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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ The Shadowrun FPS
Posted by: lorechaser Feb 27 2007, 04:50 PM
http://xbox360.gamespy.com/xbox-360/shadowrun/767656p1.html
A new preview of the game. The art is apparently very much improved now, and the game still sounds good to me (I know, I'm the minority).
But a couple lines that I found very interesting:
Mitch went on to address criticisms about the choice of genre for the game. "Shadowrun started as a pen and paper RPG. I was a big fan, I even wrote [for Shadowrun]. What most people don't realize was that it was also a boardgame, a collectible card game, even an action figure game. Not much story or RPG there. Now it's an FPS. It's like, 'What's the big deal?'"
Elves have a large magic gauge and incredible speed but are paper-thin. Dwarves can drain magic power from other players and objects, but are more limited in their abilities. Trolls have a unique defense ability and super-strength, but are as slow as molasses and deficient in magic. Finally, humans are the typical well-balanced type that doesn't really have any noteworthy strengths or weaknesses. A player can also augment their character (and perhaps make up for deficiencies innate to their class) through purchasable spells and tech upgrades. However, when you install tech on your character, it leaves you with less room for magic power, and vice-versa.
Posted by: Fragmintz Feb 27 2007, 05:38 PM
Lore - I am with you in support of the FPS. I will admit that I am a new SR PnP player, but I also love FPS action. To me, I see it as a blend of two great things - kind of like taking oreos and putting them in ice cream. In any case, I can't wait for the game to come out and can see myself playing this one a lot.
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Feb 27 2007, 06:07 PM
I don't have a problem with FPS games, per se. I have a problem with using Shadowrun as a source when all the huge amount of background material is going to be used for is as justification for the one or two slight tweaks they're implementing from unreal/doom/farcry/etc.
As to the, "Shadowrun hasn't always been a PRG" argument, see that thing, waving in the breeze up there? That's the bullshit flag. While the statement may be technically true, the "big deal" is that for a lot of folks, this will be the first time they encounter shadowrun, and it would be nice if they got more of an idea of what the game is actually like, as opposed to a shooter that will probably be popular for maybe 6 months, tops.
It's great that the game inspired Fragmintz to come check out the game and Dumpshock, and as much as I would love for his experience to be the rule, I have a sneaking suspicion that it will be the exception instead.
Posted by: James McMurray Feb 27 2007, 06:14 PM
I wonder how many people play their PnP games like shooters.
Posted by: Kagetenshi Feb 27 2007, 06:25 PM
Not many—the lag is atrocious, and clipping can be a big problem on some servers.
~J
Posted by: Herald of Verjigorm Feb 27 2007, 07:19 PM
| QUOTE (Crakkerjakk) |
| As to the, "Shadowrun hasn't always been a PRG" argument, |
That's not what he said. The argument was "Shadowrun hasn't only been a RPG"
Posted by: nezumi Feb 27 2007, 08:27 PM
Regardless, the statement is almost irrelevant. If you visit the Shadowrun forums, very few people are complaining that the game isn't an RPG. Overall, the single most common complaint is that it simply isn't Shadowrun. In Shadowrun, elves don't regenerate, dwarves don't 'eat' magic, cyberware uses essence whether it's turned on or off, and the 'resurrection' spell is restricted to Karl Kombatmage.
Should you want to argue that the game should be an RPG, the initial statement still doesn't stand. Yes, Shadowrun has been a card game, a collectibles game and a tactical table game. However, of all those games, which continues selling almost twenty years later? It seems to me that if you're trying to successfully use a franchise, it would be in your best interest to use what made the franchise succeed and, if possible, avoid the avenues in which the franchise failed. Just a thought...
Posted by: 2bit Feb 27 2007, 08:52 PM
still no dwarf screenies... 
Posted by: PBTHHHHT Feb 27 2007, 09:06 PM
| QUOTE (nezumi) |
| and the 'resurrection' spell is restricted to Karl Kombatmage. |
Maybe it's not resurrection but a treat spell and they're sustaining and bringing the character back from unconciousness... yeah... that's what I hope they actually mean. The other stuff... wtf?!
Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Feb 27 2007, 09:16 PM
| QUOTE (Kagetenshi) |
| Not many—the lag is atrocious, and clipping can be a big problem on some servers. ~J |
Not to mention the teamstacking is ridiculous.
Posted by: hyzmarca Feb 27 2007, 09:54 PM
A Shadowrun FPS made by people who want to be true to Shadowrun would be great. Unfortunatly, this is not the case and they've failed to implement many of the mechanics that make Shadowrun unique.
Decking/Hacking? No.
Astral Space? No.
Drain? No.
It would not be trivial to implement these things, but it would not be difficult, either. FPS games already have everything necessary to do Astral Space well. All you have to do is combine invisibility and a visual filter with toggling off collision detection and increasing a movement multiplier.
Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Feb 27 2007, 10:13 PM
Hacking's not impossible, either. Just look at the Half-Life 2 mod Dystopia, which is so much drawn from Shadowruns that they call them Cyberdecks. 
What they do for Dystopia hacking is they just build a "Cyber world" somewhere off the "meat world" normal plane, give it it's own rules of physics (possibly governed by the specific unit type, which is a hacker-body), and when you "use" a cyberterminal, you spawn a hacker-body in the cyber-world and take control of it, but the game still tracks your meatbod's status.
Posted by: Homme-qui-rigole Feb 27 2007, 11:34 PM
| QUOTE (lorechaser) |
| A new preview of the game. The art is apparently very much improved now, and the game still sounds good to me (I know, I'm the minority). |
What's improved? That?
http://media.xbox360.gamespy.com/media/760/760844/img_4351501.html
Don't forget to talk about this really cannon tech:
http://shadowrun.com/gameguides/tech/antimagic.htm
This one seem really cool; I want one in my garden:
http://shadowrun.com/gameguides/magic/treeoflife.htm
This one make my day:
| QUOTE |
| http://shadowrun.com/gameguides/races/Human.htm |
Posted by: James McMurray Feb 28 2007, 12:22 AM
| QUOTE (ShadowDragon8685) |
| Hacking's not impossible, either. Just look at the Half-Life 2 mod Dystopia, which is so much drawn from Shadowruns that they call them Cyberdecks. |
Hacking would be tough to implement in an FPS though. In a game all about blowing people up, being able to sleaze your way through the information superhighway isn't a very useful skill. And it's far from trivial to change game design to make it a valuable addition.
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Feb 28 2007, 02:35 AM
It's possible. Think Thief. But I'm fairly certain it ain't gonna happen in any form. Near as I can tell, the game has no reason to be called Shadowrun. You could say that the trolls are alien monsters, and that the elves are gray skinned psionicists, etc, etc with all the other nifty tricks they are including in the game, to make the game mechanically the same. I see nothing Shadowrun-esque about the game. Granted, it's not out yet. If someone I know happens to own it, I will try it out and hope that I'm wrong about how shallow the influence of the Sixth World is gonna be. But I really don't expect to be wrong. I mean, rezzing teamates and gliding? So what? There's nothing innovative, hell, Prey had a better thing going for it with the whole portal thing, and after playing the demo of that I was unimpressed. I would really like to be wrong, because a great Shadowrun game would bring players in droves, and that is a Good Thing. However, I'm betting it's going to be a mediocre success at best, and is far more likely to barely break even. And the worst part is, because of that failure, no one is going to want to make a shadowrun RPG, MMO, or hell, even an adventure game or RTS. Even if it does somehow succeed, it's just going to result in a similar, banal, sequel FPS, because the game industry don't fix what ain't broke.
Bleah. My complaint with the Shadowrun game is that it could have been so much more. It's like buying the Alien's vs. Predator license and making a rhythm based DDR style game out of it. It's a poor fit, and only includes one tiny sliver of the world that is Shadowrun, and even then, not anywhere near a faithful sliver.
Posted by: Sahandrian Feb 28 2007, 02:43 AM
Perfect Dark on the Nintendo 64 did include that "Hacker Central" scenario. It was a multiplayer scenario with the basic play:
1. Find the data reader
2. Find the terminal
3. Survive for 60 seconds as the reader copies from the terminal
So just a more-complicated CtF, really. But there could be other uses for hacking/decking in FPSes. Imagine a stage with mounted cameras (like in Goldeneye), or card-key doors. The hacker could take over the cameras and use them for recon, or remotely unlock doors for his teammates without them having to find a key - some may not even have normal keys. And what if they could commandeer weapon emplacements? Or control the amount of lighting in indoor stages?
Then you have the actual problem of how it'd play. Maybe a sort of puzzle minigame...
Posted by: HullBreach Feb 28 2007, 02:54 AM
Anyone else wish they would just release some more stuff on 360? I've got a pile of money I want to hand microsoft, I just need them to bring some more stuff out.
Im willing to deal with the bending and even breaking of cannon in this case for a simple reason: It's more than likely going to net us some new players, and get the Shadowrun name some exposure.
I'm still harboring the hope that someday I'll sit down to play a Shadowrun action MMORPG.
Posted by: Deschain Feb 28 2007, 03:00 AM
| QUOTE (James McMurray) | ||
Hacking would be tough to implement in an FPS though. In a game all about blowing people up, being able to sleaze your way through the information superhighway isn't a very useful skill. And it's far from trivial to change game design to make it a valuable addition. |
Look at the aforementioned mod since you apparently didn't do so to begin with. It happens to be an FPS with hacking as part of the game. Is the hacking done precisely how SR runs it? Nah but the reasons for hacking are. It's done to control automated turrets and open/close doors.
That's coming from a team that's not being paid to make a game.
That said, Crakkerjakk, makes a good point. The game's going to bomb because most SR enthusists are going to flee from it. And since one SR game flops, very few are going to try again. Only suggestion I can think is to write letters explaining that the piss-poor handling of the SR lore is what's making many dislike the game.
Posted by: Kagetenshi Feb 28 2007, 03:35 AM
| QUOTE (Crakkerjakk) |
| It's like buying the Alien's vs. Predator license and making a rhythm based DDR style game out of it. |
That (unlike the monstrosity under discussion) would be awesome.
~J
Posted by: Wounded Ronin Feb 28 2007, 03:36 AM
| QUOTE (James McMurray) | ||
Hacking would be tough to implement in an FPS though. In a game all about blowing people up, being able to sleaze your way through the information superhighway isn't a very useful skill. And it's far from trivial to change game design to make it a valuable addition. |
Deus Ex handled that very well. If you had skill in hacking and you were able to find a moment or two alone with a computer terminal you could retrieve passwords, look around using the security cameras, and make sentry guns open fire on your enemies. It was actually very handy and very well integrated in the FPS action.
I really love FPSes, but I actually think that the best way to make a Shadowrun FPS would actually just to make a gigantic Deus Ex mod. In order to demonstrate the 80s preoccupation with Japan I'd try to make the maps look like a lot of the bright neon city maps in the Deus Ex mod Redsun 2020.
http://redsun2020.deusexgaming.com/
Since SR is essentially about industrial espionage and covert warfare the mission and stealth centered themes of the Deus Ex game would work well.
If there were a multiplayer mode I'd make it like the No One Lives Forever II multiplayer co-op game, where there are objectives and unlimited enemies and the players must work as a team.
Posted by: hyzmarca Feb 28 2007, 04:27 AM
| QUOTE (James McMurray @ Feb 27 2007, 07:22 PM) | ||
Hacking would be tough to implement in an FPS though. In a game all about blowing people up, being able to sleaze your way through the information superhighway isn't a very useful skill. And it's far from trivial to change game design to make it a valuable addition. |
In an every-man for himself deathmatch, you'd be right. But this Shadowrun FPS is based around team play, which means that a decker can be extraordinarily powerful.
Deckers/hackers would ideally serve two roles in the team, command and control and paydata retrieval. The latter is a simple capture-the-flag (Honestly, all retrieval runs can be considered a form of capture-the-flag) where only a decker can retrieve the flag.
The fromer is much more complex and vital. The C&C decker will be sitting out of sight and out of danger, ideally. He will will use the building's security systems to help his team. He'll do recon with cameras; he'll open and close doors to herd enemies, protect teammates, and make a clear path to the goal (if there is one); he'll do nasty things with fire suppression systems and elevators, of course; and he just might take control of a conveniently placed gun turret. Using voice chat to relay information to the other team-members in real time, an effective decker can lead almost any team to victory.
But, he would still be vulnerable. In addition to having to fight the other team's decker(s) for control of this stuff, he'll be vulnerable to attacks on his meatbod if an enemy finds it. Decker characters will have to keep a close eye on enemy locations and jackout if his meatbod is about to be compromised.
In a single-player game Deus Ex does it best, as WR said.
Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Feb 28 2007, 06:37 AM
Hyz has the right of it.
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Feb 28 2007, 06:40 AM
Keep in mind, this is a 360 game. Team cooperation is a nice idea, but is probably fairly unlikely if you're playing on xbox live with anyone but people you know.
Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Feb 28 2007, 06:52 AM
Even if pubbies don't want to take orders, a hacker could still help them out.
Rerouting enemy traffic to have to go the long way around.
Blanking everybody's HUD camera display.
Blanking out the sec cameras.
Turning the enemy's turrets to target their own team.
Possessing the enemy's turret and waiting for a prime shot.
Stuff like that that would still contribute to victory.
Or do it like Dystopia does, and make the Matrix missions a vital component of overall victory - you literally cannot proceed in some Dystopia missions unless you achieve hacking objectives, and at the bare minimum it'll require a heavy assault on the front doors in lieu of a good hacking run.
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Feb 28 2007, 06:57 AM
Yeah, it's do-able. You think it's likely?
Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Feb 28 2007, 07:00 AM
It's called Dystopia. Not only is it do-able, it's been done, by a group that's not being paid for their time or effort or expertise.
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Feb 28 2007, 07:09 AM
I'm talking about the Shadowrun FPS. Can one mod 360 games? I'm not too clear on the capabilities of the next gen consoles.
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Feb 28 2007, 07:15 AM
Sorry for the double post, but I checked out the dystopia trailer, and that matrix section looked kick ass. A little more twitchy than I would prefer in a shadowrun-esque game, but the layout just looked... right.
Posted by: ShadowDragon8685 Feb 28 2007, 07:22 AM
I'm not suggesting modding a 360 game, I'm suggesting they do it right to start with.
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Feb 28 2007, 07:26 AM
Well, yeah, then I'm on board with that. My main complaint has always been that the current game looks like it's going to be crap, not that it can't be done.
Posted by: James McMurray Feb 28 2007, 02:02 PM
Ok, I admit it. I was wrong. My lack of eperience (or desire to be experienced) with FPSes steered me wrong. 
Posted by: Demonseed Elite Feb 28 2007, 03:25 PM
| QUOTE (Crakkerjakk) |
| Keep in mind, this is a 360 game. Team cooperation is a nice idea, but is probably fairly unlikely if you're playing on xbox live with anyone but people you know. |
It will also be cross-platform with Windows Vista. It'll be one of the first games (if not the first) where 360 players can play against Vista PC players.
Honestly, my complaints about it have lessened since they have revised some of the backstory. When the game was first announced to the public, it had the Shadowrun name but used none of the Shadowrun backstory, instead making up its own. Which made little sense for an established intellectual property. Since the public outcry about that, they've revised the backstory quite a bit to actually include Shadowrun elements, which makes much more sense.
It's far from an exact translation, but it's at least somewhat Shadowrun now.
Posted by: KarmaInferno Feb 28 2007, 04:53 PM
Yes. They changed the part that was easy to change, the part that has zero effect on the actual game mechanics or development. The part that probably took less than an afternoon to re-write.
It still stands that the core game functionality has several glaring canon violations of established Shadowrun world mechanics. Teleportation, resurrection, etc. It's very clearly a game engine that they developed first and stuck the Shadowrun name on later, merely because they already owned the license.
It's also more or less two fire teams going after each other pretty much in the open. No covert ops elements to speak of, no information gathering. No actual shadowruns, really. If it was marketed as "Shadowrun: The Desert Wars" or "Shadowrun: Urban Brawl" with the game set in one of the setting's media-run combat gameshows, it might have been slightly more palatable.
-karma
Posted by: imperialus Feb 28 2007, 05:25 PM
| QUOTE (Herald of Verjigorm) | ||
That's not what he said. The argument was "Shadowrun hasn't only been a RPG" |
and how well did anything but the RPG do? I know I bought the Troll bodyguard 12" heroclicks figure, but that was just cause it looked cool. I've seen one copy of the DMZ (the boardgame I assume he is refering to) in my life, it was in a bargin bin years ago selling new for 50% off the cover price. I still didn't buy it. I have never seen so much as a booster pack for the Shadowrun CCG. He's citing a bunch of failed buisness ventures that aside from the Heroclicks helped drive FASA into the ground. Way to increase my confidance.
Posted by: Herald of Verjigorm Feb 28 2007, 05:32 PM
| QUOTE (imperialus) |
| and how well did anything but the RPG do? |
Not well, much as this game may. I didn't say it was a good argument, I just get sick of people misquoting and basing their responses on something that the opponent didn't say or even imply.
Posted by: James McMurray Feb 28 2007, 05:50 PM
| QUOTE (Herald of Verjigorm) |
| I just get sick of people misquoting and basing their responses on something that the opponent didn't say or even imply. |
Then you may want to retire from internet forums and save yourself an early heart attack.
Posted by: sunnyside Feb 28 2007, 06:30 PM
I wonder if there is any chance MS will play nice with the mod community.
Once you have a crappy retarded shadowrun FPS out it shouldn't be overly hard to mod it into something awsome. I mean if half life can spawn counterstrike think of the potential this has.
Posted by: Kagetenshi Feb 28 2007, 06:34 PM
Very unlikely, simply by virtue of the "Console/GPC interoperability" angle.
~J
Posted by: ATimson Feb 28 2007, 08:17 PM
| QUOTE (Kagetenshi) |
| Very unlikely, simply by virtue of the "Console/GPC interoperability" angle. |
It'd depend on how the Live Anywhere security works, I'd think. But since Epic is looking at implementing PC/Live/PS3 cross-platform into Unreal Tournament III, which will be... rather moddable on PC... I don't think it's fair to automatically assume that modding Shadowrun is impossible.
Posted by: nezumi Feb 28 2007, 08:27 PM
FASA has explicitly said it will not be open to modding.
Posted by: Lazerface Feb 28 2007, 08:48 PM
I missed that announcement. Where'd they say that?
Posted by: Arethusa Feb 28 2007, 08:51 PM
Does any of this matter? Whether this is true to canon or not is irrelevant. The game looks insanely bad. End of fucking debate.
Posted by: X-Kalibur Feb 28 2007, 09:16 PM
| QUOTE (Arethusa) |
| Does any of this matter? Whether this is true to canon or not is irrelevant. The game looks insanely bad. End of fucking debate. |
Quo ed demonstratum?
Posted by: nezumi Feb 28 2007, 09:46 PM
In the forums, way back when before everyone came in about the beta. You can search if you want. It was announced by Piett there, so it is "official".
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Feb 28 2007, 10:01 PM
si hoc legere scis nimium eruditiones habes.
Posted by: Lazerface Feb 28 2007, 10:05 PM
@nezumi
All I found was this.
"Any mod plans, if any, will be PC and 360 together."
Posted by: 2bit Mar 1 2007, 06:54 PM
However, that statement means any "mods" will have to be authored by FASA. That equals no mods. Any additional content outside of game patches will probably depend on their next game's development cycle. They may devote a few designers along with the rest of their development and art team to come up with marketplace downloads while the bulk of the design team begins work on a sequel, expansion, or something completely different.
Posted by: X-Kalibur Mar 1 2007, 07:07 PM
| QUOTE (Crakkerjakk) |
| si hoc legere scis nimium eruditiones habes. |
Yes, I am overeducated
Posted by: Lindt Mar 1 2007, 08:06 PM
I just want to know how long its going to take for the 360 users to start screaming 'OMG nErF!' to the PC users.
By now Im pretty disgusted with the whole thing. Its going to get smoked by Halo 3, and will be in a bargain bin with little or no damage done to this end of the franchise.
Posted by: Darkest Angel Mar 1 2007, 08:19 PM
| QUOTE |
| "We built this game backwards," he continued. "Most games start with artwork, and as time gets shorter and shorter, they basically just throw some gameplay on and pray that it works. We went the other way. We had the core gameplay, and we've been building the art around it." He admitted that reaction to the game's E3 showing wasn't what he had hoped. "I thought people would be able to see past the art and see the innovation in the game. We've done some dramatically innovative things." |
I think that paragraph sums it up. This game was never meant to be 'Shadowrun' at it's inception. It's clearly 'Shadowrun' in lazy marketing name alone.
Posted by: Moon-Hawk Mar 1 2007, 09:05 PM
| QUOTE (Lindt) |
| I just want to know how long its going to take for the 360 users to start screaming 'OMG nErF!' to the PC users. |
Why only the 360 users? Won't the PC users also be screaming 'OMG nErF!' to the 360 users?
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Mar 2 2007, 08:19 AM
The other problem with that quote is that I haven't seen anything drastically innovative in the game. Don't know which trailers he's been looking at.
As to why the 360 users will be wanting the PC users nerfed, because a laser/optical mouse is WAY more sensitive/accurate than a thumbstick. I'd be suprised if they aren't including some sort of "balancing mechanic"(read fuzz factor on PC accuracy or auto lock on x-box) to balance the sides out, otherwise it's gonna be a slaughter.
Posted by: Wounded Ronin Mar 3 2007, 01:54 AM
I always was a lot faster with target acquisition in FPS games with a mouse than with a joystick. I'm utterly mystified why everyone seems to claim that using a joystick on a controller is supposed to be so much easier than using a mouse.
When I'm playing a FPS and using a mouse I don't have to think about the controller. Everything happens very naturally. I feel like if I want to put the cursor on my opponent's head I just have to make a slight movement.
On the other hand, with joysticks I'm always having difficulty with targeting because of how far you're pushing the joystick affecting the speed at which the cursor moves. It's easy to overshoot your target because you're not doing a halfpush when under fire and the full push makes your reticle overshoot. You can't just place the cursor where you want it.
Posted by: Ranneko Mar 3 2007, 02:26 AM
Console FPSes use various compensating factors, such as slight auto-aim and target tracking.
Shadowrun by all reports does this, in order to put each platform on roughly the same level.
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Mar 3 2007, 11:39 AM
This really sticks in my craw. I know, it's not rational, but I want games to be "fair," and for some reason my definition of the word involves the same code for both machines, at least as far as aiming goes. I don't like it that console gamers get a little extra help, just cause their controller is by it's very nature less efficient than a mouse. Does anyone know if Microsoft(or Sony , for that matter) sells mouse/keyboard stuff for their consoles?
Posted by: Kagetenshi Mar 3 2007, 01:53 PM
Sony doesn't sell a mouse and keyboard for the PS3 that I'm aware of, but you can certainly plug one in. Whether games will use them is another matter—it's the whole "Linux installation made easy" bit that requires the keyboard.
~J
Posted by: James McMurray Mar 3 2007, 07:47 PM
| QUOTE (Crakkerjakk) |
| This really sticks in my craw. I know, it's not rational, but I want games to be "fair," and for some reason my definition of the word involves the same code for both machines, at least as far as aiming goes. I don't like it that console gamers get a little extra help, just cause their controller is by it's very nature less efficient than a mouse. Does anyone know if Microsoft(or Sony , for that matter) sells mouse/keyboard stuff for their consoles? |
Doesn't fair mean "balanced" so shouldn't something be done to balance if one side is blatantly worse?
Posted by: Fix-it Mar 3 2007, 08:18 PM
no, it means those stupid console jockeys should buy a PC and play some real games
Posted by: Kagetenshi Mar 3 2007, 08:30 PM
| QUOTE (James McMurray) |
| Doesn't fair mean "balanced"[…]? |
Nope. "Fair" doesn't mean anything at all (or more accurately, means several different contradictory things), which is really the problem with making things that are fair.
~J
Posted by: Crakkerjakk Mar 3 2007, 08:46 PM
Yeah James, I know it doesn't really make sense. It just feels like cheating to me when the console jockeys get a lil help from the game itself. And yes, I realize that without that help, PC gamers would own them(well, if everyone was equal skillwise) because our controls are more precise. But some part of me wants the console gamers to get better controls, if thats the case. Which again, is not a realistic expectation, it's just this feeling I get in my gut anytime I hear about tweaking so that a game is "easier" for console gamers than PC gamers.
Posted by: Adam Mar 3 2007, 09:23 PM
| QUOTE (Fix-it) |
| no, it means those stupid console jockeys should buy a PC and play some real games |
Just like those damned "roleplayers" -- who would want to do something that lame?!
Posted by: Rajaat99 Mar 4 2007, 06:50 AM
| QUOTE (Adam) | ||
Just like those damned "roleplayers" -- who would want to do something that lame?! |
I agree roleplaying sucks. Let's go play some video games and eat cheetos.
Posted by: mfb Mar 4 2007, 07:20 AM
| QUOTE (Crakkerjakk) |
| It just feels like cheating to me when the console jockeys get a lil help from the game itself. |
if it's like every other auto-aim i've seen, it will favor body shots. any PC gamer with half a brain will go for headshots--and even if they don't, the mouse's higher precision means they'll probably be as accurate with body shots on average as the console gamers. i think you'll see PC gamers generally doing better than the console gamers, even with the auto-aim.
Posted by: Trigger Mar 4 2007, 01:59 PM
You wanna know what....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbFh2MDUxCY&NR
Just thought I should add...
Posted by: Herald of Verjigorm Mar 4 2007, 02:10 PM
No other game system lets your reflexive aiming of the controller actually help (or hurt) your performance.
Actually, I want the Wii-rifle controller expansion. Lie down on the carpet and start sniping.
Posted by: hyzmarca Mar 4 2007, 03:39 PM
| QUOTE (Trigger @ Mar 4 2007, 08:59 AM) |
| You wanna know what.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbFh2MDUxCY&NR Just thought I should add... |
After that commercial, I'm afraid that the Wii will give me an STD.
To add insult to injury, the wiimote is a bluetooth HID device and is compatible with Windows, Mac, and Linux using homebrew drivers. Do not only can PC users aim with the mouse, they can also aim with the wiimote.
Posted by: Fix-it Mar 4 2007, 07:26 PM
http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?strip_id=227
Posted by: Trigger Mar 4 2007, 07:28 PM
I love VG Cats...I laughed so hard the first time I saw that after it came out on Monday.
Posted by: Wounded Ronin Mar 5 2007, 12:55 AM
| QUOTE (Herald of Verjigorm) |
| No other game system lets your reflexive aiming of the controller actually help (or hurt) your performance. Actually, I want the Wii-rifle controller expansion. Lie down on the carpet and start sniping. |
Once in Montreal I stopped by a random arcade that had a Japanese World War II versus Zombies game that used a big light rifle. It was quite akward, actually, for the following reasons.
1.) I'm cross dominant. Blearg.
2.) The game actually had a little zoom view over where your rifle was pointing. This was really strange-feeling and difficult to handle, probably because I was trying to use the rifle properly and the zoom view was designed for retards firing from the hip.
3.) The game engine was similar to any other shooter, i.e. guys would jump out at you really close as well as from really far away. I don't think my brain was able to neatly process trying to align my sights to plink a really distant guy and then all of a sudden have a giant target appear in the foreground.
In other words they used a big plastic rifle as your input device but the action in the game was not conducive to actual rifle use.
This is coming from a guy who always holds light pistols "correctly" in shooter games. When I beat Time Crisis 2 I never hit my girlfriend a single time during the last boss fight because I was taking only correctly aimed shots.
Posted by: fistandantilus3.0 Mar 5 2007, 04:37 AM
| QUOTE (Wounded Ronin @ Mar 4 2007, 07:55 PM) |
| I never hit my girlfriend a single time during the last boss fight |
Really you probably shouldn't hit your girlfriend at all, boss fight or no. I know it's annoying sometimes when they interupt, but you gotta have some control man.
Posted by: Rajaat99 Mar 7 2007, 03:43 AM
| QUOTE (fistandantilus3.0 @ Mar 5 2007, 04:37 AM) | ||
Really you probably shouldn't hit your girlfriend at all, boss fight or no. I know it's annoying sometimes when they interupt, but you gotta have some control man. |
I thought the same thing when I read that post. I've never played Time Crisis 2, so I have no idea what he's talking about. All I could think was, "Why would he hit his girlfriend during a boss fight?" Which is sad, because I should've been thinking, "Why would he hit his girlfriend?"
Posted by: fistandantilus3.0 Mar 7 2007, 05:59 AM
Just proves that we're all bad people really.
Posted by: Wounded Ronin Mar 7 2007, 07:49 AM
You all should know that, being a gamer, it would impossible for me to get females to like me in real life, therefore there's no way I could have been talking about literal girlfriend-hitting.
I am, of course, refering to this game: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_Crisis_II
In the final boss fight the bad guy grabs your pink-themed anime chick girlfriend and holds her as a human shield while attacking you. If you accidently shoot her you lose life just as if you yourself had taken a hit. Her head is right next to his head the entire time so if your aim is off by a small amount you are penalized. While I was playing through this game I never hit the wrong target. At the time I played the game I was also taking a firearms class so all the aiming stuff was real fresh on my mind and in my muscle memory.
EDIT:
Here we go, an actual Time Crisis 2 FAQ!
| QUOTE |
The final area, and boy is this fight pretty hard. First of all, kill all of the soldiers, and carefully try and shoot Ernesto. Try not and shoot Christy of course. After some shooting, and careful aiming, you'll proceed to the next screen. |
http://faqs.ign.com/articles/394/394313p1.html
Ho ho ho! It's "pretty hard" for a mere mortal, but not for the triple initiated physad with the deadly physad power Improved Ability: Arcade Game Lightguns!
Posted by: eidolon Mar 7 2007, 02:26 PM
I'm a fan of the one where you have a pump shotgun and fight a bunch of zombies. Unfortunately, the name eludes me at the moment. Used to play it in D&B's in Honolulu. We'd hold the blue plastic shotgun by the grip and pump it by shooting our arm straight out. Movie style, absolute realism.
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