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Dumpshock Forums _ Shadowrun _ Truck Heist - MW3

Posted by: Blog Nov 7 2011, 10:54 PM

http://www.pcgamer.com/2011/11/07/thieves-hijack-a-truckload-full-of-modern-warfare-3/

Truckload of Modern Warefare 3 hijacked, different cargo but still a classic run setup.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 7 2011, 10:55 PM

There's big money in video games. And easier to sell on the street than cigarettes in today's market, I bet!

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 7 2011, 11:09 PM

Now I feel small-time for planning on how to steal from a McDonalds truck for Monopoly game pieces.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 7 2011, 11:36 PM

One of my Zombie Plans back home required hijacking a beer truck.

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 8 2011, 12:08 AM

As much as I love beer, or ale, I would have to steal wine and scotch. Things that will last as long as my willpower will.

Posted by: MADness Nov 8 2011, 12:16 AM

The comments on the article even include a Shadow Run-esque conspiracy implication. Activision was behind the heists!

Posted by: CanRay Nov 8 2011, 12:28 AM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 7 2011, 08:08 PM) *
As much as I love beer, or ale, I would have to steal wine and scotch. Things that will last as long as my willpower will.
I was grabbing what would be a valuable commodity that I would have traded for an even more valuable commodity. You take what the market wants.
QUOTE (MADness @ Nov 7 2011, 08:16 PM) *
The comments on the article even include a Shadow Run-esque conspiracy implication. Activision was behind the heists!
Wouldn't put it past a company doing something like this for publicity, but I'd have thought they'd have done it in a different place, so it's more likely to be a legit hijacking.

Posted by: MADness Nov 8 2011, 12:31 AM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 7 2011, 07:28 PM) *
Wouldn't put it past a company doing something like this for publicity, but I'd have thought they'd have done it in a different place, so it's more likely to be a legit hijacking.


True, but that doesn't mean I don't want to base a run off of it!

Posted by: CanRay Nov 8 2011, 12:34 AM

Oh, not denying that.

Posted by: Saint Sithney Nov 8 2011, 02:58 AM

By the way, if there's a Microsoft store anywhere near you, you can get MW3 and $50 worth of gift cards for $55.

If you preorder from Microsoft, you get a $25 card, and if you show up to the midnight launch party at a Microsoft store to pick it up, you get another $25 gift card. Not quite the same as getting the game for 5 bux, but close.

Posted by: Manunancy Nov 8 2011, 06:38 AM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 8 2011, 01:28 AM) *
I was grabbing what would be a valuable commodity that I would have traded for an even more valuable commodity. You take what the market wants.


though in zombie apocalypse situations, trying to trade beer for guns and ammo looks like a good way to end with with no guns and no beer...

Posted by: Seriously Mike Nov 8 2011, 07:45 AM

QUOTE (MADness @ Nov 8 2011, 01:16 AM) *
The comments on the article even include a Shadow Run-esque conspiracy implication. Activision was behind the heists!

Strange, I'd expect EA wink.gif .

Posted by: TheOOB Nov 8 2011, 08:52 AM

QUOTE (Seriously Mike @ Nov 8 2011, 03:45 AM) *
Strange, I'd expect EA wink.gif .


Nah, they just force you to use Orgin, figure that's criminal enough.

Posted by: Seriously Mike Nov 8 2011, 09:05 AM

QUOTE (TheOOB @ Nov 8 2011, 09:52 AM) *
Nah, they just force you to use Orgin, figure that's criminal enough.

Diversification, man! Steal the shipment of competing game, so people buy your shit, sign up to your oppressive service, bam, two for the price of one!
Also, "on-rails shooter and popular multiplayer" - that's a below-the-belt strike worthy of Saints' Row The Third.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 8 2011, 03:22 PM

QUOTE (Manunancy @ Nov 8 2011, 02:38 AM) *
though in zombie apocalypse situations, trying to trade beer for guns and ammo looks like a good way to end with with no guns and no beer...
Actually, it was a pre-arranged deal with a good friend and his family. biggrin.gif

They also knew they'd need more hands to help with protection, as well as security and just general labor, so it wasn't a matter of trading beer for guns, it was trading beer and manhours for security, food, and firearms.

It's not who you know, it's who knows you.

Posted by: Blog Nov 8 2011, 04:32 PM

For those getting inspired to make this into a run of their own game I'll also share this tactic that our group used. We located a weigh station on the highway the truck was traveling that was not in use and got it working and did all procedures (thank you standard operating procedures manual). Target rolled in, had the drive come in to do some paperwork, stun to unconsciousness, grab what our client wanted from the truck (some art) and took off on the highway.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 8 2011, 05:16 PM

Great, now I have to see if Dad's old books made it here. Damnit.

Posted by: Tech_Rat Nov 9 2011, 04:55 PM

QUOTE (Blog @ Nov 8 2011, 11:32 AM) *
For those getting inspired to make this into a run of their own game I'll also share this tactic that our group used. We located a weigh station on the highway the truck was traveling that was not in use and got it working and did all procedures (thank you standard operating procedures manual). Target rolled in, had the drive come in to do some paperwork, stun to unconsciousness, grab what our client wanted from the truck (some art) and took off on the highway.


Blog, that is evil. As a driver. As a strategist, however. Very good.

"Driver, pull around for inspection and bring all your paperwork." *shudders* I hate hearing that phrase. Only downside. Did the truck have a tail? Most HiVal loads have a team in a non-descript car following the truck. And in some cases (viagra, even...) They may be(and often are) armed.

Posted by: Blog Nov 9 2011, 05:01 PM

Well one of our group members did drive trucks for a part of his life... so that helped with the decision.
The art collection in question wasn't something that high profile of a target to have an escort, Armored car, driver + armed guard. I suspect the piece had more value to the client then anything.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 9 2011, 06:13 PM

Just don't try to pass off a load of toilets when you're really hauling illegal firearms. The scales will tell them you're lying as soon as they see what you're "Really" hauling. nyahnyah.gif

Posted by: WhiskeyJohnny Nov 9 2011, 06:37 PM

QUOTE (Tech_Rat @ Nov 9 2011, 09:55 AM) *
Blog, that is evil. As a driver. As a strategist, however. Very good.

"Driver, pull around for inspection and bring all your paperwork." *shudders* I hate hearing that phrase. Only downside. Did the truck have a tail? Most HiVal loads have a team in a non-descript car following the truck. And in some cases (viagra, even...) They may be(and often are) armed.


The trick then, I think, would be to disguise one of your team as the driver (preferably the wheelman, with necessary hacker support to get around biometrics and whatever other security they've got), have them get in the truck, and then proceed to lose the tail (yeah, I know, losing a tail in a truck isn't going to be easy - unless you think in terms of stopping the tail, rather than maneuvering the truck itself) long enough to either unload the truck or swap trailers.

Posted by: Saint Hallow Nov 9 2011, 07:06 PM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 7 2011, 06:36 PM) *
One of my Zombie Plans back home required hijacking a beer truck.


Mine is raiding the distribution center featured http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_JP8FBBGns. It's huge, has tons of supplies, & it's own vehicle bays for loading/unloading. 1 stop shop for gas/fuel, food, drinks, & whatever else I could find there.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 9 2011, 07:27 PM

QUOTE (WhiskeyJohnny @ Nov 9 2011, 02:37 PM) *
(yeah, I know, losing a tail in a truck isn't going to be easy - unless you think in terms of stopping the tail, rather than maneuvering the truck itself)
The truck has a longer range than the car does. Wait until it has to pull in for fuel, stop next to it, then take off.

Tail lost at least long enough to switch loads. "Oh, sorry, thought you were done." Works really well when the driver is in the can, too.

FYI: Bring empty bottles so you don't have to visit the can.

Posted by: CanadianWolverine Nov 9 2011, 07:50 PM

I swear, some of you come up with such practical, pragmatic ideas that you really are professional non-corp takers and Shadowrun is fun for you because of future tech and magic. biggrin.gif LOL

Posted by: Tech_Rat Nov 9 2011, 07:53 PM

QUOTE (CanadianWolverine @ Nov 9 2011, 01:50 PM) *
I swear, some of you come up with such practical, pragmatic ideas that you really are professional non-corp takers and Shadowrun is fun for you because of future tech and magic. biggrin.gif LOL



I think it's your turn, CanRay. We can't let too many people catch on... wobble.gif

Posted by: Blog Nov 9 2011, 08:43 PM

QUOTE (WhiskeyJohnny @ Nov 9 2011, 01:37 PM) *
The trick then, I think, would be to disguise one of your team as the driver (preferably the wheelman, with necessary hacker support to get around biometrics and whatever other security they've got), have them get in the truck, and then proceed to lose the tail (yeah, I know, losing a tail in a truck isn't going to be easy - unless you think in terms of stopping the tail, rather than maneuvering the truck itself) long enough to either unload the truck or swap trailers.


Nah, as soon as we poped open the cargo we know a response team would have been on the way, the truck was being tracked on the grid. To jam the signal would have alerted them, we decided to get them to stop for something completely routine THEN perform the smash and grab. We passed a response team heading there as we fled and it would have not been fun getting away with the whole truck. Just had to deal with an astral signature vial on the cargo (toss out window then change course) but that was found rather fast.

I forget what exact make and model, but I want to say it was one of those secure armored cars that had isolated crew / cargo compartments, 2door front, 1 double rear. Not a true tractor trailer but large enough that it had to follow the trucking rules of the road smile.gif

I think for our case because it was crossing boundaries they couldn't have an armed tail. Some of the details were fuzzy as this was years back (3rd btw). But I recall there was about a 15-20 mile strip which was the ideal spot to hit and there happened to be a weigh station that was down for the season.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 10 2011, 12:31 AM

QUOTE (Tech_Rat @ Nov 9 2011, 03:53 PM) *
I think it's your turn, CanRay. We can't let too many people catch on... wobble.gif
Right, just because he's in Canada.

DO YOU KNOW HOW BIG THIS COUNTRY IS?

Big enough to easily loose a few dozen transport trucks a day and have nobody know. nyahnyah.gif

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 10 2011, 12:36 AM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 10 2011, 01:31 AM) *
Right, just because he's in Canada.

DO YOU KNOW HOW BIG THIS COUNTRY IS?

Big enough to easily loose a few dozen transport trucks a day and have nobody know. nyahnyah.gif

We always catch our man...! Our trucks.... Not so much.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 10 2011, 12:43 AM

That only works in some provinces and territories. Ontario and Quebec have their own Provincial Police... I'm not going to comment on them.

Posted by: Tech_Rat Nov 10 2011, 01:35 AM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 9 2011, 06:31 PM) *
Right, just because he's in Canada.

DO YOU KNOW HOW BIG THIS COUNTRY IS?

Big enough to easily loose a few dozen transport trucks a day and have nobody know. nyahnyah.gif


Yeah. Which is why you should do it. I'm not going to go all the way into Canada for one person I'll never be able to find. grinbig.gif

Posted by: Saint Hallow Nov 10 2011, 04:19 AM

There's little that would ever motivate me to invade or go to Canada willingly. I've been offered bribes of free vacations to go & still said no.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 10 2011, 01:45 PM

What's wrong with Canada? It's not like the wildlife is trying to kill you like Australia.

Posted by: Tech_Rat Nov 10 2011, 06:26 PM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 10 2011, 08:45 AM) *
What's wrong with Canada? It's not like the wildlife is trying to kill you like Australia.


Maybe not all the wildlife. I've still not seen health bars for the moose yet, but I'm waiting on it.

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 10 2011, 06:27 PM

What's wrong with Canada? Going there would kill the dream. I imagine that right now you are reading this text using one hand to hold an ax over one shoulder while the other hand strokes your huge beard, stopping just long enough to drink some maple syrup.

Same reason people don't come to Texas. They like the idea of me going to school on a horse.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 10 2011, 06:33 PM

QUOTE (Tech_Rat @ Nov 10 2011, 02:26 PM) *
Maybe not all the wildlife. I've still not seen health bars for the moose yet, but I'm waiting on it.
Health bar? Longer than most modern cars.
QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 10 2011, 02:27 PM) *
What's wrong with Canada? Going there would kill the dream. I imagine that right now you are reading this text using one hand to hold an ax over one shoulder while the other hand strokes your huge beard, stopping just long enough to drink some maple syrup.
I live in a city, no need for an axe (Although I do have an Entrenching Tool for emergencies), it's just starting to be winter here so I'm just starting to grow my beard (And it does get huge), and you don't drink Maple Syrup straight.

You mix 'Shine with it, or Vodka if you're one of those fancified folk. I also like it in my tea. Much healthier for you than refined sugar, especially as my Aunt knows the families that make it.
QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 10 2011, 02:27 PM) *
Same reason people don't come to Texas. They like the idea of me going to school on a horse.
Had a friend of mine that did a lot of contract work in Texas. It's big American sedans, SUVs, Pick-Ups, and so on with bull horns on the hood, as I understand. nyahnyah.gif

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 10 2011, 06:45 PM

In tea? Never thought of that. We're honey and tea people, when it's not just iced with sugar. Now vodka is interesting since I love vodka. And yes, there are large vehicles with horns but to be fair to a stereotype I have ridden a horse to school. The battery in my car was dead and I had to get to class. School was pissed.

Posted by: ZeroPoint Nov 10 2011, 07:10 PM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 10 2011, 01:45 PM) *
In tea? Never thought of that. We're honey and tea people, when it's not just iced with sugar. Now vodka is interesting since I love vodka. And yes, there are large vehicles with horns but to be fair to a stereotype I have ridden a horse to school. The battery in my car was dead and I had to get to class. School was pissed.



Win...

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Nov 10 2011, 08:21 PM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 10 2011, 03:27 PM) *
What's wrong with Canada? Going there would kill the dream. I imagine that right now you are reading this text using one hand to hold an ax over one shoulder while the other hand strokes your huge beard, stopping just long enough to drink some maple syrup.

Same reason people don't come to Texas. They like the idea of me going to school on a horse.


Like people believe that Brazil is a huge Rain Forest, that we have to run away from monkeys, we move around on vines, and our only exports are super models, hookers and soccer athletes?

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 10 2011, 08:22 PM

QUOTE (Brazilian_Shinobi @ Nov 10 2011, 09:21 PM) *
Like people believe that Brazil is a huge Rain Forest, that we have to run away from monkeys, we move around on vines, and our only exports are super models, hookers and soccer athletes?

But my dream is to find a super model who rides me like a hooker who can kick a soccer ball while swinging on a vine!

Posted by: Tymeaus Jalynsfein Nov 10 2011, 08:48 PM

QUOTE (Brazilian_Shinobi @ Nov 10 2011, 01:21 PM) *
Like people believe that Brazil is a huge Rain Forest, that we have to run away from monkeys, we move around on vines, and our only exports are super models, hookers and soccer athletes?


You export more than Hookers? Who would have thought... smile.gif

Posted by: Neurosis Nov 10 2011, 09:30 PM

Not to overly congratulate real-life thieves, but it sounds like these "runners" pulled this one off nice and smoothly.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 10 2011, 10:13 PM

*Snort* Low-Grade 'Runners. At least they didn't use firearms.

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 10 2011, 10:29 PM

So Sir Twist did this run?

Posted by: CanRay Nov 10 2011, 10:41 PM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 10 2011, 06:29 PM) *
So Sir Twist did this run?
Possibly. Gotta pay the bills, and the payoff would be good even after taking into consideration devaluation of stolen goods and splitting the take. Yeah, this is a Twist-Style job, especially if the Johnson didn't want any deaths, and needed to make sure of that.

He lost out on a lot of jobs, but the ones he did got him respect.

Posted by: WhiskeyJohnny Nov 11 2011, 01:10 AM

QUOTE (Tech_Rat @ Nov 10 2011, 11:26 AM) *
Maybe not all the wildlife. I've still not seen health bars for the moose yet, but I'm waiting on it.


Moose Shifter Street Sam?

Posted by: CanRay Nov 11 2011, 01:11 AM

Worse, Moose Shifter Shaman backed up by a Wolf Shapechanger Pack of Physical Adepts.

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 11 2011, 01:13 AM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 11 2011, 02:11 AM) *
Worse, Moose Shifter Shaman backed up by a Wolf Shapechanger Pack of Physical Adepts.

That would be an interesting team, if only for fluff value, a pack of wolf-shifters. I would love to be in a group like that. Or like the game Too Human, a pack of wolves and a single bear.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 11 2011, 01:22 AM

There's a pack of Wolf Shapechangers in one of my stories, and another that hasn't been seen yet.

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Nov 11 2011, 11:06 AM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 10 2011, 05:22 PM) *
But my dream is to find a super model who rides me like a hooker who can kick a soccer ball while swinging on a vine!


Sorry pal, you can only have 2 of these 4.

QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Nov 10 2011, 05:48 PM) *
You export more than Hookers? Who would have thought... smile.gif


Actually, currently our major exports nowadays are iron ore, aircrafts, ethanol, foodstuff, super models, hookers and soccer athletes and specialized labor who wants to leave this hole (myself included). grinbig.gif

Posted by: Tymeaus Jalynsfein Nov 11 2011, 04:07 PM

QUOTE (Brazilian_Shinobi @ Nov 11 2011, 04:06 AM) *
Actually, currently our major exports nowadays are iron ore, aircrafts, ethanol, foodstuff, super models, hookers and soccer athletes and specialized labor who wants to leave this hole (myself included). grinbig.gif


Heh... Good to know... biggrin.gif

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 11 2011, 06:18 PM

QUOTE (Brazilian_Shinobi @ Nov 11 2011, 12:06 PM) *
Sorry pal, you can only have 2 of these 4.



Actually, currently our major exports nowadays are iron ore, aircrafts, ethanol, foodstuff, super models, hookers and soccer athletes and specialized labor who wants to leave this hole (myself included). grinbig.gif

Last report I read said that y'all were buying up aircrafts like you were planning on carpet bombing everyone...

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Nov 11 2011, 07:12 PM

Right, we export civilian aircraft.
We don't have know-how for jet fighters and the Air Force has been trying to buy new ones since 1999. So you better sit down while you wait for the President's decision.

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 11 2011, 07:56 PM

I say trade our old ones for oil. America LOVES to be on the cutting edge of technology, despite the cost and the fact we don't use half the shit we buy.

Posted by: Irion Nov 11 2011, 08:06 PM

@Christian Lafay
Well, thats the thing with most nations.
I remember the german army buying Euro fighters just to realize they did not have enough armys to buy the weapons for them too. But hey, who needs weapons, if you can have a fancy aircraft?

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 11 2011, 08:09 PM

What can I say? I'm a firm believer of form over function. I'm so sad all those MOABs aren't being used.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 11 2011, 08:35 PM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 11 2011, 03:56 PM) *
I say trade our old ones for oil. America LOVES to be on the cutting edge of technology, despite the cost and the fact we don't use half the shit we buy.
Such as using bombs, rockets, and guided mortar rounds that cost twenty-five times what the Technical they just took out cost. nyahnyah.gif

Posted by: Brazilian_Shinobi Nov 11 2011, 09:04 PM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 11 2011, 05:35 PM) *
Such as using bombs, rockets, and guided mortar rounds that cost twenty-five times what the Technical they just took out cost. nyahnyah.gif


But then you get some really smart armies like the Frenc Army that used concrete bombs to crush Lybian tanks.

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 11 2011, 11:01 PM

I still think Maddox had the best idea. Take a C-130, load it with pennies (not rolls, loose), fly over the enemy and drop. It takes a long time thing into one act. Attack, war crime, and reparations all in one.

Posted by: CanRay Nov 12 2011, 05:28 AM

QUOTE (Brazilian_Shinobi @ Nov 11 2011, 05:04 PM) *
But then you get some really smart armies like the Frenc Army that used concrete bombs to crush Lybian tanks.
IIRC, it was a guided concrete bomb.

The guidance system was more expensive than the tank, crew training/food/whatever, and ammo/fuel combined. (Of course, we shouldn't put a price on human life. We're not Megas after all.).

Posted by: Kirk Nov 13 2011, 03:20 AM

QUOTE (CanRay @ Nov 11 2011, 03:35 PM) *
Such as using bombs, rockets, and guided mortar rounds that cost twenty-five times what the Technical they just took out cost. nyahnyah.gif

Counterpoint - how many of the less expensive munitions were needed to take out the Technical?

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 13 2011, 03:23 AM

QUOTE (Kirk @ Nov 13 2011, 04:20 AM) *
Counterpoint - how many of the less expensive munitions were needed to take out the Technical?

One well placed 50 cal round through the engine block and one through the mounted weapons assembly for non tanks. For tanks, one satchel charge and a guy who can do an amazing baseball slide.

Posted by: Kirk Nov 13 2011, 03:29 AM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 12 2011, 10:23 PM) *
One well placed 50 cal round through the engine block and one through the mounted weapons assembly for non tanks. For tanks, one satchel charge and a guy who can do an amazing baseball slide.

Plus a few thousand bullets that aren't well placed and a bunch of guys who slide like they're still in little league get spent as well..

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 13 2011, 04:33 AM

QUOTE (Kirk @ Nov 13 2011, 04:29 AM) *
Plus a few thousand bullets that aren't well placed and a bunch of guys who slide like they're still in little league get spent as well..

Why we should focus more on specialist then general soldiers for specialized situations. When I went through Basic training I was scared shitless of the way a lot my fellow soldiers were "prepared" for war. My only comforting thought was that most soldiers never see warfare. And if we lose little leaguers then we pull something from the Soviet's playbook and train remote detonated dogs to run under their equipment, instead of ours (the part the Soviet's missed).

Posted by: CanRay Nov 13 2011, 06:05 AM

Boots on the ground or elite soldiers, which do you pay for? The US, for all it's training, is more focused on manpower, and gadgets. They're highly trained, yes, but are very specialized in what they know.

Canada, in comparison, knows it's numbers are going to be limited by politicians, and also has a tradition of being highly trained, so had the basic training manual written by the British SAS, and then heavily cross-trained. Less high-tech gadgets (Except commo), but able to do more with what they have.

On one side, you have forces you can send all over the place (US) and rotate through so you don't overwork everyone and gear, or to one place (Canada) and wear out what equipment you have.

All depends on how you use the forces you have, and what plans you have for a military force.

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 13 2011, 06:29 AM

All good points. I just worry that America's battle strategy is so frighteningly archaic. "Best equipment and more troops can win any war", which is laughable because it was the exact opposite that got us our independence. Look at our current "war". General McChrystal (before talking to Rolling Stone) released a notice saying that if anyone told him they had a solution to the current combat problem he would dismiss them entirely because that person surely didn't understand all the complexities of the situation. Bullshit. We're attempting to use a World War mentality in a situation that is far from it. The best we can hope for is our staggering number of no-highschool-diploma soldiers looking like an unstoppable force. The Big Dog philosophy.

Quick Side Note: My Drill Sergeants made me pay for all my anti-military views. But I think all that extra PT made me one of the deadliest men of my platoon, so go figure.

Posted by: Irion Nov 13 2011, 11:19 AM

QUOTE
All good points. I just worry that America's battle strategy is so frighteningly archaic.

Do not be afraid. Most of your europien allys adopt the same kind of thinking. You only consider the things you have on your map (and add a big heap of lobby interests) and do not give a crap on the situation in the real world.

There was an interview with a german soldier at the beginning of afghanistan. He stated, that it is impossible to succeed, because they do not have the means to build an infrastructure to take care of the security and basic needs of the civil population.
And after 10 years we see, we did not succeed because the civil population is afraid of beeing killed by the taliban at night if they cooperate and we have major problems with the infrastructure. Well, who would have known that...

Posted by: Seriously Mike Nov 13 2011, 01:05 PM

QUOTE (Brazilian_Shinobi @ Nov 11 2011, 08:12 PM) *
Right, we export civilian aircraft.

That are bought by our government, despite being noticeably crappier than what the European companies make for the same price. And apparently nobody is bothered, bar one newspaper run by a former spokesman of the communist regime. That often digs up dirt against pretty much eveyone and rarely has to back out of it.

Posted by: Tymeaus Jalynsfein Nov 13 2011, 02:56 PM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 12 2011, 11:29 PM) *
All good points. I just worry that America's battle strategy is so frighteningly archaic. "Best equipment and more troops can win any war", which is laughable because it was the exact opposite that got us our independence. Look at our current "war". General McChrystal (before talking to Rolling Stone) released a notice saying that if anyone told him they had a solution to the current combat problem he would dismiss them entirely because that person surely didn't understand all the complexities of the situation. Bullshit. We're attempting to use a World War mentality in a situation that is far from it. The best we can hope for is our staggering number of no-highschool-diploma soldiers looking like an unstoppable force. The Big Dog philosophy.

Quick Side Note: My Drill Sergeants made me pay for all my anti-military views. But I think all that extra PT made me one of the deadliest men of my platoon, so go figure.


Curious... You have heavy anti-military views, and yet you joined a voluntary only military? That's... Odd. smile.gif
What branch of the service were you in, if I may ask.

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 13 2011, 04:58 PM

QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Nov 13 2011, 03:56 PM) *
Curious... You have heavy anti-military views, and yet you joined a voluntary only military? That's... Odd. smile.gif
What branch of the service were you in, if I may ask.

Ask away. I'm proud of the time I spent in the military and have many fond memories, just think the direction is wrong. I was in the US Army and trained to be an "intel-ranger". I like to consider myself a patriot in the same sense as the Tea Party, that being the men who committed acts of vandalism in Boston. I would love to call myself an anarchist but the title brings up too much studded leather and mohawks for my liking. I joined the military to see if my views on the government were as I suspected. And it's easier to become a soldier than it is to become a politician. But even with my views on the military being that it is bass-ackwards I still did my training and my job to the best of my ability. And for those of you thinking of going into the military never debate with an intelligent Drill Sergeant. Despite how calm and collected they are when showing how you are wrong on your views they will flip shit on the topic of self-governing actions in the realm of "threats, foreign and domestic" if you say the name Timothy McVeigh.

Posted by: Tymeaus Jalynsfein Nov 13 2011, 05:15 PM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 13 2011, 09:58 AM) *
Ask away. I'm proud of the time I spent in the military and have many fond memories, just think the direction is wrong. I was in the US Army and trained to be an "intel-ranger". I like to consider myself a patriot in the same sense as the Tea Party, that being the men who committed acts of vandalism in Boston. I would love to call myself an anarchist but the title brings up too much studded leather and mohawks for my liking. I joined the military to see if my views on the government were as I suspected. And it's easier to become a soldier than it is to become a politician. But even with my views on the military being that it is bass-ackwards I still did my training and my job to the best of my ability. And for those of you thinking of going into the military never debate with an intelligent Drill Sergeant. Despite how calm and collected they are when showing how you are wrong on your views they will flip shit on the topic of self-governing actions in the realm of "threats, foreign and domestic" if you say the name Timothy McVeigh.


Thanks...
Appreciate the Information.

And yes, Never debate with a DI. The ones I had in the Corps were exceedingly intelligent. And really, really BIG. My Senior DI routinely worked out with 380 Lbs on the bench press. His arms were as big around (if not bigger) as my thighs (26.25" for reference).

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 13 2011, 05:25 PM

QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Nov 13 2011, 06:15 PM) *
Thanks...
Appreciate the Information.

And yes, Never debate with a DI. The ones I had in the Corps were exceedingly intelligent. And really, really BIG. My Senior DI routinely worked out with 380 Lbs on the bench press. His arms were as big around (if not bigger) as my thighs (26.25" for reference).

I don't think I would have talked to that man. Period. Just maybe cried in fear. But it's my own fault really, getting a thinking MOS I thought the Army would be happy I could think.

Posted by: Tymeaus Jalynsfein Nov 13 2011, 05:37 PM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 13 2011, 10:25 AM) *
I don't think I would have talked to that man. Period. Just maybe cried in fear. But it's my own fault really, getting a thinking MOS I thought the Army would be happy I could think.


Heh...
He was an impressive specimen to be sure.
But then again, Most Marine Corps DI's are.

I had the opportunities to go anywhere in the Corps, but Chose the Infantry. At least then I got to blow stuff up. smile.gif
After the First Gulf War, when I wanted to actually go into the Intel Field, well, my MOS was frozen for transfers (too many people getting out - Should have transferred before the War it turned out). And since my Promotions were frozen for my Pay Grade (Too Many E5's and E6's) I could not get promoted before mandatory "retirement" at 13 years (You must be E6 by 13th year to continue on to 20). So, No transfers, and No Promotions, so I got out. *shrug*

I would not change it for the world, though. And I got to learn a LOT of really great things that have absolutely no application in the Real World (Unless I wanted to be a Merc or PMC).
Semper Fi...

smile.gif

Posted by: Christian Lafay Nov 13 2011, 05:44 PM

QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ Nov 13 2011, 06:37 PM) *
Heh...
He was an impressive specimen to be sure.
But then again, Most Marine Corps DI's are.

I had the opportunities to go anywhere in the Corps, but Chose the Infantry. At least then I got to blow stuff up. smile.gif
After the First Gulf War, when I wanted to actually go into the Intel Field, well, my MOS was frozen for transfers (too many people getting out - Should have transferred before the War it turned out). And since my Promotions were frozen for my Pay Grade (Too Many E5's and E6's) I could not get promoted before mandatory "retirement" at 13 years (You must be E6 by 13th year to continue on to 20). So, No transfers, and No Promotions, so I got out. *shrug*

I would not change it for the world, though. And I got to learn a LOT of really great things that have absolutely no application in the Real World (Unless I wanted to be a Merc or PMC).
Semper Fi...

smile.gif

Like I said, I may not agree with it but I did it the best I could and wouldn't change a thing so I get what your're saying. And I'm honestly surprised they wouldn't let you go intel, but that is from an Army thinking. Many of our intelligence were the guys who were running with infantry and special forces to get data on the spot. Sounds like it may have been right up your alley.

Posted by: Tymeaus Jalynsfein Nov 13 2011, 05:54 PM

QUOTE (Christian Lafay @ Nov 13 2011, 10:44 AM) *
Like I said, I may not agree with it but I did it the best I could and wouldn't change a thing so I get what your're saying. And I'm honestly surprised they wouldn't let you go intel, but that is from an Army thinking. Many of our intelligence were the guys who were running with infantry and special forces to get data on the spot. Sounds like it may have been right up your alley.


Yeah, it would have been perfect. Unfortunately, I should have taken it when I enlisted. Or at least prior to the First Gulf War. Ah well. It turned out okay in the end.

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