![]() |
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
![]()
Post
#1
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 127 Joined: 22-October 08 Member No.: 16,542 ![]() |
My understanding of MBW is that it makes you move with maximum efficiency. Smooth movements etc. But by my reckoning that would only slighly increase your speed. "It's just a game" aside, how would that justify the speed bonuses? Unless the seizing it induces triggers all your motor neurons and kind of gives you a permenantly adrenalized "hysterical" speed? I dunno. Can anybody comment?
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#2
|
|
jacked in ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Admin Posts: 9,461 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 463 ![]() |
It certainly also includes a nervous system supercharge akin to wired reflexes.
Bye Thanee |
|
|
![]()
Post
#3
|
|
Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,925 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 948 ![]() |
The thing to remeber with any Initiative enhancers is that they dont really INCREASE your PHYSICAL speed.
What it does is to make your reaction time and Brain-to-muscle movement fractions faster making the movements more economical as they take less time sending data back and forth between muscles and brain. To the enemy you seem to react with incredible speed but in your eyes everyone else seems to move in slow motion since your brain is processing data at increased speed. You basically activate your own personal bullet time. |
|
|
![]()
Post
#4
|
|
Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,899 Joined: 29-October 09 From: Leiden, the Netherlands Member No.: 17,814 ![]() |
I think it's a lot like power steering; only a small mental nudge makes a lot of physical movement. Of course, this can be nasty if you're not entirely sound of mind. One twitch and you decapitate your daughter sneaking up on you with a birthday cake.
Yeah, I don't like MBW. I appreciate the power, but it's a horrible thing to do to yourself. |
|
|
![]()
Post
#5
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 127 Joined: 22-October 08 Member No.: 16,542 ![]() |
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#6
|
|
jacked in ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Admin Posts: 9,461 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 463 ![]() |
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#7
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 127 Joined: 22-October 08 Member No.: 16,542 ![]() |
LOL whoops. Old book.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#8
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 224 Joined: 6-April 02 From: ab.ca Member No.: 2,522 ![]() |
Have you ever had really violent spasms in your muscles or seen somebody who has? I was on some medication for a while that did this to me regularly, so its why I think of it.* The muscles just contract explosively, and an arm can go flying faster than it could ever consciously be commanded to. It goes faster because it's not being coordinated at all. Some muscles just suddenly contract as fast as they physically can with no regard for the other muscles or tendons they're linked to. It's erratic and can be very painful and even damaging. Move-by-wire makes all your muscles want to do this all the time, but provides the control over those muscles and coordinates the nearby muscles quickly enough to make it not erratic and just barely not damaging.
*As an aside, this medication also gave me the sensation that my muscles were about to rip out of my body and go for a walk on their own. Low-grade move-by-wire could have the same effect. |
|
|
![]()
Post
#9
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 894 Joined: 5-May 10 Member No.: 18,556 ![]() |
Old move-by-wire was indeed nasty tech. I don't think I ever used it in a PC.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#10
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 201 Joined: 24-November 08 From: Bogotá, Colombia Member No.: 16,626 ![]() |
It was nasty tech, that was the exact reason you'd want to give it to a PC... a very good reason to 'run (I want to remove this piece of tech, but it costs a lot!) Now, the technology may have improved but it still is a fluff issue -I think- to describe the effects the wirings give to characters. Not only MBW, wired reflexes too. In SR2 or 3, tehre was the reflex trigger for wired reflexes. Itw as an interesting piece of 'ware because it differentiated an adept's reflexes and a sammie's -also see the story in SR2 "Plus ca change..." where the sammie describes how an adept moves elegantly with his imrpoved speed and the sammie moved like a robot due to the wirings.- I think I no longer know where I am going with this, but enjoy teh 'ware and describe it differently, it makes for more intersting games. |
|
|
![]()
Post
#11
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 993 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 313 ![]() |
When it first came out (Cybertechnology SR2), Hatchetman says taht it basically makes you spasm in all directions and provides error checking to keep you from moving until you actually want to move. "Constant state of seizure" is how its described.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#12
|
|
Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,899 Joined: 29-October 09 From: Leiden, the Netherlands Member No.: 17,814 ![]() |
Yeah, it's pretty gruesome. The kind of thing to install if taking vengeance against impossible odds matters more than having a life expectancy over 6 months.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#13
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 993 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 313 ![]() |
In previous editions you had to make a body roll every couple of months to see if you develop brain damage and have to have it corrected by removing the damage brain tissue. But then again, if you could afford it, it was the only way to get a 7D6 initiative. (The roughly the same as having 5+ passes in 4th ed.)
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#14
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 400 Joined: 4-August 10 Member No.: 18,889 ![]() |
The nice thing is in 4th all cyber is wireless so you can mentally turn it on or off. Sure, you might get caught with your pants down occasionally but that's a lot better than living with MBW as it's described in the fluff.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#15
|
|
Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,989 Joined: 28-July 09 From: Somewhere along the brazilian coast Member No.: 17,437 ![]() |
The nice thing is in 4th all cyber is wireless so you can mentally turn it on or off. Sure, you might get caught with your pants down occasionally but that's a lot better than living with MBW as it's described in the fluff. I think that if you 'turn off' Move-By-Wire you will start moving your muscles in all directions and spasming without control. MBW works exactly like those installed in SOTA airplanes. |
|
|
![]()
Post
#16
|
|
Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,629 Joined: 14-December 06 Member No.: 10,361 ![]() |
Your body naturally imposes limitations on how you can use your muscles, that's why people can be blown across rooms by touching something like a powerpoint or capacitor. They actually throw themselves. Same principle, I suppose.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#17
|
|
Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,088 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 ![]() |
The fluff of MBW systems doesn't even describe what actual fly-by-wire system do, fly-by-wire simply means that the pilot's control send control signals to actuators at the control surfaces, instead of having a direct mechanic connection between the stick and the rudders...I guess one of the authors back then picked up one of the more consistent rumors about the then brand-new F-117.
So don't interpret too much intro the technobabble and just remember the long and short of it: MBW makes you faster than anyone else, but the guy with the large harvesting tool will come just as fast (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) |
|
|
![]()
Post
#18
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 821 Joined: 4-December 09 Member No.: 17,940 ![]() |
The fluff of MBW systems doesn't even describe what actual fly-by-wire system do, fly-by-wire simply means that the pilot's control send control signals to actuators at the control surfaces, instead of having a direct mechanic connection between the stick and the rudders...I guess one of the authors back then picked up one of the more consistent rumors about the then brand-new F-117. So don't interpret too much intro the technobabble and just remember the long and short of it: MBW makes you faster than anyone else, but the guy with the large harvesting tool will come just as fast (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) More accurately it was decribed as akin to unstable plane design - which can only be held steady with a computer-assisted fly-by-wire. The simili-seizure state providing the instability and the wounteracting action of the move by wire provding the equivalent of the fly by wire. |
|
|
![]()
Post
#19
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 583 Joined: 1-October 09 From: France Member No.: 17,693 ![]() |
If you want to nitpick (why would you not, it's the Internet !), you can have fly-by-wire without instability, but you cannot have a really aerodynamically unstable plane without fly-by-wire, the computers adjusting the control surfaces fast enough to keep it steady.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#20
|
|
Advocatus Diaboli ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 13,994 Joined: 20-November 07 From: USA Member No.: 14,282 ![]() |
It's very important to utterly deny your request to set aside the one and only explanation: it *is* just a game. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) MBW doesn't and can't make any sense.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#21
|
|
Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 127 Joined: 22-October 08 Member No.: 16,542 ![]() |
Well what I got from this thread is that my original hypothesis was correct and the MBW keeping you in a constantly controlled state of seisure actually gave you a type of permanently "adrenalized" speed. Thanks chummers.
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#22
|
|
Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,654 Joined: 29-October 06 Member No.: 9,731 ![]() |
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#23
|
|
Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,768 Joined: 31-October 08 From: Redmond (Yes, really) Member No.: 16,558 ![]() |
I suspect it also does something to the inhibitors in your brain that keep you from tearing yourself apart. Maybe they reinforce your joints and tendons when they install the MbW?
|
|
|
![]()
Post
#24
|
|
Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 7,116 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,449 ![]() |
Move-by-wire, while still cutting-edge technology, has been around longer in SR4, and has changed a lot. In SR3, it gave insane advantages, but also had so many disadvantages that most people would stay away from it - it was generally something you would be likelier to see in cyberzombies.
In SR4, the advantages are less (although still very substantial), and the disadvantages are also correspondingly less - a higher likelihood of eventually developing neural disorders, and even that is mostly fluff. In other words, it isn't the quick way to commit suicide that it used to be. Users are described as moving with an unnatural smoothness, but often have small muscle tremors when they are at rest. |
|
|
![]()
Post
#25
|
|
Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,705 Joined: 5-October 09 From: You are in a clearing Member No.: 17,722 ![]() |
0 to tetanus in an instant. That's what MBW is about.
How can this be accomplished electronically while still using biological muscles? Can't. The way muscles work, the fibers are contracted with a series of motions, like a team pulling on a rope, so even just flooding the muscles with Ach or whatever neurotransmitter won't do it. Conclusion - pure Phlebotinum |
|
|
![]() ![]() |
![]() |
Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: 17th May 2025 - 06:35 AM |
Topps, Inc has sole ownership of the names, logo, artwork, marks, photographs, sounds, audio, video and/or any proprietary material used in connection with the game Shadowrun. Topps, Inc has granted permission to the Dumpshock Forums to use such names, logos, artwork, marks and/or any proprietary materials for promotional and informational purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not affiliated with the Dumpshock Forums in any official capacity whatsoever.