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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ Shadowrun Variants

Posted by: Synner667 Mar 11 2007, 03:15 AM

Hi,

Considering what the rules for Shadowrun are like and their flexibility, does anyone run variants where the SR rules are used in other ways/other settings/etc ??

Fantasy games ??
Modern Day games ??
Far future games ??
Minimal Cyberpunk games ??
CthulhuPunk games ??
etc.

I think these things have been mentioned briefly by people, but I don't think there's been anything written about others games that are run using the SR rules.

I personally mix'n'match my rules to produce a SR/Cthulhu/CP2020/BubbleGum Crisis/TORG/Mage/Aeon cross-over variation - and it's great for keeping people on their toes, having a different tone to my games and using source material from all over the place.

But then I'm a prone to mucking about with RPG rules [I was using the Aeon rules for SR before FanPro did the same thing] >shrug<

Anyways..
..I'll be interested in seeing other people's thoughts.

Peter

Posted by: cleggster Mar 11 2007, 03:25 AM

I actually used a modified version of the Shadowrun rules to run a Dune game. I like the relativly simple combat system (1 target # then modified based on situation). Also the built in system for abilities beyond normal. Magic for Brana Bindu training and other Bene Gesserit powers. Also I enjoy the fact the Initiative is so important. In Dune, who goes first spell life or death. I was originaly going to use West Ends Star Wars system. But I didn't really take to having to roll dice for eveything.

Posted by: fistandantilus3.0 Mar 11 2007, 04:05 AM

There were some D6 variants publsihed that I've seen. D6 space and D6 fantasy and the like. The shadowrun system can be used for stuff like fantasy games, but not high fantasy. it doesn't really lend it's self well to slaughtering hordes and the like. There was a thread like this a month or so ago. Try seeing what the search utility can find you.

Posted by: nezumi Mar 11 2007, 06:02 AM

I use the basic Shadowrun mechanic for a pair of historical fantasy games.

Posted by: Garrowolf Mar 11 2007, 08:36 AM

I use it in a hard scifi space setting and in a fantasy game based on Avatar the last Airbender.

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Mar 11 2007, 08:41 PM

...I too am looking to adapt the rule mechanics (SR3) for a futuristic SF campaign using the Build point system from SR Companion.

For one, the Rigger concept actually fits perfectly into the setting for a uniquely trained type of pilot I developed and I had to write special rules from the ground up for in the system I last used (FGU's Space Opera).

Races are a cinch of course and all are specific to the campaign setting.

With a few extra adds (like shielding etc), spacecraft would pretty much follow the naval vessel design rules.

The one good thing with the BP chargen system, there need be no parallel for Magic as with the Priority scale. I tend to wince at most space games "substituting" things like Psi of "Force like" powers to replace magic and spells. This is one of the reasons I liked Traveller. Tech level as the important factor and at high levels (like 15 - 16) it almost had a mystical quality of its own. I do have a form of empathic ability, but it is fairly low key, mostly sensory based with a few influential/innuendo based talents more on par with some of the Social Adept abilities. There will be no lifting starfighters out of the mud or flinging objects across the room with a thought and if you put a blast visor down on your helmet in melee, you will be blind as a bat and at -8 to hit.

With the advent of SR4 there is pressure to go that way but several things that were watered down in my book were Riggers and Deckers. As I mentioned in another thread, they could have kept the same colour using the more streamlined mechanic for both.

Posted by: Wounded Ronin Mar 12 2007, 05:30 AM

QUOTE (cleggster)

Not to mention that the later Dune books make such a big deal of initiative a la Wired Reflexes. Duncan Idaho is the shit in the first novel where he chops up 20 saudukar all by himself. However, in God Emperor of Dune he suddenly sucks due to slow reflexes. But then IIRC they fix his reflexes and he's the shit again.

Posted by: jrpigman Mar 12 2007, 03:49 PM

A shiny new quarter for the man who converts SR to steampunk...

Posted by: Platinum Mar 12 2007, 05:21 PM

I did a desert punk and a steam punk in two different scenarios. circuit based technology failed, in one scenario. and in the other I ran a mad max style tribe that had an artifact a johnson wanted recovered.

Posted by: Lindt Mar 12 2007, 06:20 PM

Really... care to share some more of that there conceptual who'e'whatsit Platinum? Sounds like something I could suddenly use for a con game.

Posted by: hyzmarca Mar 12 2007, 07:17 PM

QUOTE (jrpigman)

A shiny new quarter for the man who converts SR to steampunk...

Steampunk is flavor conversion rather than a mechanics conversion.
The stats could be identical, you just have to make your troll shove coal into his cyberarm a few times a day and make the cyberdecks run on punchcards instead of optical chips.

Posted by: Platinum Mar 12 2007, 08:05 PM

QUOTE (Lindt @ Mar 12 2007, 02:20 PM)

Really... care to share some more of that there conceptual who'e'whatsit Platinum? Sounds like something I could suddenly use for a con game.

which one are you interested in the Steampunk or Desertpunk?

Posted by: fourstring_samurai Mar 15 2007, 10:13 PM

i did a resident evil game with the straight SR3 rules, of course minus cyber and magic. the condition monitor really lends itself well to the resident evil idea of health.

Posted by: Thane36425 Mar 15 2007, 11:03 PM

I ran a campaign where the Awakening happened in 1911 instead of 2011. The campaign ran in several phases. The first phase was Prohibition Era America. Everyone was really freaked out by the Awakening and Prohibition included the use of magic. That drove most mages either underground or out of the country (I should point out that the US did not fragment in this campaign). The players worked in the underground for people like the bootleggers and all that, but also for companies that illegally used magic anyway.

The second phase was set in WWII. Magic didn't play too much of a role because the various nations like Germany and England used their mages hard in the beginning and lost many of them. Think the Battle of Britain with Astrally Projecting mages escorting and attacking the bomber groups via summoned spirits, similiar raids against military factories and political targets. Very high losses until those were curtailed. Japan suffered rather the same fate with their mages against the Chinese leading up to the war with the US. The US, of course, had either driven out or forced underground its mages, so it came up short when the war started. The players were either in commando units, airborne or the like. A lot of one off missions just to try different things.

The bugs didn't turn up until the 1960's and 1970's, but we didn't play in that era as the group had broken up by then.

Posted by: PBTHHHHT Mar 16 2007, 12:16 AM

QUOTE (Thane36425)

Japan suffered rather the same fate with their mages against the Chinese leading up to the war with the US.

For seem reason, I envision lots of Chinese phys ads (though they're not aware they're phsy ads) from the martial arts practitioners who start to do amazing things in fighting against the Japanese invaders. Course, the Japanese will have a few too, but... anyway, just lots of physical fighting craziness. heh.

Posted by: Thane36425 Mar 16 2007, 12:28 AM

QUOTE (PBTHHHHT)

There was probably some of that. The way I handled magic by all combatants was that magic was new and no one really knew how to use them, kind of like what happened with tanks and aircraft at first. The result was that many were misused and killed unnecessarily. Physads could have been misused if they were sent in waves against machine guns: they'd die just as readily as anyone else.

The example I used of mages escorting bombers to defend against other mages using spirits to take them down is part of that. The fear of spirits tearing down fleets of bombers caused an over reaction and lots of mages were sent up, resulting in heavy losses. Eventually, that became a mostly mundane field with just a few mages on either side rather than the masses like in the beginning.

Eventually, magic ended up primarily as a supporting arm or specialised combatants. The way I played it, mages ended up doing security for politicians and generals and their meeting, protecting major capital ships like battleships and carriers, security for major factories and supply depots. In the field, there were mainly in the medical services, combat engineers (especially mine detection and removal) and astral reconnaisance especially inthe field backing up mundane recon because they would be less likely to run into an enemy mage that way. Lastly, those with Ally spirits were used as secured communications, like the Code Talkers in the Pacific. The mage would be in the field and the Ally would stay at HQ. The mage could then relay communications and requests for artillery through the Ally (and get return messages) in a way that could not be intercepted or blocked.

Posted by: tisoz Mar 16 2007, 04:33 AM

QUOTE (jrpigman)

A shiny new quarter for the man who converts SR to steampunk...

See Harlequin's Back for a Steampunk metaplane that gives some ideas for converting characters. There's also a Cattlepunk setting that has some clockwork conversions that could be used for a steampunk game.

Posted by: Wounded Ronin Mar 16 2007, 04:45 AM

QUOTE (Thane36425)

Magic = moonshine

I like it!

Seriously, though, I've played in a number of campaigns where magic was very rare set in historical or present day settings. The big problem is that when magical defenses or opposition is rare PC magic becomes super powerful. Astral scouting is uber when magical security is rare.

Posted by: Thane36425 Mar 16 2007, 10:48 AM

QUOTE (Wounded Ronin @ Mar 15 2007, 11:45 PM)

Rare, but still present. You are right that magical group coudl walk all over a larger group of mundanes. A mage/sniper with a high rifle skill and a spirit giving extra concealment, is almost impossible to find.

The solution there was that the players always encountered magical opposition, kind of like runners do. On the other hand, the mages (only one player was a mage, two others were physads, and one was mundane) had to be really careful because I ruled that virtually all soldiers had experience with magic from basic training, so raining spells on a unit was a sure way to get noticed quickly and bring down a hell of a lot of firepower on your position. Also, enemy mages could be callde up, just like artillery fire could be called for. Granted that might be rapid response on the Astral with spirits in tow, but that mage could find the enemy mage and relay their position so the mundanes could hammer it. The players got really ticked when I did that to them the first time, using their own tactics against them.

Scout planes were pretty uber too in that they could get in and out fast without getting killed, most of the time. Astral mages were much the same. Important areas would be defended by mages and spirits who weren't limited by thing like fuel for their pursuit. Also, mages are hampered in that they can't take pictures, read map to get an exact location, or read signs, documents and so on. They are still potent, but they have the limitations. The PC mages were usually limited to close recons, like poking around through the next treeline to see if anyone was there. Even doing that doesn't garauntee that they will spot the enemy who may be dug in, hidden in a part of a building the mage didn't check, or simply that they were up and moving and the mage missed them.

These missions ran kind of like the Combat and Gallant Men TV series. Small units, often with NPC backup, that did special missions. It was easier that way to make sure that they met enemy magic at least at some point.

Lest I forget, Thanks. The players did like the Prohibition Era phase. It was sort of like one long, mild Night of Rage. Lots of prejudice against Meta, especially orks and trolls, and a mage openly using magic, even something inocuous like a healing spell, cause people to panic like in the Westerns when the bad guy was about to start shooting. That led to a scene where the team's battle with a vampire ended up in the streets. It was obvious that was the vampire that had been terrorizing the town, but when the mage killed it with a spell, the locals opened fire on him too: unnatural hellspawn being no better than the bloodsucker.

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Mar 16 2007, 02:46 PM

...in space, no one can hear the mage scream when he tries to cast that force 6 spell.

Posted by: Wounded Ronin Mar 16 2007, 09:27 PM

QUOTE (Thane36425 @ Mar 16 2007, 05:48 AM)

The solution there was that the players always encountered magical opposition, kind of like runners do. On the other hand, the mages (only one player was a mage, two others were physads, and one was mundane) had to be really careful because I ruled that virtually all soldiers had experience with magic from basic training, so raining spells on a unit was a sure way to get noticed quickly and bring down a hell of a lot of firepower on your position. Also, enemy mages could be callde up, just like artillery fire could be called for. Granted that might be rapid response on the Astral with spirits in tow, but that mage could find the enemy mage and relay their position so the mundanes could hammer it. The players got really ticked when I did that to them the first time, using their own tactics against them.

Wow, man, that's absolutely godlike. The best part is that the players got pissed off when the NPCs simply imitated their tactics.

Posted by: Thane36425 Mar 16 2007, 10:37 PM

QUOTE (Wounded Ronin)

Wow, man, that's absolutely godlike. The best part is that the players got pissed off when the NPCs simply imitated their tactics.

During WWII, soldiers were exposed to the MG42 with its huge rate of fire so they wouldn't freak out too much. It just made sense that as many troops as possible would shown magical effects, like being hit with low powered area stun spells and the like. NCOs and Officers in particular would know these signs. Like the MG42, the tactic was cover and suppressing fire. That would work on a mage too. In the mean time, the radioman would call in a fire report for the magical attack and ask for help. A projecting mage would show up, usually from regimental HQ which wouldn't be too far away, and scour the area. If the enemy mage wasn't masking, they would be found before too long. Once found, the friendly mage would come back to the field unit with a report on range and bearing, thus allowing artillery, airstrikes or whatever to be delivered.

I was kind of suprised that that group figured that out so quickly. It also suprised me that they didn't think it would be turned against them.

I also used another footnote from history. In WWI, the troops in the trenches didn't like snipers, because every time a sniper fired, it brought down artillery on them. I treated mages the same way. So, the troops hated having a mage along since the first time they used magic, all kinds of hurt would be coming down on their position.

As a result, the team ended up using mages as a supporting element: astral and spirit defense, healing and detection. An extended range detect weapon spell could reveal enemy positions for a few hundred yards and give a good idea of what they had and how many were out there. It wasn't 100% though, because I ruled that targets in underground bunkers would be harder to detect than those on the surface, etc. So, the team on recons usually relied on stealth to get within 100 meters or so of the enemy while the mage used that spell to feel out the line before the team advanced further.

The cat and mouse game with them developing tactics and me develping countermeasures was interesting. But yeah, they did get pissed the first time. after that, they expected their tricks not to remain secret long and to be ready to face their own again in the future.

Posted by: Warmaster Lah Mar 21 2007, 08:48 PM

QUOTE (Kyoto Kid)

The one good thing with the BP chargen system, there need be no parallel for Magic as with the Priority scale. I tend to wince at most space games "substituting" things like Psi of "Force like" powers to replace magic and spells. This is one of the reasons I liked Traveller.

Or you could do like Outlaw Star and just straight up have magic in space. Which actually worked well for the series.

I dont mind psi powers though.

A kind of Altered Reality thing would work as well. (Odd that in most Sci-Fi, even far future, they sly away from Matrix/AR styled computing.)

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Mar 21 2007, 09:13 PM

...actually, I tend to prefer my space gaming with no "Overt Mystical" powers involved.

As to the Matrix Style Computing, that is another feature of Shadowrun that I feel adapts very well to a Futuristic setting and is also part of what attracted me to using the SR3 system for a Futuristic setting.

Posted by: PBTHHHHT Mar 21 2007, 10:26 PM

QUOTE (Kyoto Kid @ Mar 16 2007, 09:46 AM)

...in space, no one can hear the mage scream when he tries to cast that force 6 spell.

Damn straight, 'cuz he's already out the airlock by then.

Posted by: Synner667 Mar 21 2007, 11:37 PM

You want some fun..
..Try Space 1889, with SR mechanics and Magic !!

Or the Castle Falkenstein setting, using SR rules for a nice Steampunk feel.

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Mar 21 2007, 11:53 PM

...played space 1889. Actually liked it. Wanted to try SteamPunk, but couldn't find anyone else in my locale who played.