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> Israel 2065, A netbook frame and proposal
Omer Joel
post Feb 10 2005, 03:49 PM
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My view on Israel:

History
The two major events in it's SR history already detailed in Shadowrun cannon are the "2004" chemical strike and the 2034 (?) EuroWar II in which Israel was attacked by the Alliance of Allah (AoA). In addition to this, the Israeli Prime Minister Haim Sichon was assassinated in 2017. So I have to begin from these facts.

The 2004 chemical strike caused massive political turmoil and a sharp turn to the far right; the hundreds of thousands of victimes caused an immense public outroar, which was harnessed by the extreme right to gain political support by blaiming the local Arab population of assisting the Lybians in one way or another. Race riots (and attacks on leftist activists) broke out, and the government was force to resign, declaring general elections at the end of that year. The riots, however, only intensified; eventually, IDF joint chief General Yair Berinski declared martial law and ordered the army to occpy major cities to restore order. The elections were cancelled and a "national emergency government" was established, with Berinski at its head and with sweeping powers. Most civil rights were suspended and the military was given a free hand in dealing with public unrest. Order was restored, at the price of freedom.

Backing the new martial law were several local corporates, who used the general nationalist sentiment to put forward a "protectionist" policy, namely the nationalization of foriegn corporate assets and the erection of tax barriers to give local industry an advantage. Moreover, trade unions and strikes were outlawed, and any labour dispute was swiftly and harshly dealt with - to the corporate favor, ofcourse. Resistance to this regime arose both from outside (foriegn corporates who wanted their assets back and the import/outport taxes removed, and from within, mainly from the workers who found themselves far more opressed and expolited than before, and the general citizenary crushed under the martial law's boot. Meanwhile, refugeees fleeing from the contaminated Tel Aviv area streamed to the Negev and to the extreme north, surrounding Beer Sheva and Kiriat Shmona with refugee camps, shanti towns and newly-built slums.

In 2008, the economical situation, coupled with an international embargo, gave rise to a severe food shortage, and to bread riots. The masses poured out to the streets in protest, and the military was split between those who joined the protest and those who followed their order to the letter. Fighting ensued, and eventually the riots were crushed, but the nationalist sentiment, the driving force behind Berinski's government, was more and more being replaced with a feeling of dissatisfaction, of discontent and of opression. Out of Bloody 2008 grew several resistance organizations, both political and guerilla, and the government was once more destabilized.

The VITAS epidemic of 2010 was the catalyst of change; the inadaquate medical system was unable to cope with a disaster on that scale, and the masses stormed the hospitals in demand of treatment. 6 years of military opression finally give off their fruit, and a revolution is narrowly avoided by Berinski's resignation and the declaration of open elections, in which Chaim Sichon (funded by several multinational corporations) is elected as Prime Minister. Despite the lifting of most military laws, the fast economical growth of the latter half of 2010 gave extreme profit to the multinationals - and nearly nothing to the local masses. Moreover, the Resource Rush hit Israel at its full force, almost tripling the level of pollution within six months and causing extreme environmental damage. A leak from the Ramat Hovav toxic waste storage facility added insult to injury by contaminating the nearby area and causing several thousands of deathes.

Out of the ecological issues and the broken economical promises (well, corporate profits were skyrocketing, but unemployment was only deepening) gave rise nin 2011 to several new radical political factions, mainly the Matriarchal Revolutionary Party (MRP), combining socialist and ecological demands with a mystical world outlook and Mother Earth worship. The strange events of 2011 and 2012 gave fuel to the new movements, but also to a fundementalist Jewish sect, headed by a "Messiah" and claiming that the Day of Judgement was coming; the Messiah performed miracles, some of which even whistood scientific evaluation. To everyone's surprise, MRP's leader, Moriya Kedem, has performed similar deeds, claiming that she was calling Mother earth to her help. Open violence broke out when Sichon tried to sign an agreement with the Palestinian authorities and to evacuate several settlements, and the Messianic movement intervened, using "miracles" to prevent this. However, by 2013 it became clear that magic was by no way a singular "miracle", and the SHABAK (Shierut Bitachon Klali, General Security Service, the Israeli equivalent to the FBI+NSA) began its own crash course for mages; by 2014, the Messianic movement began to disintegrate, both under governmental pressure and due to the general acceptance of magic as a religion-independant force. The MRP, on the other hand, having a wide social and enviromental agenda, came out of this conflict almost unscratched.

Despite these events and the growth of MRP, Chaim Sichon was re-elected in 2014. The SAIM-US civil war further damages the fragile Israeli economy, however, and public unrest grows. The MRP, prevented from running to the Knesset (the Israeli parliament) due to "the abuse of magical laws", organizes several massive strikes in solidarity with the Native Americans. Lingering nationalist sentiment, coupeled with a wide stream of corporate money to the Israeli military establishment, prevent the MRP from pushing the masses forwards towards a full-scale revolution.

In 2017, however, Chaim Sichon was assassinated by an unidentified assaliant, who was killed shortly after by security forces. Despite the general MRP position against personal terrorism, the government blamed them for the assassination and outlawed them, cracking down on the opposition party with force; Moriya Kedem went into hiding while most of her party's leadership was killed or imprisoned. While an all-out martial law was not declared, brutal repression of any opposition was carried out by the SHABAK, supported by corporate security troops. This did nothing but radicalize the opposition - and especially gave rise to the Bleeding Skies anarcho-ecological terorrist organization, which had more magic on its side than even the MRP.

The Treaty of Denver of 2018 brought hundreds of thousands of American jews to Israel after they had to leave the NAN-occupied areas. Many of these refugees had to leave in a hurry and had little money to use, and the 14-years old refugee camps around Kiriat Shmona (and the few uncontaminated ones near Beer Sheva) grew. Meanwhile, the Chief Rabbinate of Israel declared Elves and Dwarves to be Humans, and magic to be in accordance to the Jewish faith.

The early 2020's saw the fast growth of Israel economy, though most profits streamed into forien and local corporate pockets. The Goblinization of 2021 caused minor riots, but the social and environmental issues still dominated the political scene; a Faculty for Magical Studies was added to the Hebrew University of Jerusalem in 2025.

To be continued...
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Demonseed Elite
post Feb 10 2005, 03:57 PM
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I don't want to stop your net material idea at all, but 2064 Israel will be appearing soon in print. But that shouldn't stop you from making your own material if you want to.
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Omer Joel
post Feb 10 2005, 04:14 PM
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Yes, it will appear soon, but I suppose it will recieve only a slight treatment (SoA is going to talk about SO many countries). And still, I try to put out my (native) version.
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DrJest
post Feb 10 2005, 04:50 PM
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Well, when it comes to rules just copy the Sioux Wildcat martial art across from CC, there's your Krav Maga :)
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Omer Joel
post Feb 11 2005, 07:51 AM
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QUOTE (DrJest)
Well, when it comes to rules just copy the Sioux Wildcat martial art across from CC, there's your Krav Maga :)

Krav Maga is probably more similar to Brawling, atleast for the non-elite combative units. For Sayeret Matkal... well, for close-up combat in 2064 they'll probably use either Implant Weapons with Improved Spurs or their Killing Hands (the selected few would either be combat cyborgs or adepts).
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FlakJacket
post Feb 12 2005, 01:57 AM
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QUOTE (Omer Joel)
A leak from the Ramat Hovav toxic waste storage facility added insult to injury by contaminating the nearby area and causing several thousands of deathes.

AAAAHHHHHHHH! *Ahem* Sorry about that. I just have a major hatred for environmetal disasters and the like, courtesy of the Germany and London sourcebooks. Seems like there's some sort of obscure by-law saying every country has have them. ;)

On a slightly more serious note, what's the water situation like? As I understand it water resources in the Middle East are becomming more and more stretched. Israel's currently having to import millions of cubic meters of the stuff last I heard to meet demand. So that could be a contentious issue.
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Omer Joel
post Feb 13 2005, 09:37 AM
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QUOTE (FlakJacket)
QUOTE (Omer Joel)
A leak from the Ramat Hovav toxic waste storage facility added insult to injury by contaminating the nearby area and causing several thousands of deathes.

On a slightly more serious note, what's the water situation like? As I understand it water resources in the Middle East are becomming more and more stretched. Israel's currently having to import millions of cubic meters of the stuff last I heard to meet demand. So that could be a contentious issue.

In my SR view: recycling and reclamation. And rationing, ofcourse. The three main resources that 2064 Israel lacks most are arable land, drinkable water and petroleum. The three solutions, apart from rationing, are all supplied by Bioguard Inc. - desert-adapted gengineered plants (and a small-scale version of "terraformation" of the Negev), bio-recycling of water and Methane production. But still, real-estate is in a premium, water is rationed (2 hours a day) to about 70% of the population and petroleum is reserved for military and corporate use (Everyone else uses Methane).
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Omer Joel
post Feb 13 2005, 09:41 AM
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QUOTE (FlakJacket)
AAAAHHHHHHHH! *Ahem* Sorry about that. I just have a major hatred for environmetal disasters and the like, courtesy of the Germany and London sourcebooks. Seems like there's some sort of obscure by-law saying every country has have them. ;)

Sorry, can't resist the temptation :grinbig:
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Omer Joel
post Feb 13 2005, 10:57 AM
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The economical boom of the 2020's was abrupty ended in Febuary 8, 2029, when the Crash Virus hits the global grids, causing a worldwide economical and infrastructure collapse, and Israel was no exception to this. By late March that year, most of Israel was without electricity or telecommunication, and the food and water supply was irregular at best. Once again, bread riots break out, and the masses pour to the streets; the MRP, slowly re-built during the 2020's, leads a city-wide takeover of utilities and governmental offices in Kiriat Shmona, and is soon joined by revolting soldiers from nearby bases. The Matriarchal Commune of the Galilee (MCG) declares independance from Israel in April 3, 2029, and begans the construction of a quasi-socialist, quasi-awakened democracy, while directing the masses in rebuilding the infrastructure in the "panhandle" of the Galilee, which was taken over by the Commune.

This revolution, followed by similar attempts in the rest of Israel, caused the Israeli government to declare martial law and send whatever forces still loyal to it to crush the revolting masses. While most of Israel was re-taken by the central government by the end of May, most of the Upper Galilee was still under MCG control; the rest was under strict martial law and supervised by an "Emergency Government" located, for its safety, deep under the "HaKirya" military headquarters in Tel Aviv. Unlike the MCG, most of Israel did not fully recover from the infrastructure failure, and instead the government poured many billions of Shekels into modernising the military forces and fortifying its police control over the population. This period saw the introduction of Magical Corps in the IDF, the complete legalization of the use of magic in Mossad and SHABAK investigations and the over-armament of the Israeli police.

Ironically enough, this militarization, originally aimed against the risk of intenal insurrection and against the MCG, helped Israel fight a completely different foe - the Alliance of Allah (AoA). In 2034, the newly-formed AoA stormed Europe, and side force of this invasion attacked Israel through Jordan, Palastine and Egypt and the MCG through Syria. Initial fighting saw the defenders lose ground to the invasion, and by late 2034 Jerusalem was cut off and the invaders have reached the eastern suburbs of Tel Aviv. House to house fighting occured in the surrounded Kiriat Shmona, but the MCG defenders, including many Awakened individuals, were able to hold the heavily-fortified center of the city (and a few of the western and southwestern Refugee Camps) against the mostly mundance (and anti-awakened) AoA invaders. The Israeli government debated the use of its remaining Nuclear assets against the AoA-backing nations, but a few successes on the Negev front in the early 2035 caused the limited cabinet/general staff (there was little difference between them at these years) to reject the proposal. Nevertheless, the massive counter-offensive of Febuary 2035 saw limited use of chemical weapons and a wider use of biological weapons, contaminating many of the AoA's supply depots in the area. In addition, both the IDF and the MCG's forces used magic, sawing death and confusion among the attackers. This, coupled by AoA's failures on the European fronts, allowed the defenders to retake most of Israel by the end of 2035; following Mullah Sayid Jazrir's assasination in 2036, a truce was signed between Israel and several factions of the fructured AoA, creating a a Demilitarized Zone in the West Bank, the Golan Hieghts and the Gaza Strip.

The MCG, while whistanding the invasion, was critically weakened by it, allowing a rapid government offensive to conquer the quasi-awakened state and to re-annex it to Israel; the MRP was outlawed and its members prosecuted, causing most of the remaining organization to go into hiding.

Israel survived the Second Eurowar, but the entire country was in ruins. Out of the flourishing economy of the 2020's now remained smoking ruins and burned craters, and most of the population lived in shanti towns and makeshift military shelters. The moderate opposition party "Ahdut" (Unity), headed by Avraham Maayan, recieved massive corporate funding and was able to force the already shaky ruling military clique to resign; a pro-capitalist "democracy" was restored by early 2037.

To be continued...
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Trashman
post Feb 14 2005, 10:43 AM
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Right. Why do I have the distinctive feeling of charging stark naked against a nest of hornet spirits over a landmine test area with the occasional mine-drone whizzing past whistling Junkie XL’s song „Love Like Razorblade“ about playing Russian Roulette?
Oh, well, here goes...

The two major events in it's SR history already detailed in Shadowrun cannon are the "2004" chemical strike and the 2034 (?) EuroWar II in which Israel was attacked by the Alliance of Allah (AoA). In addition to this, the Israeli Prime Minister Haim Sichon was assassinated in 2017. So I have to begin from these facts.

That one mention of Israel in the original material already was bollocks. I can’t think of a nation or area mentioned in SR where reality has overtaken fiction so radically.
In my storyline the chemical strike and nuclear counter-strike never happened. Incidentally, the Alliance of Allah also never happened. Putting up a new Berlin Wall around Israel seemed to fantastic? Give me a break, whoever came up with Lybia.
But as you chose to stay with this, I’ll not be a spoil-sport and continue.

QUOTE
The 2004 chemical strike caused massive political turmoil and a sharp turn to the far right; the hundreds of thousands of victimes caused an immense public outroar, which was harnessed by the extreme right to gain political support by blaiming the local Arab population of assisting the Lybians in one way or another. Race riots (and attacks on leftist activists) broke out, and the government was force to resign, declaring general elections at the end of that year. The riots, however, only intensified; eventually, IDF joint chief General Yair Berinski declared martial law and ordered the army to occpy major cities to restore order. The elections were cancelled and a "national emergency government" was established, with Berinski at its head and with sweeping powers. Most civil rights were suspended and the military was given a free hand in dealing with public unrest. Order was restored, at the price of freedom.


Is this realistic? Been to the country myself, did my bit for the antifascist tradition, and, yes, the IDF plays a major part in the country’s character and culture, even to the extent that you sometimes feel Israel is just one big army camp. But martial law? The military always struck as me the more liberal, democratic, tolerant, whatever types. But that was 20 years ago. So something significant may have changed and you obviously have an insider’s view.

QUOTE
Backing the new martial law were several local corporates, who used the general nationalist sentiment to put forward a "protectionist" policy, namely the nationalization of foriegn corporate assets and the erection of tax barriers to give local industry an advantage. Moreover, trade unions and strikes were outlawed, and any labour dispute was swiftly and harshly dealt with


Now, I’m pretty sure trade unionism was always rather strong in Jewish culture as it developped side by side with zionism. Outlawing appears a bit harsh. Why not beating them into (corporate) line? You could then later use independent neo-unionist cells joining the fun of post-2011.

QUOTE
Meanwhile, refugeees fleeing from the contaminated Tel Aviv area streamed to the Negev and to the extreme north, surrounding Beer Sheva and Kiriat Shmona with refugee camps, shanti towns and newly-built slums.


In that case you definitely need terraforming and water industry on a grand scale very early on. To add to the list of top weird places in the Sixth World you might want to marry the bulldozing corps to the old kibbuz ideology: building a new Israel, all together, bringing life to the desert etc etc. Imagine blissful Sabras in shorts running around telling everybody how fine they feel since the IDF provides security and (insert your favorite soulless corp) provide tech.

QUOTE
In 2008, the economical situation, coupled with an international embargo, gave rise to a severe food shortage, and to bread riots.


Why an international embargo? Where does it come from? Who is responsible for maintaining it? And by the way, what about the (old and real) mil-tech cooperation between Taiwan, South Africa and Israel? What became of that?

QUOTE
A leak from the Ramat Hovav toxic waste storage facility added insult to injury by contaminating the nearby area and causing several thousands of deathes.


I concur with earlier criticism. There are certainly more than enough ecological disasters in the SR story line, especially with regard to Target: Wastelands. Scrap that idea, chummer. I don’t think it does anything for your project. If you feel the need to keep the chemical strike bit in then that’s way enough.

QUOTE
the Matriarchal Revolutionary Party (MRP), combining socialist and ecological demands with a mystical world outlook and Mother Earth worship.


So you could use the MRP (what would be the Hebrew wording?) to rebuild the Tel Aviv area. Naturalists in the modernist architecture showpiece? Weird. Good picture.

QUOTE
The strange events of 2011 and 2012 gave fuel to the new movements, but also to a fundementalist Jewish sect, headed by a "Messiah" and claiming that the Day of Judgement was coming; the Messiah performed miracles, some of which even whistood scientific evaluation.


I know how the settlers think and feel. If ever some messianic movement crops up in Israel Ishall take the next flight to Mars – single ticket, thank you very much. Scary, chummer!

QUOTE
Despite these events and the growth of MRP, Chaim Sichon was re-elected in 2014. The SAIM-US civil war further damages the fragile Israeli economy, however, and public unrest grows. The MRP, prevented from running to the Knesset (the Israeli parliament) due to "the abuse of magical laws", organizes several massive strikes in solidarity with the Native Americans. Lingering nationalist sentiment, coupeled with a wide stream of corporate money to the Israeli military establishment, prevent the MRP from pushing the masses forwards towards a full-scale revolution.


See, that’s where you could have the independent grassroot unions come in and shake hands with the magicians.

QUOTE
The Treaty of Denver of 2018 brought hundreds of thousands of American jews to Israel after they had to leave the NAN-occupied areas. Many of these refugees had to leave in a hurry and had little money to use, and the 14-years old refugee camps around Kiriat Shmona (and the few uncontaminated ones near Beer Sheva) grew.


Hundreds of thousands?! Are you serious? A few thousand would be OK, I think. Dispossessed, harassed, hysteric and definitely with an axe to grind even such a small number should suffice to engender trouble. I mean, you’re talking here the influx of radicalised settlers as it is the fact now. Just that these people do not come out of an inability to cope with Western democracy but because they really have no other place to go. Or do they? Why not assimiliate in the NAN like many others? And there’s still the rather big UCAS.

QUOTE
Meanwhile, the Chief Rabbinate of Israel declared Elves and Dwarves to be Humans, and magic to be in accordance to the Jewish faith.


We’re not there yet but you don’t mention it further down. What happens with Orks and Trolls? It would be interesting if the people hailing from a European background gave birth to Orks and Ogres while the oriental part of the population bore Hobgoblins. Viz Trolls, Ithink it would be in order if the genuine Israeli Troll would have no horns. One could make up something like Rabbi Loew sculpting his golem in the image of the Trolls of old. See, no horns... but still mighty big buggers!

QUOTE
The Matriarchal Commune of the Galilee (MCG) declares independance from Israel in April 3, 2029, and begans the construction of a quasi-socialist, quasi-awakened democracy, while directing the masses in rebuilding the infrastructure in the "panhandle" of the Galilee, which was taken over by the Commune
.

The matriarchal concept seems quite interesting. Is that part of a subliminal Jewish tradition somehow erazed from the general picture?

QUOTE
Ironically enough, this militarization, originally aimed against the risk of intenal insurrection and against the MCG, helped Israel fight a completely different foe - the Alliance of Allah (AoA). In 2034, the newly-formed AoA stormed Europe, and side force of this invasion attacked Israel through Jordan,


Mentioned it before: I would ignore this nonsensical Alliance stuff. Complete tosh. If we were to expct any sort-of crusade at all then probably from sub-Saharan Africa, viz the containment camps the EU is discussing with mediterranean North African states.

QUOTE
This, coupled by AoA's failures on the European fronts, allowed the defenders to retake most of Israel by the end of 2035; following Mullah Sayid Jazrir's assasination in 2036, a truce was signed between Israel and several factions of the fructured AoA, creating a a Demilitarized Zone in the West Bank, the Golan Hieghts and the Gaza Strip.


Okaaay. Now we have reached the hotspot. So what about the Palestinian territories? No independent state, I take it from your writing. Hmm, difficult. As it stands now we have one more chance for a peaceful coexistence between Israel and the PT. Effectively, the two states would not be able to exist without each other. They are too small separately, Israel needs the workforce from the PT, the post-Arafat government could well turn out to do real-politik with Israel: TV sets for everybody in exchange for the familiy’s AK47, slightly rigged but very democratic appearing regular elections, military cooperation, two delegates in the UN always voting in accordance with each other.
If you include the Palestinians in your ideas you might get a very weird and immensely interesting setting for SR. Definitely more so than treating them as blind spot. That happened in the original German sourcebook with the whole of East Germany and also most everything the authors didn’t know about (so basically everything outside their hometown. That’s where these d20 fantasy states of Pommoria and Black Forest come from).

Regards and the best wishes for your project
Trashman
(retiring with a dozen Ares Alpha set on full automatic to a bunker set very very very deep inside Mother Earth)
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FlakJacket
post Feb 14 2005, 09:21 PM
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QUOTE (Trashman)
The military always struck as me the more liberal, democratic, tolerant, whatever types. But that was 20 years ago. So something significant may have changed and you obviously have an insider’s view.

Well the military is simply an organisation made up of people. If a nation's general political mood changes, and they do seem to swing between the left and right per generation or so IIRC, then so would the IDF. Hell, if you figure the more right winger the person you could see them viewing the military as the country's only defence. The more right of centre people that join up and become part of the command structure, the more likely the shifts made.

Incidents like reservist officers saying that they'd refuse or strongly object to orders to forcibly evacuate settlers from the Gaza strip have got to be scary for the government and IDF leadership. Hell, it's the one unifying thing in the country. Citizens putting their own feelings ahead of orders has to their waking nightmare. Or the Jewish extremists that are threatening government minsters they feel are too soft on issues. So you've already got a base to work with from real life.

QUOTE
Why an international embargo? Where does it come from? Who is responsible for maintaining it? And by the way, what about the (old and real) mil-tech cooperation between Taiwan, South Africa and Israel? What became of that?

Generally realpolitic. Israel does much more arms trade business with the PRC these days so they seem to be moving away from Taiwan. Plus by the 2020's China has balkanised. Relations between Israel and South Africa seem to have cooled for a number of factors, from what I've seem the ANC seems more pro-Palestinian than Israeli thanks to a number of factors. And they've got much less in common now that South Africa dismantled its nuclear program and doesn't have an active resistance movement. In Shadowrun by 2014 white rule has ended so probably a similar cooling of relations. The Oranje-Vrysraar state of Azania could re-start connections though.
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post Feb 14 2005, 09:49 PM
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QUOTE (Omer Joel)
The Treaty of Denver of 2018 brought hundreds of thousands of American jews to Israel after they had to leave the NAN-occupied areas. Many of these refugees had to leave in a hurry and had little money to use, and the 14-years old refugee camps around Kiriat Shmona (and the few uncontaminated ones near Beer Sheva) grew.

What led to this idea? I'm just curious because, frankly, I'd be shocked if there were hundreds of thousands of Jews in the parts of the U.S. that make up the NAN. Likewise, the relocation process took about ten years. People wouldn't be fleeing their houses overnight, although it would definitely be more "encouraged" in some places, like the Ute nation. But again, how many Jews are there in northern Arizona? Utah? Nevada?

There are also parts of the NAN where they could stay. Denver, being one. The PCC being another. Various Anglo reservations make up the third. There is also the option of moving west to California, northwest to Seattle, or east to the rest of the U.S.

Moreover, why would they all move to Israel, especially in light of the disasters which you have described as already haven befallen the Holy Land? On one hand, it is Israel. On the other, there are communities in the U.S. which are several generations older than the current Israeli state. Even split in half, the U.S. itself is magnitudes larger than Israel (my home state is several times larger than Israel) and more likely than not the people in the NAN would have family outside the reclaimed territory and inside the U.S. that they could join.

QUOTE (Omer Joel)
The three solutions, apart from rationing, are all supplied by Bioguard Inc. - desert-adapted gengineered plants (and a small-scale version of "terraformation" of the Negev), bio-recycling of water and Methane production. But still, real-estate is in a premium, water is rationed (2 hours a day) to about 70% of the population and petroleum is reserved for military and corporate use (Everyone else uses Methane).

And waterjacking...

Plenty of waterjacking.
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post Feb 14 2005, 09:58 PM
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If you want waterjacking on the industrial scale, just look to the Euphrates and Tigris. The amount of bickering and fighting between the up and downstream countries over water usage rights and dams is amusing.
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post Feb 14 2005, 11:11 PM
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Considering where those two rivers pass through, it's not so much amusing as it is pathetic and sad.
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Omer Joel
post Feb 15 2005, 08:06 AM
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@Trashman:
Believe me, the Israeli military is neither liberal nor democratic; it's a military like all conscript militaries worldwide (France in the 1960's, for example). And the generals are heavily involved in politics IRL - the last Chief of Staff became (and still is) the "civilian" Minister of Defence within days from the end of his military service, not to mention the high percentage of former generals in the business and politics communities. And there were things similar to martial law in the 1950's, not to mention actual martial law on the Arab villages until 1968.

About the unions - where do you think that the MRP and the rest of the resistance movements came from?

"MRP" is "Miflaga Mahapchanit Matriarchalit", later (2040's+) "Immah Ahat", that is "One Mother".

And there IS a semi-feminist, quasi-matriarchal movement in Judaism - especially in Reformic Judaism, women who wish to be equal to men in prayers and so on, and some who are "unsure" in respect to "God"'s gender. And there is some Biblical mention of a semi-matriarchal tribal society (Debora the Profetess "judging" the people and many other small mentions).

And the boycott is only around petroleum; the main oil-producing countries are in a cold-war with Israel (Arab Nations) or not-so-happy to produce oil at all (NAN). Guns, tech, uranium etc is still widely traded between Israel and the forein corps (who control it in SR).

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Trashman
post Feb 15 2005, 01:58 PM
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QUOTE
About the unions - where do you think that the MRP and the rest of the resistance movements came from?


Right. I like that very much. Decent idea, man!

QUOTE
"MRP" is "Miflaga Mahapchanit Matriarchalit", later (2040's+) "Immah Ahat", that is "One Mother".


Sounds great. I'll make sure my runners get to Israel and blow something up for TripleM. :D

QUOTE
And there IS a semi-feminist, quasi-matriarchal movement in Judaism - especially in Reformic Judaism, women who wish to be equal to men in prayers and so on, and some who are "unsure" in respect to "God"'s gender. And there is some Biblical mention of a semi-matriarchal tribal society (Debora the Profetess "judging" the people and many other small mentions).


Ace, Omer. Wish you all the energy to continue the project. 8)
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SpasticTeapot
post Apr 9 2005, 07:22 PM
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QUOTE (Omer Joel @ Feb 15 2005, 03:06 AM)
@Trashman:
And there IS a semi-feminist, quasi-matriarchal movement in Judaism - especially in Reformic Judaism, women who wish to be equal to men in prayers and so on, and some who are "unsure" in respect to "God"'s gender. And there is some Biblical mention of a semi-matriarchal tribal society (Debora the Profetess "judging" the people and many other small mentions).


Actually, with the exception of Christianity, Islam (which are pretty new as far as religions go) or Buddhisim (which has had dozens of incarnations throught history, and varies a lot between them), most religions have some sort of matriarchal base at one time. Devi, one of the principal Hindu deities, is female; the Greeks were a purely matriarchal society for millennia. Most native american religions portray at least a few spirits as female; many also allow women to hold positions of religious importance.
In my opinion, Reform Judaisim will embrace all metahumans as Jewish, while the Conservative denomination will only accept elves and dwarves, if any, and the Orthodox tradition will consider them all non-Jewish. This will lead to some interesting alliances. (For example, there will be a good-sized number of Reform Jews in the Sons of Sauron, as that's pretty much the only western religion that would accept them.)

I do'nt know who'se been brainwashing you, but women do not merely "wish" to be religiously equal to men; they ARE religiously equal to men except in the most opressive of religions...such as Orthodox Judaisim.
In case I'm not mistaken, a good portion of the Orthodox community refuse to send their daughters to college, believing that they do not need an education to become a good homemaker. One of my kid brother's best friends had an older sister who could speak five languages by the age of 12. If that's not a glaring case of religiously based female repression, I don't know what is.
And for the record, I'm a male Jew who has been through several years of religious school under an orthodox rabbi, not some crazy bolshevik who likes to flame people.

EDIT:
Guess I goofed; I apparently have Shiva mixed up with Devi.
SECOND EDIT:
I've never played Final Fantasy in any of its incarnations. SquareEnix is in no way responisble for my god-related errors.
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Penta
post Apr 9 2005, 07:28 PM
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Um, why do we have two threads on the same topic?
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Ancient History
post Apr 9 2005, 07:34 PM
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Two different topics. One just wants to know how Israel is portrayed in SR, this one suggests a netbook for Israel in SR. Ghost only knows why.
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FlakJacket
post Apr 9 2005, 07:57 PM
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QUOTE (Ancient History)
Ghost only knows why.

Same could have been said for the EuroSB project. On why the netbook idea, because people might be interested in the place?
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Ancient History
post Apr 9 2005, 08:10 PM
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Nah, why limit it to Israel? Do the whole Middle East while you're at it!
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hermit
post Apr 9 2005, 09:12 PM
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QUOTE
Shiva, one of the principal Hindu deities, is female

Uh ... what Final Fantasy did to the world ... Read here about Shiva . *sigh*

QUOTE
Nah, why limit it to Israel? Do the whole Middle East while you're at it!

Yup, I'm all for it.
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FlakJacket
post Apr 9 2005, 11:43 PM
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QUOTE (Ancient History)
Nah, why limit it to Israel? Do the whole Middle East while you're at it!

Because that's the only country from the region we've got people for so far? :)
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Penta
post Apr 10 2005, 02:38 AM
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Well, you're not really likely to get people from anywhere else.

Is SR even published in Arabic?

Edit: Or Hebrew, for that matter?

This post has been edited by Penta: Apr 10 2005, 02:39 AM
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Rory Blackhand
post Apr 10 2005, 07:49 PM
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Shalom Omer,

I assume you posted this on the forum for input, advice, or help? Here are some of my ideas in a very rough draft. It would have to be detailed out, modified, or deleted to fit, but what I have listed is based on history and future speculation.

Overview: Some points to keep in mind when designing Israel.

1) The main point in developing Israel would be that the Holy Land is likely magical in nature itself. The Jews have never given up on Israel for two thousand years of persecution. Europeans have butchered them, Arabs have ethnically cleansed them from the entire middle east, but they love the land dearly. With that much love and history there is likely something to it that should be brought out in SR.

2) Also, Israelis are a very liberal and tolerant society, in contrast with their neighbors. When meta humans express I am sure the Israelis will welcome them as people regardless of race. I am just as certain the Arabs won't. apparently there is a Jihad at some point to back my opinion up.

3) Israelis are very industrious, they are on the cutting edge of technology. It is likely that per capita they are some of the most highly trained and advanced thinkers we have.

4) Every Israeli is a soldier by neccessity. Military technology like cyber ware, armor, and weaponry will be a common sight. It is not unusual to see hitch hikers wearing street clothes carrying machine guns. Nor is it unusual for a family sedan with kids inside to stop and pick these armed men up. It is just part of unique Israeli society.

5) Much of the reason the world can't openly side with the only democracy in the middle east is because of our dependency on oil. We promised Palestine to the Jews and in good faith they came and created roads, hospitals, and industry, only to be told that they must give up first 75% of the Jewish Homeland (Jordan), and now another division of what's left (future Palestine). Each time the Jews spent their fortunes thinking they were home, each time they were murdered and chased out of the lands they loved, all the while thousands upon thousands of Arabs immigrated to the region illegally in search of better lives their own countries were and are still unable to provide.

6) Once Japan takes over the energy market, oil loses it's value. With nothing to blackmail the world with the Arab governments will likely collapse. Like Africa, they will have little resources but a huge population to sustain. Open support for Israel will increase, human rights will not be so easily ignored, and governments will be free to take a closer look at the problem. Islam, of course, the driving force behind the intolerance, will still be there as an opiate for the masses of miserable citizens throughout the mideast. And their leaders will continue to scape goat the Israelis for anything that goes wrong and divert attention from themselves.

7) With a land of green growing life amid a desert and collective working kibbutz style, Israel itself will be a nice place to live in contrast to the great desert and the wild bandits that will populate it.

8) With Israel's technology edge they will be able to accomplish much with small numbers.

The biggest event affecting Israel in my opinion is the change from reliance on oil to the availability of cheap microwave energy beamed to earth from solar collectors. Pg 24 under Japan Inc. The reason I think this will be the biggest event is because at the moment the west is a slave to the whims of the oil producing despots. We allow Islamic tyrants to get away with crimes against humanity for one simple reason, our dependence on oil and the fear of what those who control it might do if angered.

Most of the world's oil wealth was placed in the hands of Islamic nations. The UN has around 200 members, 54 of these are Islamic theocracies. Any vote concerning Israel starts with a 54 to 1 disadvantage. Along with this vote discrepancy comes strong arm bullying by the oil thugs. The third world must comply out of a real fear, an oil embargo would crush any emerging economy on earth. This makes the cheap energy provided by the Japanese megas a critical event to break the power of the Islamic oil tyrants. With nothing to fear from the Islamic nations the third world is free to look at the true facts on the ground. The EU no longer has to play along with the charade either. This comes at a perfect time in history since the one bastion of reason and support, the US, is fracturing.

So with this event in the first decade of the 21st century, it is reasonable to say that there was a desperate "chemical strike" by fanatics as they recognized their power slipping away.

In 2011, the year of chaos, weather patterns changed and Israel becomes the promised land of old. It literally becomes a "land of milk and honey", some say it is due to the great reverence thousands of years of Jews have held for the land. UGE Israelis are accepted with open arms the same as Jews of all races are accepted today in Israel. Israelis have traditionally been very tolerant of all others, fully 20% of the population are Arab Muslims with full rights the same as with Jewish Israelis, same sex marriage is accepted, and women are treated as equals in every way.

In 2012 as waves of secessions were hitting all over the world the so called Palestinians declare independence. At first they claim Gaza and the territory liberated from Jordanian occupation in 1967, Judea and Sumeria (west bank). They use Ramallah as a temporary capitol, but maintain Jerusalem is to be the eventual capitol of Palestine once the Israelis have been exterminated. Immediately the Islamic nations recognize the land from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea as being Palestine and begin arming the Palestinians with billions of dollars worth of heavy weaponry. Much of the weaponry ends up in the hands of terror groups and Israel comes under constant bombardment. Lacking the ability to govern themselves the entire country falls into chaos and bitter infighting. To divert attention from themselves and their abuses the first action the Palestinian Authority takes is to declare that the Jews living in what was previously known as Israel are illegal squatters. Any Jews found in the part of the Holy Land now called Palestine are rounded up and shot. Being Jewish becomes a capital crime. Islam becomes the official religion of Palestine and elections are cancelled in favor of an Islamic Council.

2017 Haim Sichon was slain. Without more info it is hard to say why? My suggestion is that he was killed by Jewish patriots because he was going to hand over East Jerusalem to the Palestinians as a gesture of good will. It is likely the Palestinians would have viewed this as a weakness, so this averts war for the moment.

By 2018 the last of the Jews has been ethnically cleansed from Palestine and flush with victory the population is clamoring for more blood. To placate the mob and keep attention focused away from the corrupt governing body, Palestinian leaders begin a series of pogroms against UGE Arabs, driving the Palestinian elves and dwarves underground. At the same time fatwas are issued all acrosss the middle east and the great hunt begins. Jihad is declared on meta humanity and millions are slaughtered in the blood bath. For the most part the entire middle east is cleansed of dwarves and elves the same as it is cleansed of Jews.

In 2019 Palestine with it's new weapons attacks and conquers Jordan, uniting over 80% of the original Palestine. The Hashemite king Abdullah is exiled back to Saudi Arabia. His American born wife is executed along with their children.

In 2020 the great dragon Aden destroys Tehran as punishment. The Ayatollahs and the Alliance of Islam declares magic and metahumanity to be the work of Satan and blames Israel for all it's problems. The rest of the middle east in despair and lacking the oil clout they were accustomed to follows suit. Much rioting and fracturing of governments takes place, mostly along tribal and clan lines. Bands of nomadic tribesmen begin raiding each other's communities much like the old days. With oil becoming next to worthless there is just not enough resources to sustain the population.

In 2021 goblinization hit. Once again another Jihad swept across the middle east. Even worse than the previous one. Orks and trolls were beheaded in public displays. Only Israel, ever tolerant, accepted it's ork and troll population. Once again Israel was blamed for the evils that befell the middle east.

Between 2020 and 2034 tensions escalate between Israel and the newly armed and expanded Palestine. With an exploding population, and dwindling aid money the people become more and more restless. With the collapse of the UN and the end of the age of oil the Palestinians find themselves with nothing to build an economy on and no more hand outs to keep them sustained. All they have in abundance are weapons of war and a desire to commit genocide on the Jews once and for all. From birth they are taught that the Jews are the enemy and that the duty of every Palestinian is to kill Jews and rid them from the middle east by any means.

In 2034 Eurowar II breaks out and the Alliance of Islam uses the distraction to attack Israel. After months of mobilization and build up, coupled with genocidal rhetoric, the Arab nations once again attacked Israel with the goal of driving them into the sea. With no support and no friends, the tiny country of Israel once again produces a miracle. Nuclear weapons launched at Israel from Iran and Libya never impact. With no pogroms against magic use, elite IDF forces quickly destroy advancing columns of tanks and infantry. Israel, always a leader in bleeding edge technology fielded cyber modified units, the Gholani Brigade field tested cyber technology and performed very well in battle, taking only light casualties while inflicting enormous losses. New innovative tactics by israeli generals combined magic and technology to once again destroy a much larger force arrayed against them.

The war is over in just 3 weeks, Israeli counter attacks had expanded the border of Israel to include the entire area of the Holy Land. With no desire to expand it's border further, Israel stops it's advance and the Arabs sue for peace.

In 2035, after much debate and division, Israel annexes the now liberated Holy Land and begins an unpopular program of forced relocation. Activists across the world descend on Israel to act as human shields, liberals and anarchists disrupt IDF operations, and governments recall their ambassadors. The Arab nations lacking funds and their armies beaten are powerless to intervene. The Mullahs curse and vow revenge. The Israeli information service seems woefully unprepared by the media hype surrounding the event. They point out that millions of Hindus and Muslims were exchanged between India and Pakistan. Millions of Germans were uprooted from East Poland. Millions of Fins were deported from russia. Turks and Greeks exchanged populations. And that the entire region was brutally cleansed of Jews and meta humans by these same people. Etc... but the world does not listen.

Coinciding with decades of rising anti-semitism, massive pogroms are instituted across Europe to also cleanse that region of any Jews. In short, millions of hostile Arabs are transferred out of Israel to live with culturally, ethnically, and religiously similar peoples, while millions of Jews are forced to flee to Israel and learn to speak Hebrew. For their part the IDF allows compensation for the departing Arabs, but the incoming Jews are arriving with the shirts on their backs.

In 2036 the Revava Party gains control of the knesset. A state of war exists between Israel and all of it's surrounding neighbors. Military service is mandatory for every Israeli with all governmental benefits tied to length of stay, rank, and performance. Work begins on the Third Temple. The Alliance of Islam declares that the destruction of the Al Aqsa's Mosque is a crime against Allah and vows to never end the war until every last Jew is annihilated from the face of the earth, (so what's new?)

To present, the quasi communistic ideals of the kibbutz are implemented creating a government based on military service, dedication to the state, and the preservation of the Holy Land.


Conclusion: I think you can picture Israel as a walled community, tolerant to others, technologically advanced from it's neighbors. Military hardware will be openly carried and displayed. It will be a fort mentality, where everyone inside is a friend and everyone outside is an enemy. They will likely guard the Holy Land with great pride. And they will likely be under constant attack from forces on their borders. I imagine there will be lots of opportunity for runners to make forays into the wilderness to destroy mortar pits, rescue captured parties, etc...





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