLEDGE SKILLS (15 FREE BP)
Gang Turf (Trog): 2 (+2)
Gladiator Picks: 2
Local Crime Syndicates: 3
Local Safe Houses: 2
Underworld Politics: 2

LANGUAGE SKILLS

Or’zet: N
English (Street): 3 (+2)

QUALITIES (+15 BP)
Adept: 5
Mentor Spirit (Bear): 5
Toughness: 10
Allergy (Moderate, Seawater): +10
Sensitive System: +15
Spirit Bane (Water): +10

ADEPT POWERS
(6 POWER POINTS FROM MAGIC)
Improved Agility 1: 1
Improved Reflexes 2: 3
Mystic Armour 4: 2

GEAR & LIFESTYLE (85,000¥) (17+6 BP)
Weapon Focus – Combat Axe (Force 6); Survival Knife; Ares Predator (w/Quick-Draw Holster, Silencer, 6 clips of Regular Ammo); Armour Clothing; Armour Jacket; Full Body Armour (w/Helmet); Meta Link Commlink (w/Vector Xim); AR Gloves; Subvocal Microphone; Contacts (w/Image Link and Smartlink); Earbuds; Flashlight; Fake SIN (Rating 4); Fake Gun License (Rating 4); DocWagon Basic (1 Year); Low Lifestyle (1 Month).

CONTACTS (9 BP)
Sharky – Fixer (Connection 3/Loyalty 1)
Titan – Mean-Tusk Gang Leader (Connection 3/Loyalty 2)

NOTES
Starting Nuyen: 3D6+2 x 50¥
Natural Thermographic Vision
+1 Reach
+1 Natural Armour
+4 Mystic Armour
+3 Dice for resisting Physical damage

Edit: The +3 dice for resisting physical damage came from the Bear Totem (which I can't actually use) and the Toughness Quality.