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Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Jan 6 2011, 03:02 AM

Ok, so people started talking about some of the ridiculous names some vehicles got in War! and other people started talking how this isn't new and et cetera, giving the prime example the names of the Japanacorps.

Ok, Renraku means 'contact' and Shiawase means 'happiness' (much to my surprise). I mean, imagine that the FIRST MEGACORP OF THE WHOLE WORLD IS CALLED HAPPINESS?!?!?!?!?

But, ok, apparently, Shiawase is the name of a family and we all know how family names can be ridiculous. Just to name a few ridicule portuguese surnames:
Pinto (chick)
Oliveira (olive tree) [actually, pretty much any tree that bears fruit is a portuguese surname]
Barro (clay)
Costa (shore)
Marinho (marine)
etc.

What more ridiculous names there are in shadowrun that people got used to it and don't raise eyebrows to them anymore?

Posted by: War 13 Jan 6 2011, 07:55 AM

Well the Fuchi in Fuchi Industrial Electronics has always been funny to me. It means stinky or stinks. So it was basically Stinky Industrial Electronics. Not something I would want to but I think.

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 08:15 AM

Der Nachtmachen is so extremly anarchist it totally disregards proper grammar.
The dragon Haesslich apparently purposely chose 'ugly' for a name. Talk about issues. He only ever made it to middle management, making him one of the least successful dragon entrepreneurs in SR history, so maybe he was right there though.
Why a communist rebel movement would call themselves Herbstgeister (autumn spirits) is beyond me, but those groups sometimes DO have freaky names.

The Submarine freighter Wasserträger, the aircraft carrier Glucke, and other idiocy in War! have already been mentioned elsewhere.

Posted by: Aerospider Jan 6 2011, 09:40 AM

Makes perfect sense to me. Even today we have large brands being named to inspire confidence and a promise of satisfaction. LG, for example, is for 'Life's Good' (or so we're told). PR fashion seems to be already moving away from the snazzy and towards the more dumbed-down style of 'we're niceness'.

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 09:55 AM

Baby speak names are verycommon among tech companies, so Happyness, inc. isn't so out there. Clumsy, maybe, but not the kind of howler we find in War!.

Posted by: raben-aas Jan 6 2011, 10:51 AM

Actually, "Happiness" is a great name for a world-dominating megacorp.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsiFbRkyUGI&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJ6tMjpfeNI&feature=related

Scaaary!

(Can s.o. do a voice-over of those vids with some Shiawase commercial's text and the Shiqwase logo? That would be awesome in-game material ).

Posted by: Kagetenshi Jan 6 2011, 12:47 PM

Huh? Mind expanding on this one?

~J

Posted by: Mesh Jan 6 2011, 01:00 PM

Fuchi means Edge in Japanese not stinky.

Beaten to death in another thread, but... Shiawase and Koufuku share some kanji. Both kind of mean happiness, however only Koufuku is ever a family name, a very rare family name. The writer who used Shiawase probably didn't understand this. What does this mean for Shadowrun today? We have a mega Corp named Shiawase. No big deal. The earth's spin didn't reverse. I kind of like that it's literally Happiness Corporation and not a family name. It fits in a dystopic future. Besides, Shiawase sounds cooler than Koufuku which makes it more correct in SR.

Mesh

Posted by: Pinkys.Brain Jan 6 2011, 01:02 PM

He's simply mistaken. Fuchi in Japanese never means stinky/stinks. In SR it is just a normal name. If you really really want to, you could read it as "incurable", but then you could also read it as margin, abyss, grouping, ignorance, and many more...

Don't know how he got to stinky.

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 6 2011, 01:10 PM

I'd guess Fuchi was inspired by Fujifilm. There are other slightly changed names in SR. For instance the RL armament company's named Rheinmetall not Ruhrmetall.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Jan 6 2011, 01:11 PM

The founder and many of the current shareholders do have Shiawase as surname.
Like I said, I don't care.
I just want to see what other ridicule names we have out there that "most" people just roll their eyes and let go (or not?)

Posted by: Kagetenshi Jan 6 2011, 01:14 PM

That's what I thought, but I can't even find a plausible angle for this confusion to have been introduced by.

Ah well.

~J

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 6 2011, 02:25 PM

"Life's Good" is just their current advertising tagline.

Their actual full name?

Lucky Goldstar.*

Remember Goldstar? The maker of crappy stereo equipment and other low end consumer electronics?

Yeah.



-k

*- This in turn was derived from "Lak-Hui", the parent company, and "Goldstar" it's electronics subsidiary.

Posted by: warrior_allanon Jan 6 2011, 04:00 PM

i can actually make some sense of Herbstgeister if you change the translation to "Spirits of Autumn" simply because of the "October Revolution" since the Bolshevik revolution occurred in autumn a communist group would feel empowered by playing on that memory....

just a thought though...I named a custom bike i built during 3ed a Triumph Dragon, since we were starting year of the comet

Posted by: CanRay Jan 6 2011, 04:15 PM

Well, one Corp we had in a game was Blows Sound Systems, a Hong Kong Knock Off of Bose. Their motto was "Better Advertising Through Sound".

I also plan on using "Super-Ultra-Mega-OutSourceCo, Unlimited, Ltd." that's been bought and sold and taken over so many times over that no one knows who really owns it. (Being a Fuchi orphan doesn't help, either.). It hires SINless people around the world to work Tech Support and Phone Support lines. They are, literal, hell to work for, and the atmosphere around their call centers are toxic.

But those are just my own creations...

Posted by: Sengir Jan 6 2011, 04:16 PM

The German November Revolution, the Russian October Revolution, depending on how radical they are the German Autumn...maybe the name is supposed to reference the spirit of those times.


And two names from Arsenal to add to that list:
Conestoga Dust Devil: Sounds like a vacuum cleaner, the kind you can get RIGHT NOW for just 99.99 if you call 1-800-HORSEPOO in the next ten minutes. Can you believe it, Bob?
Messerschmidt Kinder: Literally "Messerschmidt children". Since it's a variant of the Piper Brat, I guess somebody just put "brat" into an online translator

Also, Arsenal has a lot of names which are not technically wrong, but simply generic descriptions of what the vehicle is and not names:
VW Stadtbus: City Bus
Saeder-Krupp CV-11 Vogel: Bird
BuMoNa Rettungswagen: Ambulance
Saeder-Krupp Heimdrone: Household Drone
Seader-Krupp Wartungseinheit: Maintenance Unit

Posted by: CanRay Jan 6 2011, 04:33 PM

I think those are probably just to make it easy on us English speakers who can't even try and figure out the mega-syllabic words that German is infamous for.

A few nice WWII examples: "Feuerleitpanzerfahrzeug für V-2 Raketen auf Zugkraftwagen 8t" and "leichte Schützenpanzerwagen (schwere Panzerbüchse 41) Sonderkraftfahrzeug 250/11".

When a friend of mine was training on the Leopard 2s he was very thankful that the manuals were in English. And can confirm from first-hand experience that the Anti-Mine/IED upgraded armor plating works like a charm.

Also, never piss off a tank when all you have is a clay wall for defense. The infantry will fan out and find you, and the tankers will want revenge. And they have a much bigger boom than some speaker wire and a nine-volt battery.

Posted by: Kid Chameleon Jan 6 2011, 04:59 PM

While FASA had a habit of inserting jokes and pop culture references back in their day, its not like modern manufacturers are any better.

Look at car names. Sonata? Fusion? Edge? Regal? Fiesta? Cube? If they weren't followed up by a slick advertising campaign we'd roll our eyes at them.

Posted by: Sengir Jan 6 2011, 05:00 PM

I can easily think of a few words which are actual names and do not require an Extended Volume implant to pronounce.

And conversely, "verbrennungskraftmaschinenbetriebenes Landfahrzeug" (ICE-powered land vehicle) also is a completely generic word and certainly not easier to pronounce


PS: Speaking of jokes, my favourite "joke-name" still is Badr al-Din Ibn Eisa, the guy behind the new Islamic Jihad who came back from the dead. "Ibn Eisa" is a patronym declaring his father to be a guy called Eisa, or Jesus in English

Posted by: raben-aas Jan 6 2011, 05:07 PM

As a side not, I don't find WAR!s "Glucke" any more "stupid-sounding" than RL's "Super Stallion".

Posted by: War 13 Jan 6 2011, 05:27 PM

About my post on Fuchi meaning stinky. I don't know how well spread it is, but in San Diego where I live the word fuchi is used to mean stinky when I was younger. I always thought it was slang based on the spanish spoken in Mexico as they were the group of people who used it the most around here. Have not heard it used much recently, but it is still in use as far as I know. I did not even think at the time about Fuchi being a Japanese mega and that the word means something in Japanese. So it could be a cultural/language thing about what the word means or maybe its just a regional meaning. I know several of the people I played with when we first started long ago made jokes about this name meaning stinky.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 05:30 PM

c-c-c-combo breaker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrnHY2KcEwM
i'll never ever respect that name again i am afraid.

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 05:33 PM

Point being: Americans would name military equipment like that. It's totally bonkers from a German perspective. And Wasserträger, good god. I realise you want to sell a few copies of War!.de, but really, wouldn't it be better to that end to just ditch the worst crap?


That would be "Target designation vehicle for V2 missiles on an 8 tons truck" (Zugkraftwagen is the kind of word you'll have a hard tiome to find outside judical or military texts), and "Infrantry fighting vehicle (heavy material rifle Type 41) Special Road Vehicle 250/11". Militzary German is the best. Especially the really easily spoken Acronyms like PzH2000.


Sure, car names can be bad too. Like the Suzuki Pajero (that was a howler in all spanish-speaking countries). There're quite some consulting companies built to help car companies do not embarass themselves with names such as those mentioned above, though. Because fact checking is such a nice thing to do.


Didn't think of that. That actually makes a certain kind of sense. It's still a bit weird, but given they're a bit mystical and whatnot it's off the stupid list now.

Posted by: sabs Jan 6 2011, 05:38 PM

You spend about 20 minutes doing company name searches on google, and you can get some really amusing names for big corporations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pharmaceutical_companies#E-J

Stupid names are really par for the course.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 05:43 PM

Where is there no company named Evil Inc. yet?

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 05:48 PM

That's your chance!

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 6 2011, 05:49 PM

Americans tend not to think in anything but American perspectives.

When you grow up constantly being told you're the most powerful important people on the planet, whether or not it's true, you tend to be that way.





-k

Posted by: Adarael Jan 6 2011, 05:51 PM

Can someone explain why Vogelhund sounds so stupid if you're German? It looks, from my perspective, like it means "bird-dog", and that doesn't seem too off. So I must be missing something.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 05:53 PM

Then please tell me why bird-dog does NOT sound dumb in english/american . .

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 05:53 PM

Seems like. Yeah, probably we should focus on other, far worse things about War!, like David Hill's nascent Nazism (no he did not mean villagers, it's painfully obvious), aaron's craptacular rules, or Michael Wich's lack of understanding how maps work (are we to assume the only acceptable part of War! is Filamena Young's?).

Posted by: Warlordtheft Jan 6 2011, 05:58 PM

It is a Horizon Subsidary, specializing in PR for despots.

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 6 2011, 05:59 PM

Because a bird dog is a description of a dog used to retrieve downed birds when bird hunting.

Typically game birds, it's too much trouble to go and scamper all over the fields yourself trying to find the bird you just shot, so you train a dog to do it.





-k

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 05:59 PM

I had thought about evo. but make it evil inc. and have it only do good.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 06:00 PM

But why does it not SOUND dumb to you people?
Also, do you have Rabbit-Dogs that go after rabbits too?

Posted by: Kagetenshi Jan 6 2011, 06:01 PM

Right, but fiction is held to a higher standard—being realistic doesn't suffice, it needs verisimilitude. Just because a real-life corporation gets away with calling itself "Verizon" doesn't mean you can name a fictional corporation that and expect people to take you seriously.


I'd say it's probably a mixture of things—in addition to what you mention, there's the fact that the US does dominate in a number of ways, and then on top you can mix in the fact that the majority of the population lives over 400 kilometers away from the next nearest country's soil. Builds a mighty strong habit.

~J

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 6 2011, 06:07 PM

Eh. English speakers have a habit of shoving any old words together to make a new combined meaning. Americans especially.



No, because rabbits have a tendency to fall down right where they've been shot, and not go careening into the brush and trees where you can spend sometimes hours locating the damn thing.

But if it WAS common practice, I'm sure it WOULD be called a "rabbit dog" or similar.



-k

Posted by: Doc Chase Jan 6 2011, 06:12 PM

We do name them 'Retrievers' as well.

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 06:29 PM

And you're surrounded by countries almost like you on top of that (Canada being a slightly more European version of the US, and Mexico being an unlucky, spanish-speaking version of the US where everything that went well for the US went badly).


Always thought that's what a blood hound is for.

Posted by: Muspellsheimr Jan 6 2011, 06:32 PM

Retriever is usually used to refer to a type of dog bred for that - the Golden Retriever. While correct, it is not often used for dogs in general who fetch game.

One of the primary reasons dogs are used for this is not finding the game, but getting the duck out of the water after you shoot it. A Bird Dog is also called a Gun Dog or Gundog.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Jan 6 2011, 06:47 PM

Just so you know, Rich Burlew already http://logo.cafepress.com/2/1221917.6257882.jpg.

Posted by: Ascalaphus Jan 6 2011, 06:51 PM

That's terrible.

Regarding the Vogelhund: why do people get so upset about it? It's a bird-hunting related name for a vehicle used in AA activities. Seems reasonable to me.

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 6 2011, 06:53 PM

Btw, what's the "Catalyst" in "Catalyst Game Labs" supposed to tell us? Is there any deeper meaning I've missed?

Posted by: Kid Chameleon Jan 6 2011, 07:55 PM

A catalyst is an agent of change.

Posted by: Kid Chameleon Jan 6 2011, 07:59 PM

A bloodhound is a tracking dog, not a retriever.

There are Fox Hounds for hunting fox but the Germans seem to have schweinhunds where we don't have pig dogs.

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 6 2011, 07:59 PM

No, but we have animals colloquially called sheep or cattle dogs. The trick is not giving a shit followed by reveling in the convenience. I mean, really, there's no such thing as a dog that is also a sheep, so it'd be dumb to infer that the phrase sheep dog means some theoretical dog-sheep hybrid. This assumption means that we can just go ahead and say sheep dog instead of cramming together every linking word until you end up with dogthatherdssheep like some other languages do.

Posted by: CanRay Jan 6 2011, 08:01 PM

So, what new and freaky name will Richard Villers come out with next for his Mega after he has to reform it. In a cave. With a box of scraps!

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 08:16 PM

Word of Dick, inc.

Posted by: sabs Jan 6 2011, 08:18 PM

Triathlon Shipping?

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 08:24 PM

None, he will come out, kill some people with it, rebuild it in a better, sleeker version of it's former self, have some fun with it and people will give it a name.

Posted by: Adarael Jan 6 2011, 09:06 PM

Here's a lot of why "bird-dog" doesn't sound strange to me: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O-1_Bird_Dog - and was the callsign for Danny Glover's character in BAT21, since he was flying the plane in question.

It just doesn't sound like a strange compound in english, since foxhound & bird dog - and even by extension foxbat, which I suppose is a nickname for fruit bats - are real things, and such are also real-world NATO code names for various aircraft. Of course "Fishbed" is one that DOES sound odd, and was used for the MiG-21, because it's like, "What is a fishbed, anyway?" It's probably based in the fact that English doesn't use linking words to form compounds.

Some other odd names we've used that don't seem to mean anything or refer to real things include "thunderchief" (WTF is a 'thunder chief'?), seabee (there are bees that live in the ocean?), and the X-20 Dyna-Soar, which is just a terrible way to make a play on "dinosaur", which everyone knows is awesome.

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 09:13 PM

I know, English loves it's new words by composites, but German doesn't, it's a far mroe rigid language. You can't just go crazy on it like you guys love to (which is a good part of what makes English a fun language). German also has rules for composites, and finally, composites are usually abreviated (Dachshund is a very, very uncommonly used word for the dachshund; we use Dackel). Now, granted, this is a bit much to ask from a freelancer who is paid Chinese minimum wage to know, but ... well, there's worse turds in there than Vogelhund, which sounds like "some English native tried to do German names". Wasserträger, Glucke (Glucke could be a nickname, but never the official name. Germans aren't funny like that.). Keller.

Posted by: Adarael Jan 6 2011, 09:21 PM

It's pretty hard for people who aren't German to figure out what compounds are good and which aren't. I mean, it's still "Schweinehund", not literally "dog that is a pig/pig that is a dog", so my assumption would be that naming an artillery piece the "Rhinemetall 280 Höllenhund" would be okay. And you still name other vehicles things like Gepard, or Fuchs, right?

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 09:28 PM

That would be PERFECTLY FINE.
Well, aside, of course, from the fact that a german would not use the english wa of writing Rheinmetall *grins* ^^

Posted by: Adarael Jan 6 2011, 09:31 PM

Okay, awesome. I've been making a gear update for S-K and their subsidiaries, and I was suddenly concerned I had named everything wrong.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 09:33 PM

No no, as long as it is thematically fitting and at least a bit martial in style and fitting for the world, then most names will be accepted.
Glucke, for example, is NOT such a name in ANY of those cases.

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 09:41 PM

With compounds, you also need to keep in mind cases. Hell hound would not be Hoelleund, but Hoellenhund. It's irregular and a royal pain to learn.

Also, 'Schweinehund' doesn't mean pig dog, but 'son of a bitch'. Just wanted top point that out. I think Kid Chameleon is just as funny as Aaron.


Yes (it's currently an AA tank and an ABC scout vehicle). Rule of thumb: a predator or robust animal that lives in the woods is a good name for a land vehicle. A state, city or country is a good name for a ship (that, or a serial number, Typ 223). A weather phenomenon is a good name for an aurplane (birds are also possible, but not in use right now). You can also use a name double - odds are it has already been used - just mark it with a number. Leopard, Leopard II, ect. Naming an artillery piece after a paracritter is okay, so long as it'S not the Novopossum or the Jauchekaefer.

Posted by: Adarael Jan 6 2011, 09:45 PM

See, we named the F-111 the Aardvark. I guess a lot of our hardware has names that don't sound all that threatening.

As for schweinehund, I know it's like "son of a bitch", but it does literally mean pig-dog, yeah? If you just look at the words?

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 09:56 PM

It does, yes.

And yeah, your planes have weird names. A-10 Warthog is not the first name that'd come to my mind when thinking of a huge-ass gun with wings and substantial bomb payload that is able to return to base with half a wing and one engine that's on fire. I can only imagine that's either weird humor at Skunk works (given that name ...) or nicknames given to the planes by test pilots that stuck.

Posted by: Adarael Jan 6 2011, 09:59 PM

It's a nickname because warthogs are ugly, heavy, and hard to kill, just like the plane. The actual designation is Thunderbolt II, to differentiate it from the P-47D Thunderbolt of world war 2, also produced by Republic Aviation. The P-47 was also ugly, heavy, and hard to kill.

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 6 2011, 10:12 PM

Not really. "Son of a bitch" would be "Hurensohn". "Schweinehund" is tricky because it's more often used as a part of the metaphor "Innerer Schweinehund" than as an actual curse word.


.oO(What a nice German lesson. The loveliest vocabulary u will always find at DS...)

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 10:15 PM

German is straight up therw with russian for sounding perfect for bitching other people out and cursing like a man possessed . .

Posted by: sabs Jan 6 2011, 10:16 PM

I prefer French for cursing
it's like wiping your ass with silk.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 10:17 PM

"nda ow ow ow! . . i broke a nail! . ." *sucks on finger like a little girl* "merde"

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 6 2011, 10:17 PM

Ever heard an angy Italian?

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 6 2011, 10:21 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2aD2EL-0XA&feature=related

Posted by: hermit Jan 6 2011, 10:22 PM

It's the same from impact. Generally, shit-associated swear words weigh far mroe heavily in German than in English (and German is curiously short on sex-themed swearwords compared to other western languages). that's what I meand. Hurensohn is a good way to get yourself severely beaten up or killed when you're in an immigrant-heavy part of town, though.


Putain!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axDyUNWyuw8

Posted by: Mesh Jan 6 2011, 11:20 PM

When you're #1, all other perspectives are #2 or lower.

Mesh
*starts chant of we're #1, we're #1*

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Jan 7 2011, 01:33 AM

That's what me and my non-german speaker friends always talk about german. You could see a man telling how much he loves a woman, and you would think she is scolding her

Posted by: Sengir Jan 7 2011, 01:49 AM

The Donaudampfschiffahrtsgesellschaftskapitän (captain of the Danube steam shipping association) would like to have a word with you, he thinks he has spotted a violation of the Rindfleischetikettierungsüberwachungsaufgabenübertragungsgesetz (act for delegation of beef labeling surveillance tasks)

@Shinobi: At least when dealing with Americans, the problem also is that we are far less...vocal with expressions of kindness. So Americans will often feel put down by a German's genuinely friendly reaction to a present, and vice versa a German will be like "are you kidding me?" because the typical American reaction looks almost comically overdone to us

Posted by: Kid Chameleon Jan 7 2011, 03:01 AM

Funnier. But not nearly as sexy.

Besides, Germans like it when I name things.

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 7 2011, 03:23 AM

The funny part about this is that a lot of the enthusiasm is just seen as a matter of being polite. We may end up exchanging the gift for store credit but that won't stop us from feeling obligated to send a thank you card afterwards.

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 7 2011, 03:57 AM

I remember when McDonalds first started opening up restaurants in Russia. They were having difficulties getting the local employees they hired to smile and be cheery to customers.





-k

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 7 2011, 06:08 AM

I had a professor from France who had either developed or had at least heard an interesting li'l pet theory about that kind of thing. He thinks it's less about Americans being generally gregarious and more about us being the ones to take this whole assembly line approach to selling food to its current extreme. Basically, other countries have less chain restaurants and more establishments that grew up by happenstance and are locally owned. He said that when you go to a French corner restaurant and expect to have your ass kissed US style, you're more likely to be talking to someone who actually owns the place and whose establishment may have only developed because his great uncle started selling sandwiches to construction workers in order to both be nice and to make a li'l petty cash on the side. In other words, it's almost like they're doing you a favor, not vice versa, whereas in the US we're weaned on "The customer is always right," and we know full well that the guy behind the counter doesn't want to hear from his manager. Hence why we think French waiters are snooty and why they think we're presumptuous blowhards who wield menus like some kind of royal scepter.

Anyway, it's just a pop psychology theory and probably more than a li'l full of crap, but I thought it was an interesting notion. It also hits me as a bit plausible whenever I think of my time in Philadelphia ordering cheesesteaks from local vendors. The sandwiches may have been good, but nobody felt obligated to smile at you and they sure as hell weren't about to take any crap from someone just to make eight bucks.

Posted by: CanRay Jan 7 2011, 06:32 AM

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!

*Curls up in corner, rocking back and forth, sobbing uncontrollably*

Posted by: MYST1C Jan 7 2011, 07:36 AM

When Wal-Mart entered the German market they tried to establish their US-style of making the employees be ultra-friendly, greeting the customers, offering help, presenting the daily/weekly special offers...
They failed miserably. German customers are not used to this kind of behavior and don't want it. Basically, we expect store employees to be invisible and inaudible until we ask them for (specific) help. Some total stranger who greets you like a friend and starts blaring special offers, follows you around with a wide (and obviously fake) smile doesn't make us feel welcomed but hassled and watched.

Posted by: ColdEquation Jan 7 2011, 08:17 AM

Actually, I can explain this one.

A Seabee is a US Navy combat engineer. As opposed to the engineers who work aboard ships, it is the role of the Seabees to support the Marines and other landing forces by building (and destroying) fortifications, runways, landing zones, and so forth. The name "Seabee" comes from World War Two, when Navy combat engineers were formed into battalions of surveyors and builders called Construction Battalions, or CBs for short ("What do you do in the Navy?" "Why, I'm in the CBs!") You can see where it came about.

The Sea Bee that serves as their mascot was originally drawn by animators at Walt Disney Studios, and even appears in a cartoon with MIckey Mouse.

Posted by: hermit Jan 7 2011, 10:50 AM

So YES. The perpetual smile/grin of Americans is ... eerie to say the least. Seems like they're on drugs or thoroughly brainwashed. Or part of an alien and hostile hive mind. If you're not genuinl frinedly, you'Re not. Makes for a rather rough tone in all service related areas that foreigners often take personal, but it's just a different mentality (and gets har harsher in the formerly East German parts of the country than it is in the West).

Also, WalMart pissed off the unions like they do in America. That was what broke them in the end. Because that is among the things you really should avoid here, lest you get slammed in all kinds of ways. That Germany is already a very tight-margin market for discounters and has various local competitors who are well set up didn't help, either.


I can imagine. Poor Russians.

I guess they also dropped the alcohol ban in their restaurants real quickly (they had to in Germany too because people got angry at not getting a beer).


There's truth in that, but France also has it's own chain restaurants (Qwik being the most common, after the state-owned highway cafeterias and Carrefour cantinas, IIRC). Thing is, American service depends on the guy behind the counter being instantly fireable because the manager wants it. In Europe, that's (usually) flat out impossible. Employee rights and unions are far stronger here than in America (and in France, unions are even more powerful than in Germany, bear in mind the French communists routinely get 10% of the French vote in national elections). The guy behind the counter won't kiss your ass because he can afford not to. Of course, if the guy also owns the place, at least in Germany he has the right of house and can just order you to go, so there's a certain snootyness that comes with this. That said, usually, restaurant staff in Europe usually are pretty polite. It's just not the creepy enthusiasm common in America (and customers are expected to display at least moderate politeness too). All bets are off in local pubs - expect not to be served in certain areas if you speak the wrong accent (foreigners often have it easier there).

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 7 2011, 12:59 PM

I'm something of a paranoid loner by nature so I kinda honestly prefer the efficient but not necessarily smiley approach. In the US the forced friendliness also puts me off a bit from making any sort of small talk in part because I don't feel like divining if they'll appreciate some chit chat or if they're just thinking "God, take your snickers and get it out."

Posted by: Pinkys.Brain Jan 7 2011, 01:10 PM

In the Shadows of Asia book there is a typo (I hope). So bosozoku became bosozuko. So the raging biker gang (normal Japanese expression) became the raging halo...
Then they randomly changed the first name and surname order. Shiawase Hitomi vs. Hitomi Shiawase (=minor thing).

I personally like the "Furin Inc.", which means "Adultery Inc." (and no, Furin is not a normal Japanese name).

(there are some smaller mishaps, like "kawaruhito" not meaning changed people, but changing people, but that's still okay).

Posted by: Nath Jan 7 2011, 02:33 PM

The companies operating French higways were privatized a few years ago. However, the restaurants always belonged to other corporations like Autogrill of Italia or L'Arche. Quick, on the other hand, is a Belgian company that was privately owned until 2007. Then, the French state holding Caisse des Dépôts et Consignation (CDC) bought it from businessman Albert Frère in 2007, making it a state-owned company (the Belgian authorities were investigating a possible fraud ; the CDC allegedly overpriced Quick on the government's behalf, in exchange for Albert Frère supporting the GDF-Suez merger).

I know a bunch of people who still mourn the day Burger King chose to close all it restaurants in France, and jump on the occasion whenever they travel in a place that has one.

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 7 2011, 03:08 PM

I know, I was just making a generalization. Are there private restaurants in the United States and chain franchises in France? Sure. But for various geographic reasons the United States is very much about sprawl and highway culture, particularly once you get past the east coast, and name recognition is a huge advantage in that kind of environment. I bet you I can name 20 or so restaurant chains without much effort and if I sat down with a pen and paper the number would get pretty ludicrous. And I don't even really eat out much because I lived with a vegan for years.

Posted by: Adarael Jan 7 2011, 05:01 PM

No, I was talking about the Republic OA-15 Seabee, which were never used particularly much (except in The Man With the Golden Gun) but which look cool anyway. Not the US Naval engineers. I just sorta assumed it was probably a different "CB" contraction.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_RC-3_Seabee

Posted by: Sengir Jan 7 2011, 05:06 PM

...whereas we consider it meretricious at best and a sarcastic exaggeration at worst. It gets even better when it involves people of opposite genders, because that means you are touching the intricacies of US-style dating...and people say Asians have complex customs

Posted by: sabs Jan 7 2011, 05:07 PM

I prefer the direct approach to dating.

Ruhipnol and a cage in the basement. Solves so many issues.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 7 2011, 06:47 PM

best/Worst Pickupline being:"Does this smell like chloroform to you?"

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 7 2011, 09:48 PM

This was posted in my old job's IT room:

ACHTUNG!
ALLES TURISTEN UND NONTEKNISCHEN LOOKENPEEPERS!
DAS KOMPUTERMASCHINE IST NICHT FÜR DER GEFINGERPOKEN UND MITTENGRABEN! ODERWISE IST EASY TO SCHNAPPEN DER SPRINGENWERK, BLOWENFUSEN UND POPPENCORKEN MIT SPITZENSPARKSEN.
IST NICHT FÜR GEWERKEN BEI DUMMKOPFEN. DER RUBBERNECKEN SIGHTSEEREN KEEPEN DAS COTTONPICKEN HÄNDER IN DAS POCKETS MUSS.
ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN.

I'm fairly sure this is about the same level of thought that went into the German naming of stuff in SR.




-k

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 7 2011, 09:53 PM

my brain broke trying to understand that x.x

Posted by: Adarael Jan 7 2011, 09:59 PM

That's because it's full of american colloquialisms like "poppencorken" <- pop your cork, or cottonpicken <- "cotton pickin'", and is probably totally incomprehensible if you're A) not north american, B) speak actual German.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 7 2011, 10:00 PM

Now try and explain what you just wrote to the german(non native english speaking) guy o.O

Posted by: hermit Jan 7 2011, 10:05 PM

That is so understandable. IF I eat fast food and have any choice at all, it's there or Subway.


Huh! I totally missed that, both things. Thanks for the info. Qwik is a Belgian company? Well, been a very long time since I was there, so I never thought about that. Just assumed they're French because I've only ever seen them in Frace (they're fairly good, but not BK).


Oh yes. But between their numerous taboos, PC talk, class and race structure, religious weirdness and dating, marriage, divorce and other customs, America gives Japan a run for their money in being incomprehensibly complex and weird.


Yeah, at least it sounds like that.

Watschen. Gewerken. Good god. Where'd they find those. That's Austrian, not German.

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 7 2011, 10:17 PM

Attention!
All tourists(visitors) and non-technical onlookers!
The computer is not for poking fingers at and grabbing with your hands! Otherwise it is easy to snap the springwork, blow the fuses, and pop the corks with spitting sparks.
It is not for work (operation) by dummies. Rubbernecking sightseers keep their cotton-picken hands in their pockets.
So relax and watch the blinking lights.

It was written to resemble a WWII era warning poster.




-k

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 7 2011, 10:19 PM

Ah. okay. That i can actually understand. Especially, being an IT guy myself ^^

Posted by: hermit Jan 7 2011, 10:28 PM

How the HELL did he get the idea to translate blinking with watschen? Watschen is Austrian for slapping. What the fuck.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 7 2011, 10:30 PM

g'nackwatschen = to slap somebody in the back of the head
it COULD make somebody blink . .

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 7 2011, 10:32 PM

Eh, it's not German or Austrian, it's English distorted to vaguely look like German.

ZO RELAXEN UND WATSCHEN DER BLINKENLICHTEN.

SO RELAX AND WATCH THE BLINKING LIGHTS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blinkenlights


-k

Posted by: hermit Jan 7 2011, 11:31 PM

Ah, I see. Watschen, though, is a word for slapping in southern dialects, most notably Austrian but I believe in some forms of Bavarian too (correct me if I'm wrong).

Posted by: Kagetenshi Jan 8 2011, 12:49 AM

McDonalds does the fries better, and that's really a fast-food burger joint's sole purpose in the world.

~J

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 8 2011, 01:26 AM

Of course, it is important to keep in mind that the US is in no way a monoculture and a lot of the "complexity" only comes about if you're dealing with one of those groups that has developed a siege mentality from having to deal with the large portion of people (including me) that frankly don't care about any of that drek. Like anywhere else, there's a lot of old customs that are written down but not necessarily observed.

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 8 2011, 01:37 AM

According to the 'New German Orthography' the word's spelled 'Schifffahrt' with triple 'f'. *cringe* Even a better word: 'Flussschifffahrt' (river traffic) *tryin' not to puke*

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 8 2011, 05:05 AM

McDonalds fries are tasty and delicious for approximately 15 minutes.

After which the cooling oil starts making the fries soggy and eww.

McDonalds knows this, which is why fries more than seven minutes out of the fryer are by store regulations thrown out.



-k

Posted by: Medicineman Jan 8 2011, 07:04 AM

You mean this angry Italian ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCFj9lf8IQE&feature=related

and for You US-Guys&Girls
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bqp64q7kHmw&feature=related
(and by-the-way the subtitles are grammatically even more correct than the original )

@Schweinehund
It's in reality not such a common Curse (it's much more common with "Movie-Nazies" )
maybe becouse its quite long (3 syllables)much more common is Arsch(Ass/Asshole; universal insult) or Scheiss/Scheisse(Shit; which is used like "Fuck" in America)
Yes...German insults are "Fecis-centered"

with a non-insulting Dance
Medicineman

Posted by: Sengir Jan 8 2011, 03:21 PM

Yep, it's one of those things which only start to make sense if you try to pronounce it ^^

And why am I thinking of http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4UhJpviVYg now?

Posted by: Kagetenshi Jan 8 2011, 03:30 PM

As your URL indicates, the proper translation is "blinkenlights", not "blinking lights".

This is very important.

~J

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 8 2011, 03:54 PM

Yeah, but even "blinkenlights" is a corruption of "blinking lights".



-k

Posted by: MYST1C Jan 9 2011, 12:22 PM

At least the New Orthography does allow the optional introduction of hyphens into compound nouns to help understanding. So "Donaudampfschifffahrtsgesellschaftskapitän" could alternatively be spelled e.g. "Donau-Dampfschifffahrtsgesellschafts-Kapitän" or "Donau-Dampfschifffahrts-Gesellschafts-Kapitän"...

Posted by: Cochise Jan 9 2011, 01:33 PM

And of course a corruption of "Blinklichter" ... the correct german spelling.

Just as a side note: IT crowd does the same stuff in all languages. A very similar text in terms of intention and fun would be:

Achdung! Kombjuderraum!

D'r Raum is voll bis unner de Deck mit de dollschde elegtrische un vollelegdronische Ohlacha.
Stauna und gugga darf jeda ... awer rumworschdle und Knöbbflä drügga dürfa nur mir!

De Experda

In this particular case the humor is based around writing in one of the german dialects (or more in variant versions of said text) that normally do not have a written representation.

Posted by: Stahlseele Jan 9 2011, 02:59 PM

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 10 2011, 12:55 PM

I knew that rang a bell. Finally I've made the connection: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutscher_Herbst (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Autumn) of course! There's a pretty clear http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Army_Faction connection.

Posted by: sabs Jan 10 2011, 02:13 PM

I've been paying attention to company names near me.

Happy Harry Discount Drugs
Horizon Services

I'm perfectly happy with a company calling itself Happy Corporation

Posted by: Sengir Jan 10 2011, 03:20 PM

http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=33912&view=findpost&p=1027406

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 10 2011, 05:23 PM

?

Posted by: Ascalaphus Jan 10 2011, 05:38 PM

He means he got there first.

Posted by: Ascalaphus Jan 10 2011, 05:38 PM

He means he got there first.

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 10 2011, 06:26 PM

Okay, found the two little words after several times of re-reading the post in question.

Posted by: Dreadlord Jan 12 2011, 04:52 PM

I worked across the street from the most hilarious company name ever: Flim-Flam Auto Sales. I asked around and apparently that was truth in advertising, the guy ran a very crooked used car business. It went under not long after.

Posted by: Doc Byte Jan 12 2011, 05:12 PM

Maybe a TDE player?

Posted by: Machiavelli Jan 12 2011, 05:44 PM

THAT!!! But the disadvantage of this kind of behaviour is, that you never find an employee if you really need one to actually help you. (Yeah OBI-hardware-store, i am talking about YOU)^^

Posted by: Adarael Jan 12 2011, 06:12 PM

That's not just Germans, I assure you. As an american, that's what *I* want, too.

Posted by: CanRay Jan 12 2011, 06:52 PM

I have a way of handling those people: "Hello, can I help you?" "Are you a licensed psychotherapist with experience dealing with clinical depression and anxiety disorder?" "Um..." "Then, no, you can't help me."

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 12 2011, 07:49 PM

Super friendly staff is in large part intended as a flimsy cover for the fact that constantly supervising people helps cut down on petty shoplifting.

Posted by: CanRay Jan 12 2011, 10:54 PM

Oh, right, the "Treat everyone as a criminal" thing.

Stores back home found out that banning large purses and students school bags soon ended with them not having those people as customers. Especially the students, due to them having their entire lives in their bags.

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 13 2011, 03:39 AM

Yeah, the US has discovered that people will tolerate a lot more crap if it's disguised.







-k

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 13 2011, 06:01 PM

Oh, some people got mad about that stuff here too. Thing is, if virtually every store does that policy your options are basically you either stop buying things or to leave the bag in your car and suck it up. And ultimately, a lot of just don't really mind the idea that employees are expected to keep an eye out for shoplifting.

Posted by: CanRay Jan 13 2011, 09:04 PM

Car?

Car?

HA!

Students in Northern Ontario are lucky to have a car. And, if they do, they're likely living in it due to tuition.

Posted by: Whipstitch Jan 13 2011, 09:35 PM

College towns tend to make allowances for that sort of thing. Honestly though, I didn't really know anyone who practically had a bag grafted to their hip when I was in college. Plus, if I was a store owner, I'd say starving college students would be number 2 after high school students on the list of customers I wouldn't mind alienating. Beyond that, there's a difference between having signs and store policies and actually enforcing them. Most stores don't want you lugging around a bag big enough to stow hundreds of dollars worth of merchandise in, but that doesn't mean every one who works there is willing to raise a fuss over a messenger bag.

That, and where I went everyone either had a full ride scholarship or parents who didn't mind buying you a car. I don't really know anybody who ever had a problem with the situation, except for a black guy I knew, and that wasn't really about the bag but rather about the old dude behind the counter being a dick.

Posted by: Fatum Jan 13 2011, 11:02 PM

Well, I guess if you have to nitpick, Arsenal has a sub Partisan built on "Krasnay Sormova" shipyards. The first word looks like a Russian adjective, but it's not in any form that exists in the language.
There is, however, a real shipyard, and one of the largest in ex-USSR at that, "Krasnoe Sormovo".
Also, Mostran KVP-27T seems to be produced by the descendant of Mostrans, which is the agency operating Moscow's public transit. But eh, who knows, now they service buses, 70 years forward, they build hovercraft, why not.

Posted by: Adarael Jan 13 2011, 11:18 PM

Probably a case of someone not transliterating the names properly. That happens all the time, my ladykins assures me. I know in terms of Japanese names, I have often looked at them and gone, "That is not a name. That is a word, but not someone's name."

As for Monstran KVP-27T, I think it's probably a dropped S in terms of misspellings. I remember having a PC who had a Mostrans hovercraft back in 2nd edition; I suspect the KVP-27T is just the 4th edition version of whatever hovercraft that was.

Posted by: Fatum Jan 13 2011, 11:23 PM

As a matter of fact, isn't playing with the different ways the same hieroglyphs can be pronounced kinda traditional in Japanese naming? I remember seeing something about that when I read on Japanese ink artists.


Yeah, I figured as much, it's just kinda surprising how they changed their profile. But eh, if MiG makes hovercraft (and no planes), why not Mostrans.

Posted by: Adarael Jan 14 2011, 05:12 PM

Yes, absolutely. Without spending a lot of time getting into the whys and wherefores and hows, there's a lot of linguistic play that happens in terms of using the wrong kanji to call out homophones, so while you would literally read a phrase as "Purple Monkey Dishwasher" because of the kanji, phonetically it sounds like "Screw your mom." I have a jacket that's embroidered with ten tons of it, and it's incredibly strange to read until you start *saying* it.

But in terms of some of the Japanese NPCs and families having ... unusual names... it's not that kind of play. It's rather that they have words as names which would never be used as names. Equivalent to - and please forgive me if these aren't conjugated right - naming Russian NPCs things like "Igor Zaftra" or 'Oleg Panimayu". Words that would never be used as family names. For instance, the Shiawase family? I've never heard of anyone being named Shiawase. It's a good corporate name, but not a family name. Korin Yamana? That's an okay PC name, except Korin and Yamana are both family names, or at the very least Korin is a family name 99% of the time. There were a couple of others, but I can't remember them off the top of my head.

Honestly, it's not as egregous as the German naming conventions seem to be, but I think some of that can be chalked up the fact that the problem with the Japanese names is that they're not correct names, while the German names are actually linguistically correct, but sound retarded.

Posted by: Kagetenshi Jan 14 2011, 05:34 PM

With a few exceptions, where it's actually much worse (the Kogeki and Jigoku, or Corporate Download's Ganbare Aerospace, Wakatta Software, and Ressha Corporation).

~J

Posted by: Adarael Jan 14 2011, 05:37 PM

Yeah, numberically less instances, but where it's bad, it's just like, "Man, WHAT?"

Posted by: MYST1C Jan 15 2011, 09:15 AM

There's an assault rifle that has been around since the good old Street Samurai Catalog - the Samopal vz/88V, described as "the assault rifle of the Czech mechanized infantry".

While the name of the gun is obviously modeled on the real-life Samopal vz. 58 it has a problem: "Samopal" is not, as one might think, a company name! It is the classification of the weapon - Samopal vzor 58 means "submachine gun, model of 1958" (by Eastern Bloc naming conventions assault rifles are SMGs due to the ammo being smaller than full-size rifle ammo). The actual manufacturer of these rifles was the state-owned Česká zbrojovka plant.

Posted by: Fatum Jan 15 2011, 02:09 PM

And there's a number of CZ-produced arms in the books, too.

Also, I don't know about your part of the Eastern Bloc, but in Soviet Union (and, thus, Russia) the SMGs using pistol ammo are named "пистолет-пулемет" ("pistol-machinegun", heh, as far as I am aware it's pretty much a translation of "Maschinenpistole"), and assault rifles are named "автомат" (with formal versions of "автоматическая винтовка" and "автоматический карабин", which translate to "autorifle" and "automatic carbine", respectively).

Posted by: KarmaInferno Jan 15 2011, 02:15 PM

Yeah, there's a similar issue with the more recent AA-16. The author pretty clearly didn't bother to do even basic research on the weapon he was basing it on, the AA-12. Otherwise he would have immediately realized that the "12" in the name isn't a model number, it's a reference to the gauge of shot shell the weapon loads. And in Shotgun Gauges, a bigger number means a smaller shell.

Then again, Shadowrun historically has often had folks writing guns that really don't know much about the subject, given the glaring errors that abound in many firearms in the books. In previous editions, that might have been a bit more excusable.

But today? Come on, it takes two minutes of searching to get detailed info on any firearm you care to name, with extensive commentary on the background and history surrounding them. Getting the info right should be part of the damn job.




-k

Posted by: raben-aas Feb 8 2011, 01:53 PM

Two minutes may actually be too much.

I just came across the new map pack for Call of Duty: Black Ops – which, in comparison with CGL/Shadowrun, is like about a gazillion trillion billion phantastillion times more successful and has about the same times the amount of ca$h to burn on artists and guys that come up with foreign texts for foreign maps.

Behold and count all the crap German words and other (historical) mistakes there, and weep.
http://www.g4tv.com/videos/51077/Berlin-Wall-Map-Guide---Black-Ops-First-Strike-Walkthrough/

What I found in this vid so far:
– The "Täglich Zeitung" (Daily Paper), which would actually be the "Tageszeitung"
– "Grausam" (Cruel) as a product name (or whatever commercial) on a wall
– "Berg Hirsch" (Mountain Stag, maybe a pun at Mountain Dew (Deer)) as name for a brewery
– Yellow 80ies style telephone booths that should not be in a 60ies setting
– ‎"Damensattel – Herbst Stilen sind jetzt im Verkauf" Uh. Yes.
– ‎"Aktuelle Mode von Nikolaus Pappas" – okay, I dunno why there's a reference for a greek basketball player in there, but what the hell... can be explained away as being an Easter Egg
– there's graffitti on the Wall. Not very likely at the time. Also: Not in 80ies/90is ghetto style.
– in the record shop: "DER Doktortitel und Freunds" (band name) with "stärke durch ordnung" (song name)

And that's just from the vid. Wait til I download that thing and take a closer look

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Feb 8 2011, 02:25 PM

Well, the developers of Black Ops did not make their homework from the start or didn't even bother with historical accuracy in the first place.

laser dots in sixties? an israeli Galil assault rifle in the 60's when the weapon began production in the 70's? And that's just what I remember from the top of my head.

Posted by: raben-aas Feb 8 2011, 02:36 PM

The difference being that guns are just a side aspect of SR, while they are about the only topic of CoD, and that CoD is about x times larger than SR and could easily hire professional translators (and should have some gun nuts on their payroll), and that the game STILL sells like crack no matter what errors there are.

Yes, that could be solid proof that SR fans aremuch more sophisticated. I'm not arguing that, neither am I implying that CoD should be the role model of game design for paper and pen RPGs

Matter of fact: I don't know what I'm saying (it's my way). Maybe: Cool it a little. SR is still a fun game to play even with the Vogelhund, so let's all drink a Berg Hirsch, buy another Grausam and relax reading the Täglich Zeitung while listening to DER Doktortitel und Freunds.

Posted by: Sengir Feb 8 2011, 03:00 PM

In PC games it might actually be be done on purpose, an in-joke alluding to the (inadvertently) crappy German in old games like Wolf3D or old WW2 movies.

Posted by: Kagetenshi Feb 8 2011, 03:06 PM

Ach! Mein Leben!

Edit: nothing to see here, move along.

~J

Posted by: Sengir Feb 8 2011, 03:07 PM

Leben

Posted by: sabs Feb 8 2011, 03:12 PM

I AM jelly Donut!

Posted by: Sengir Feb 8 2011, 03:15 PM

He's a Nazi, get him! [/grampa]

Posted by: sabs Feb 8 2011, 03:21 PM

John F Kennedy was a Nazi?

Posted by: Sengir Feb 8 2011, 03:27 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7CtI8nx1Wc

Posted by: raben-aas Feb 8 2011, 04:06 PM

OK, so crappy German names are actually by the same token an inside joke, as they are in reference to crappy German words in earlier SR editions? Yeah, that sounds plausible. Go, Nachtmachen!

Posted by: Fatum Feb 8 2011, 09:28 PM

You don't get to complain, at least they got your alphabet right.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Feb 8 2011, 09:32 PM

Only because it is the same alphabet the whole ocidental world uses

Posted by: Fatum Feb 8 2011, 10:08 PM

Ö really?

Posted by: Stahlseele Feb 8 2011, 10:18 PM

yäh really!
edit: i hate myself for having written that <.<

Posted by: Fatum Feb 8 2011, 10:25 PM

Öh dön't be ßüch a häter.

...and that is pretty much how Cyrillic is used in the popular media.

Posted by: Stahlseele Feb 8 2011, 10:52 PM

ok, now i hate YOU more for writing that . .

Posted by: Sengir Feb 9 2011, 04:27 PM

Well, not everybody who's acting like an idiot does so because he is conciously parodying one...

Posted by: Fatum Feb 9 2011, 07:35 PM

Фн яigнт cфmrade, aт leasт iт's pфssiвle тф яead шiтнфuт guessing шнaт the нell iт's suppфsed to мeaи.

Also, hat off to raben-aas for his Russian in the Berlin sourcebook - as I've already said in his DA comments, it's both hilarious, awesome and grammatically perfect.

Posted by: Adarael Feb 9 2011, 07:46 PM

Oh, man, I hear that. My ladykins goes absolutely *nuts* every time someone uses "faux russian" fonts like this one: http://www.fontgarden.com/archive/s/soviet.gif

She always tries to actually read it in russian, and then goes, "OH GOD WHAT DID THEY DO."
(In all fairness, it's hilarious to watch.)

Posted by: KarmaInferno Feb 9 2011, 08:15 PM

Well, according to the developers, they "explain" that these are not production models of the weapons in many cases, but the "secret prototype" models that often made their way into Black Ops hands for field testing.

˙sʍǝıʌɹǝʇuı ǝɥʇ uı pıɐs ʎǝɥʇ ʇɐɥʍ s,ʇɐɥʇ 'ǝɯ ʇɐ ʞooן ʇ,uop 'ʎǝɥ

I did find it humorous that the anachronistic H&K G11 clearly has the two extra spare magazines modeled onto the weapon (they sit to the left and right of the loaded magazine), but when reloading the character pulls another magazine from somewhere else instead of using the spares. Also, the spares are still clearly there if you are "out of ammo".


-k

Posted by: Kid Chameleon Feb 9 2011, 09:51 PM

Thanks to heavy metal, yes.

Posted by: Stahlseele Feb 9 2011, 10:24 PM

Mötörhead! *bangs head and throws up the horns*

Posted by: Wordman Feb 9 2011, 10:33 PM

http://shop.cubicle7store.com/epages/es113347.sf/en_GB/?ObjectPath=/Shops/es113347_shop/Products/CB76300

Posted by: 230 Grains of Therapy Apr 24 2011, 02:49 PM

Most street names are pretty silly. I had a character named Juicy Puke once.

Posted by: CanRay Apr 24 2011, 02:55 PM

Well, I have http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=34367 and http://forums.dumpshock.com/index.php?showtopic=34790...

Posted by: longbowrocks Apr 24 2011, 07:37 PM

Probably most places. Why?

Posted by: Stahlseele Apr 24 2011, 07:44 PM

'cause it's par for the course ^^

Posted by: Kyoto Kid Apr 27 2011, 03:29 AM

...and was nicknamed the "Jug" because of its shape.

Posted by: CanRay Apr 27 2011, 05:16 AM

The US does have a tendency of making flying tanks.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Apr 27 2011, 11:56 AM

So will they be the first to create Banshees?

Posted by: CanRay Apr 27 2011, 03:25 PM

Nah, that'd be the Russians. The US makes flying tanks of airplanes. The Russians make flying tanks of helicopters.

Posted by: Stahlseele Apr 27 2011, 03:35 PM

And Germany makes flying tanks out of tanks.

Posted by: mattness pl Aug 18 2011, 03:59 PM

I think the name is word play on Fuji (the company pretty well known in 80s), similiar to Microsoft alter ego (Microdeck, CEO's name: Brian Gates III)

Posted by: CanRay Aug 18 2011, 04:13 PM

Speaking of, I want to see more MicroDeck in Shadowrun. I think they were in one of the PDF-Only items that's now coming to DTF.

...

Yes, I'm bitter.

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 18 2011, 04:25 PM

I think they were mentioned a bit in Prime Runners.
Also, when they canceled SRO, i made an alternate history of the second crash abusing them.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 18 2011, 04:32 PM

http://fromtheshadowsrpg.blogspot.com/2008/06/microdeck-returns-to-operating-system.html

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 18 2011, 04:38 PM

Mitnick, Kevin Mitnick, Hackers 2 or 3, was it?

Posted by: CanRay Aug 18 2011, 04:44 PM

http://mitnicksecurity.com/

Posted by: Irion Aug 18 2011, 05:16 PM

Well, I guess because Germans do not tend to name their weapons in German. Heckler und Koch is just using Numbers and some letters.
MP4 (Maschienen pistole 5).
Same goes for most submarines beeing called U-boot(Submarine) Klasse 212A.
The only name I remember is the Dolphin Klasse (Yes, dolphin is the english word, delphin would be the german one). I am not deep into military history, but I guess it has something to do with the fact, that the german Military has around 48.000 Millions to spend per year (compared to the american with 900.000 millions).
Those numbers alone are not helpfull, but lets take a look at the amount of sold weapons:
USA: 6900 Millions (2010)
Germany: 3100 millions (2010) (based on the prices of 1990)
So you see the amount of sold weapons to military is quite different in Germany. So I guess we just do not care about giving the weapons german names...
Thats why I guess most germans are not used to naming stuff in german but in english... (Honestly I am waiting for the first german rifle to be named in arab (since the middle east is a hell of a market))

So it is just, that germans are not used to name products in german, we mostly use english for that I guess.
@KarmaInferno

Sorry, but on this topic it is quite wrong. Since at this point germay is kind of "special" in naming his products mostly in english. Compare it to France if you like:
English: the computer
German: Der Computer
Frensh: l'ordinateur
(Well, the Frech might be a bit special too, since they tend bend backwards to "translate" anything in their language.
(As I explained to Whipstitch those names do exist in german...)

@Whipstitch

We have those too.
Schäferhund (shepherd dog)
Herdenhund (cattle dog) is also known.
Lawinenhund(avalanchedog)
It is however correct, that we do not use the combination of to animals often. (On the other hand, I just do not know my way around hunting so I might miss a lot)
In german you have more often (Task/Owner) (animal).
Schäferhund (dog of the shepherd)
Spürhund (dog who snifs out stuff)
Blindenhund (dog for the blind)
Hauskatze (cat who lives in the house)

But I would not but my hand into the fire, that the expression vogelhund does not exist...
(Googled it, it does exist: http://www.dfo-nrw.de/m200.php/)
(When I was once on an exchange in america I visited an american german class, and all the german students went like "what did the teacher just say"?
We looked it up and the word existed but, you know, out of use for a hundred years or so.)

So it stands to reason, that some germans do see their own language as strange.

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 18 2011, 07:16 PM

Some of our weapons actually DO have german names . . but usually, those are not official and given to the weapon by grunts who (have to) use it.
MG 42: Hitlersäge
G36: Legogewehr
and so on and so on . .

Posted by: Irion Aug 18 2011, 08:00 PM

@Stahlseele
Which reminds of something. Germany is only about 22 years old. Freaking christ.
And our constitution is cheated, damn it.

Well, I guess "Hitlersäge" is something you should not say if some guy with a Kamera is near by...
Could get you thrown off the force.

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 18 2011, 08:19 PM

highly improbable.
also, if you wanna skirt the issue, just call it knochensäge. the full name is hitlers knochensäge.

Posted by: Irion Aug 18 2011, 08:27 PM

I was not really serious, I admit it.

Posted by: Machiavelli Aug 19 2011, 08:15 AM

Ah, the good old fries-question. I am fat enough to know a bit about the different fast-food-chains and fries are definitely something that doesn´t rely on the chain you are in. It heavily depends on the employees and their day-form. We have some McD restaurants here where you cannot eat the fries while others make outstanding ones. Same goes for BK and all other competitors. The real difference are the burgers and the corresponding sauces. All the "side-items" are next to meaningless. You have to have them, but nobody goes there just because of the fries...at least not the majority.

Posted by: Seriously Mike Aug 19 2011, 01:15 PM

Heh, it reminded me of my old blog post about using real company names in future systems without much thinking (if you want, I can translate it to English, now I'll just give the short version). It's one of my pet peeves, especially when it comes to weapons. I mean, cars, all right, "Chrysler-Nissan Jackrabbit" may be a bit much to put on the trunk hatch, but it sounds plausible. But when they confuse designer's name or weapon designation with company name, or change one or two letter "just so", that's where I call BS. CP2020 caught more flak, but Shadowrun also pulled a howler with the Ingram guns. Gordon Ingram was just a designer, and the companies who produced his guns were something else entirely. Also, some companies (mostly American) get no respect - for instance, I saw a lot of Colt guns, some Ruger guns, but barely any Smith&Wesson or Springfield.

And then there's that bit about lazy graphic artists...

Posted by: CanRay Aug 19 2011, 01:49 PM

The artists for the new Gun Haven Heaven for the new firearms. *Shudders*

Posted by: Fatum Aug 19 2011, 02:05 PM

Those weren't procedurely generated on a computer? :O

Posted by: CanRay Aug 19 2011, 02:08 PM

I'm guessing someone's niece with crayons, myself.

Posted by: Fatum Aug 19 2011, 02:18 PM

I was thinking pseudorandom. Like some Markov chains applied to gun graphics or something like that.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 19 2011, 02:32 PM

From what I remember of my chaos mathematics pertaining to random generators, they can't make that kind of ugly.

Honestly, they're not bad. They'd be decent pics for Star Wars blasters or some other sci-fi game. But, as firearms... *Shakes Head*

Posted by: Sengir Aug 19 2011, 03:13 PM

While it's called "reunification", technically it was an accession of the DDR to the Federal Republic.

Anyway, Attitude seems to introduce quite a volume of new brand names, but nobody spotted a major blunder yet? I'm disappointed...

Posted by: Seriously Mike Aug 19 2011, 03:32 PM

Are you talking about http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/product_info.php?products_id=92357? If yes, I would fire every last one of those morons. They took photos of toys in worst quality available, and didn't even bother to edit out the screws! Just look at the sample pics: first pistol, a generic China-made toy BB gun. Second pistol, a bad China-made knockoff of a toy BB SIG P226 Railframe (and the 226 is considered a full-size service pistol). Seriously, I'm supposed to PAY for this load of crap?
Oh, and then there's that fifth... something. I could design something better and I'm not even a really talented artist (I do draw from time to time, though).

Posted by: raben-aas Aug 22 2011, 10:08 AM

That's actually a pretty tricky question. You see, in English there is this obviously German dog called the "Dachshund", because it's a hunting dog bred to hunt badgers (Dachse). The problem being: This dog isn't called Dachshund in Germany AT ALL!

It's called "Dackel" here.

Of course, it WAS called Dachshund somewhere down the line (AND STILL IS among hunters!! – yes, fellow Germans, Dachshund is indeed the correct name of the Dackel – or Teckel – deal with it) but that name just went out of popular use in Germany a long while ago.

Now, if a German that just happens to not be a professional hunter is shown the word "Dachshund" it just reads as two animals that were glued together for no reason. NO ONE will make the connection with a dog that was bred for hunting badgers, EVERY ONE will think that this is supposed to refer to some horror animal made by crossing badgers and dogs, EVEN THOUGH we still have the Schäferhund (shepherd's dog or German Shepherd) that is neither a crossbreed of a shepherd and a dog (although herding sheep can get lonely...) nor is it a dog bred to hunt shepherds.

Anyway: If even the correct, but not publicy known "Dachshund" sounds awfully wrong to Germans now, you can well imagine that a Vogelhund sounds even worse (it's the kid of a dog that humped a duck, okay?). If the intention was to name the vehicle after a possible German hunting dog bred to fetch birds the hunter shot down, the "correct" name would have been "Retriever", because that is indeed the correct name in German!

Go figure languages....

Posted by: raben-aas Aug 22 2011, 10:14 AM

Thank you so very very much!

I should note that I do not speak a single word of Russian. I found these tags/sentences/citations by RESEARCH (come on, game developers, look the term up). I went through a wide selection of Russian translation and Russian youth slang websites, digging up useful bits, then CROSS CHECKING THEM by entering the same words/sentences into search engines and looking for other websites that use this grammatical construction.

Only when I found SEVERAL independent websites using the same jargon/grammar/words did I DARE to use it (same goes with the Turkish, Arabic and other foreign bits in my pix).

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 22 2011, 10:33 AM

German Thoroughness!

Posted by: CanRay Aug 22 2011, 03:13 PM

They do seem exceptionally sub-par, indeed.
But that would take time and effort.

Seriously, even back when I was a researcher, that's an exceptional bit of work, especially for a language that doesn't even use the same characters your own does. Congratulations and thanks!Maybe that's why the Germans are getting the good Shadowrun stuff?

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 22 2011, 03:22 PM

Probably.
Beim Thema Deutsche Gründlichkeit, da weiss man halt bescheid.

Posted by: Bigity Aug 22 2011, 06:35 PM

I don't know what you said.

All I know is that Germans seem to be as good at making SR as they are at making beer, and that's all I need to know really.

Posted by: Sengir Aug 22 2011, 08:55 PM

We can do bad beer (Adelskronen after three days in the sun, yummy), and we can do Shadowrun stuff like the old uber gear and smurfs

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 22 2011, 09:06 PM

Dude, if you leave ANY beer 3 days in the sun, it's going to become bad beer . . Hell, some beer may actually no longer be beer but a thriving micro civilization after that time . .

Posted by: CanRay Aug 22 2011, 09:14 PM

Alternately, some beer might be better if you poured it back into the horse it came out of.

...

Well, the world would be, at the very least.

Posted by: Fatum Aug 22 2011, 09:16 PM

For all I know pretty much all sorts of Russian beer don't become any better or worse after being left in the sun for any length of time...

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 22 2011, 09:24 PM

russian beer?
don't you mean vodka?
that stuff is pretty resistant to all kinds of stuff . .

Posted by: Sengir Aug 22 2011, 09:33 PM

Well, you wouldn't think that something which only gets sold in plastic bottles at Penny (bottom quarter of the no-frills stores in Germany) can get much worse...

Also, that was after the Maiden massacre on Wacken '08...already couldn't move my arms like 15 meters behind the FoH tower, and judging by the look of raw panic in the eyes of the people who kicked and punched their way out it wasn't getting better farther to the front. By the time we got out of that, I wasn't exactly picky when someone offered me a beer.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 22 2011, 09:34 PM

Except Russians.

I want some of Old Man Kalashnikov's Vodka, myself. But it apparently doesn't make it to Canada. He started making it due to the fact that the AK-Family became the favorite of terrorists, which pisses him off something fierce. (He was proud of the design as he created it to help soldiers defend his homeland. Which is a very noble thing, if you ask me.).

Posted by: Doc Byte Aug 22 2011, 09:44 PM

There was never a reunification. That's a myth. In fact the FRG bought the GDR from Russia.

Posted by: Traul Aug 22 2011, 10:05 PM

There is a way to tell them apart: the beer is the sparkling one.

Posted by: Medicineman Aug 23 2011, 06:18 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9cTXl5ApEk

and while we're at it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_WRFJwGsbY

with a dance in a Canoe
Medicineman

Posted by: Seriously Mike Aug 23 2011, 11:19 AM

While we're at ridiculous names, what does "pink mohawk" mean and where did it come from?

Posted by: Aerospider Aug 23 2011, 11:29 AM

It's used to refer to the kind of shadowrun players/characters/games the nature of which is to go in all guns blazing, causing chaos and carnage left, right and centre to get the job done in the most isn't-brute-force-fun way possible. Typically the consequences are either not explored or considered an acceptible price.

The alternative is dark shades, where the MO is focused heavily on subterfuge and shadowy operations using finesse and caution to a paranoid degree. This approach usually considers the consequences of being identified as the ultimate failure in a mission.

As for where it comes from – as I understand it, it's rooted in the '80s punk theme so prevalent in SR (less so now than with 1st edition) and other cyberpunk universes. Both the colour and the hairstyle give an impression of both punkness and stand-out-ish-ness.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Aug 23 2011, 11:55 AM

It comes from http://www.mynewhair.info/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/28-pink-hair.jpg

Posted by: Seriously Mike Aug 23 2011, 01:14 PM

*notes down*
"Contrary to popular belief, brute force actually is a viable alternative in some cases. Some people know better than messing with whackjobs who are willing to blow stuff up to achieve their goals and don't give a shit if someone recognizes them."

Posted by: Medicineman Aug 23 2011, 01:30 PM

watch the Movie Smokin Aces (I try to explain without spoiling) this Movie explains it better than a 100 Words
there is one Group totally "Pink Mohawk ",Alicia Keyes and her Partner are "Standard Shadowrunner"(subtle until drastic means are neccessary)
and the Killer who uses the disguises (Duel in the Elevator) is ...kinda "Shades & long Coat"


with one Dance instead of a Hundred Words
Medicineman

Posted by: Stahlseele Aug 23 2011, 01:43 PM

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xj1qei_robocop-the-animated-series-1988-ep01-crime-wave_shortfilms

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Aug 23 2011, 02:17 PM

That movie is awesome, plus, Alicia Keyes is hot

Posted by: Fatum Aug 23 2011, 02:37 PM

Nah, there's a simpler way - good Russian vodka actually exists.
As to the beer I mean, take Baltica for example, bleh.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 23 2011, 02:46 PM

Still doesn't explain why my hometown has a SWAT team when another bomb squad would have been much more useful.

Posted by: Dreadlord Aug 23 2011, 06:56 PM

Why would your town need more than 1 bomb sqad? I didn't know Dublin or Falluja was in Canada!

Posted by: Sengir Aug 23 2011, 07:01 PM

Depends on how they defuse the bombs, I guess

Posted by: Irion Aug 23 2011, 07:29 PM

Well, I always thought pink mohawk was only about loud and doing it with style.
Like I could shoot him an be effizient or I could run towards him and hit him in the face and kick him in the but afterwards.

If you kill people or not has, as far as I understood it, nothing to do with pink mohawk.

Pink mohawk is the obvious cyberarm with thousands of gimicks in it. The if you don't know shit, just hit someone and ask him.
If you would use D&D slang, pink mohawk is chaotic.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 23 2011, 09:10 PM

I grew up in a mining town. At least 1/3 of the population there either has the training to make and handle large amounts of explosives, or the ability to learn. Conservative estimate, at that.

Add to that the availability of high explosives...

Well, we already vaporized a transport truck once. Now, admittedly, that was a mistake and he "might" have been illegally carrying blasting caps with the full load of mining explosives ("Might" in this case meaning there's no evidence as it got all blowed up.), but still...

Posted by: Hound Aug 24 2011, 03:55 AM

Honestly I've always found Aztechnology to be easily the most ridiculous company name. I mean, I know what they're going for, they're Aztec and they like technology, but it just seems really odd to me.

pink mohawk also has connotations of ignoring some of the more paranoid aspects of Shadowrun. Many paranoid style players would avoid actually taking a life, in order to avoid sparking repercussions. Therefore, simply shooting someone could be considered more pink mohawk (especially if you do it with style!)

Posted by: CanRay Aug 24 2011, 03:58 AM

Maybe it makes more sense in Spanish?

Posted by: Hound Aug 24 2011, 04:01 AM

Lol... as far as I know, Aztec is just the name of a culture, no second meanings. It's even funnier cause like, it's not even a very family friendly culture to want to brand yourself with, what with all the human sacrificing and such.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 24 2011, 04:12 AM

So? You think Ásatrú is? There are people today that are happy to show their faith in that.

Smile politely and nod when they explain that, by the way.

Posted by: Fatum Aug 24 2011, 06:54 AM

First, Aztechnology is a deliberate wordplay, a thing not unheard of in company names.
Second, general public does not know about the blood magic, human sacrifices and samesuch. Sure they sacrifice flowers and sometimes animals, but it's their culture, chummer, have some respect!

Posted by: Hound Aug 24 2011, 11:00 AM

That's true, I'm not hating on either religion, however, how many companies do you see associating themselves with Odin?


I dunno, I would say it goes the other way, especially with magic appearing. Practically the only thing I know about the Aztec tradition is that it involves human sacrifice and sometimes demands self-mutilation from it's priests. If some of that stuff started coming out of history books and appearing in the news it would become more common knowledge. Then when you consider that it is the most extreme aspects of any given subject which determine the view that Joe Public is likely to have on it, I would say most people would associate Aztecs and blood magic pretty strongly in 2070.

All in all, I think Shiawase is a fairly realistic name for a corporation. It's bland, it isn't likely to offend a significant number of people and it has obvious good connotations. Aztechnology seems creepy and possibly disturbing, which I'm sure is exactly what the writers were going for, as that also fits the personality of the corp pretty well. The Azzies have a reputation for ferocious pragmatism, only thinly disguised by the trappings of a corporation, correct?

Posted by: Seriously Mike Aug 24 2011, 01:02 PM

Did we already discuss "Zugwagen"? I don't speak German, but I can recognize a bad fake anyway. "Traincar", c'mon...
Also, what's Stuffer Shack exactly? A convenience store or a fast-food joint? It's a pretty crappy name in both cases, but with convenience store, it's definitely crappier.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Aug 24 2011, 01:31 PM

As far as I know, Stuffer Shack is a convenience store.
Also, Aztlan does human sacrifices in their temples and in a rather public way, all public sacrifices are of criminals (specially scape-goats that can be labeled as "traitors").
Aztechnology does embrace its Aztlan heritage but they spin the public's opinion enough that most people just think of them as the food supplier of the world.

Posted by: Kirk Aug 24 2011, 01:59 PM

That reminds me... Have they started their soylent line of food products yet?

Posted by: pbangarth Aug 24 2011, 02:15 PM

The incorporation of the word "Aztec" in the name of Aztechnology is a wonderful example of the tradition of adapting/re-interpreting ancient symbols and imagery for modern purposes. You don't have to look hard to find examples of it in our culture.

The usage is even self-referential, as the name Aztec was given by moderns to the ancient people who, as far as we know, never used that name for themselves. We built it from "Aztlan", which was their mythical place of origin, somewhere to the north of their empire, probably around the modern border between Mexico and the United States, and "-tec", meaning people in the Nahuatl language.

Blood sacrifice was a religious tradition throughout the whole Mesoamerican region, including the Maya, Zapotecs, Mixtecs and whole bunch of other peoples. It was considered necessary in order to feed the gods, who needed the energy to keep the world going. No blood sacrifice = weakened gods = end of world.

The Aztecs stepped it up to a whole new level, using human sacrifice also as a justification for imperial conquest, and as a tool of terrorism and oppression. Imagine this scene:

*****
An annual festival in Tenochtitlán is held, to which all the conquered chiefs and kings are 'invited'. The huge main square, dominated by temples and palaces on all sides, is lined with tables of food and drink, at which the dignitaries are seated. Acrobats, dancers and singers perform in the open space in the middle. Each temple is occupied at the top by priests, and lines of tributary captives from all the vassal states represented here snake up one of each temple's massive stairways. The priests are working non-stop, stretching the captives one-by-one across a giant stone, slicing their chests and tearing out their hearts, tossing them onto sacred fires and dumping the lifeless bodies down another set of steep steps to accumulate at the bottom. Music, dancing, singing, slicing, thump-thumping of bodies. And the smell. The smell of thousands of bloodied corpses and burning hearts.

And the message: We can do this to your people any time we want, and there is nothing you can do about it.
*****

This is the tradition to which the SR corporation subscribes.

Posted by: Doc Byte Aug 24 2011, 02:44 PM

A "Zugwagen" can mean a "railroad car", but more frequently it's used with reference to a towing vehicle (esp. when towing a caravan or something similar), while we call the railroad car simply a "wag(g)on".

And just for fun: A tractor unit would be a Zugmaschine and a locomotive a Triebwagen.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 24 2011, 03:01 PM

Monoc Security Services.

Posted by: Fatum Aug 24 2011, 07:28 PM

You forget that the Azzies have the best spin specialists around. Okay, second only to Horizon. So Joe Average thinks of them as the people who feed him with their super-energetic choc bars, not as blood mages and killers. It's mentioned in the fluff several times, too.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 24 2011, 07:51 PM

Horizon's the new kid on the block, and specialize in Spin. Aztechnology, at it's core, is still an agricultural and pharmaceutical business. It's that Narco-Terror Gang Front origin.

Just like Saeder-Krupp's main industries are Heavy Metals and Industrial Manufacturing, Ares Macrotechnology is in munitions and automotive construction, and NeoNET's is figuring out a new name for itself (Oh, and computer hardware and software.).

Anyhow, for AZT to have to have such a massive spin department for a company whose primary interest is *FOOD*, well, that should tell you something right there.

...

Or that I'm getting into Plan 9-level conspiracy thinking.

Posted by: Sengir Aug 24 2011, 08:04 PM

In SR (and most other fictional universes) product names from various mythologies seem to be quite popular...


And most of what we know about these practices is from Christian missionaries, who obviously were prone to overstating the evils of the old faiths. Which again makes it easy to dismiss such stories altogether as "propaganda by the imperialists who butchered our people"

Posted by: CanRay Aug 24 2011, 08:31 PM

Yeah, I'm still not taking any invites to a "Party in my honor" at the top of any of the AZT Pyramids, slot you very much.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Aug 24 2011, 08:42 PM

Aztlaner Priest: "Oh come on, CanRay, stop being a whiny boy, no one is going to kill you in there."
CanRay: "And what is this dying screams I hear in there?"
Aztlaner Priest: "Oh, that? They are just uhm... they are just pranking him with hot wax and shave him, no one is gutting anybody and throwing their hearts in a pire, no sire, no gutting in there."
CanRay: "Ah, ok!"

Posted by: CanRay Aug 24 2011, 08:43 PM

I'm a Canadian Civilian, not stupid.

Crazy, but not stupid.

Posted by: Sengir Aug 24 2011, 09:21 PM

Blood Mage Gestalt: This is exactly what you want to do *waves hand*

Posted by: CanRay Aug 24 2011, 10:17 PM

This is what I want to do. *Waves foot into groin* I'm hardly a weak minded fool.

Posted by: Seriously Mike Aug 25 2011, 06:58 AM

Derp, 's what I meant, I confused "train" with "rail" ("zug" literally means "train", but translating "zugwagen" gave me the "railroad car" result and some synonyms).
Also, going through the splatbooks I find typos all over the place. Shitty names are one thing, editor doing a sloppy job is another.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 25 2011, 07:08 AM

It's not just RPG books, editing has gone to hell in all printed media.

My Great Aunt was an editor par excellence (Amongst other things in her life), and what she has to say about the "Professional" work done in novels and newspapers today compared to what they were even ten years ago could fill a book.

If she had more gumption (She's retired), she probably and quite literally would fill a book, and likely get it printed, as well. Without typos or editing errors. (Printers errors, OTOH...).

Funny thing is, I mention "Gonzo Journalism" to her, and her face lights up, "Ah!", and you know there's still a lot of spirit in the old girl. ... Actually, you know that anyhow, it just comes to the surface more with certain topics.

Posted by: Fatum Aug 25 2011, 11:24 AM

The problem with RPG books and typos is that the typos are rarely if ever corrected in the new printings of the books.

Posted by: Kirk Aug 25 2011, 12:49 PM

Well, who needs editors when you have spellcheckers. And grammar checkers. I mean, do you know what those people charge just to check spelling and grammar?

(Sarcasm, in case you couldn't tell.)

Posted by: CanRay Aug 25 2011, 03:34 PM

They're not corrected on webpages of newspapers or in later print runs of novels, either.

Posted by: Fatum Aug 25 2011, 03:56 PM

In the latter case, yes they are. In Soviet Union, you also had a chance to get a small sheet of paper with typos listed even for the first printing, put there by the after-print control.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Aug 25 2011, 05:55 PM

And what about Russia?

Also, in Soviet Union, you get "errata-ed".
Sorry, couldn't help it.

Posted by: PittsburghRPGA Aug 25 2011, 06:10 PM

I can tell, but some folks might not know just how much an editor gets in the rpg field.

In the rpg industry, typically a penny a word and usually, a copy of the final product too.

Seems fairly standard too.

Of course, this also requires the project manager to accept all of your edits, which doesn't always happen. Or stop them from sending the pre-edit version to the printers by mistake.

Cordially,

Eric Kiefer
Co-Editor Player's Guide to Blackmoor, Editor Riders of the Hak.

Posted by: Fatum Aug 25 2011, 06:23 PM

In Russia, it's a free-for-all. Books printed on just-barely-not-toilet paper, riddled with translation errors, typos, and just errors the author made cause he can't even use his native tongue properly are all sights all too common.
The Internet is making it better, sure, with the kind of people to buy that kind of books preferring e-readers and pirating books...

Also, if in Soviet Union, you get errata-ed, what, in the rest of the world, the errata gets you?

Posted by: CanRay Aug 25 2011, 06:45 PM

Oh, you'd love me and my work then.

Posted by: Kirk Aug 25 2011, 09:24 PM

Cripes, you're underpaid. But knowing what I do of the RPG (heck, the whole gaming) industry that's not an atypical thing.

Posted by: CanRay Aug 25 2011, 09:25 PM

Hell, in this economy, it's great to have any job...