You know what the difference between Dietary Requirement and Essence Loss is, right? The Special Infected (title I give to all Infected with Essence Drain - a shout-out to L4D) do not require Essence on a weekly basis, and I've already gone over a number of ways to take care of that issue fairly easily. Read the Dresden Files, especially when Thomas opens a hair salon.

EDIT: Attempted to soften the blow.

In other news:

I've always envisioned Essence Drain to work like Essentia from The Other Game - you lock those points in and cannot access them until the timer runs out, after which half are lost.

EDIT 2:
Also, check out this idea for a faster Beast Master: take the concepts from my Ally Spirit Thread (especially the Calling Rules) and apply them to animals. Here's a couple examples:
Spirit Dog

Fire Dog

Thomas' feeding style is not the same as it is for Nosferatu and Vampires in Shadowrun. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

It is for Essence, which was my point. Not only that, there are other ways for blood, which were mentioned upthread.

No, its not.

Thomas' victims do not participate Willingly, they participate unknowingly (BIG DIFFERENCE). You cannot do that in Shadowrun. You must either be willing (which means you are explaining exactly what you are doing to the victim... bet you don't do that one) or restrained. Thomas' victims do not know what is happening to them. Nor does it have a detrimental effect on his victims like Essence Loss does in Shadowrun.

The Blood restriction is also a component, and yes, you MAY handwaive it away by figuring into the Lifestyle. IF we allowed Infected in our game, we would not allow it to be that easy. It is a drawback (and a significant one at that) for a reason. It should not be simply handwaived away. Doing so minimizes the monstrousness of whay it is that they are. It is not the same as going to McHughs for a Burger, after all...

...

/facepalm.

Influence and Compulsion are powerful weapons at the disposal of a nosferatu. They make you willing. So does lying about something; for example: "Come over to my place for a fun-sexy time!" Then, when they come over expecting sex, you give them that and take a point of Essence also. You do remember that "[t]he psychic stimulus of the act of draining has a side effect of creating ecstasy in the victim," (SR4A, page 294, Essence Drain, fifth paragraph, first sentence) right?

So yes, the Thomas example still does hold water in that if they think they are coming for (in this case) a haircut, they are willingly submitting to whatever happens in that chair. The example gets stronger when you start doing other things, like be a BDSM-for-hire (draining from sexual pleasure/pain/terror) or things of the like.

As for the blood - it'd be easy to arrange (Influence and Compulsion, remember?) a blood-drive in poor-er neighborhoods and have the Nosferatu masquerade as a doctor who takes the shipments, or getting into an arrangement with a shady clinic for blood, both of which are simply the RP reasonings behind the 30% increased Lifestyle cost. Not to mention Nutrition.

/Facepalm...

"Fun Sexy Time" is not the same as "Feed me a portion of your Soul" and you know it. If you are using Compulsion or Influence, they are not willing. They are being forced, and that does not fly, becasue it DOES NOT MAKE THEM WILLING. It Forces a condition upon them, and removes choice. In what world does that make them willing? And yes, I do know the side effect. Regardless, to actually use the Essence Drain Ability, your Victim must either be willing (Forced acceptance is not Willingness) or they must be restrained. Your course of action counts as restraint, but it is NOT the same as the way that Thomas (or White Court Vampires in general) feed, as you claimed. Restraint is exactly that, Forced Compliance. Better kill the victim at that point, becasue even with the Resultant addiction (Mild Remember) it is likely they are going to the Authorities becasue there is an Infected Predator on the loose...

And no, in your example, they are not willingly accepting of anything that happens in the chair. That is just ludicrous...

Yes, I understand the Blood Arguments, and think they are very cheesy. Which is why I would never allow such actions in my game, assuming we allowed Infected at all, which We do not. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) You are trying to have your cake and eat it too. Not at our table... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

You guys can both stop now, you know. Before they lock the thread.

Yes please.

I did not read it that way at first, but now that you've brought it up I can't STOP reading it that way. Thanks a lot....

Perhaps that's why they keep going 'round and round about "sexy-time".

Seriously guys, please don't dig yourselves into another pointless circular arguement.

You're a pointless circular argument!

I want to argue around your circles!

Actually, the Psionic tradition does not entirely support number tweaking. As has been suggested, charisma synergizes better with nosferatu critter powers. A shaman would be better for such things.

Psionics was picked, because I wanted a character from NAN who eschews shamanic ways as religious nonsense. A college educated person who does not believe in the "old ways," and instead practices magic as an application of force that is naturally occurring and malleable. Hermetic traditions rely on mystic formula, and I believe those are just beliefs reinforcing beliefs. Those who read Dresden Files will know this particular standpoint: it works only because you believe in it. I believe it is a natural force no more mystic than gravity.

The animal handler kick was a spin-off after a "discussion" (more of an argument) as to whether or not someone who denounces the "old ways" would give a crap about the state of the world. So, the character became a scientific environmentalist type, with a focus on animal treatment, but not a straight tree-hugger. Animal treatment in this case does NOT mean "nature takes its course." Well cared for is well cared for. In short, he believes in free-range farm animals, not in vegan.

The party, per say, is never a static unit. Shadowrun is our mixed-attendance game as much as a mainstay, and is the game of choice when we are missing people. This can mean only 2 or 3 shadowrunners.

And the final question, this would be a "suffering soul," who searches for the non-existent cure for vampirism, and hides what he is as much as he can.

I always thought the SR hermetics were scientific (MIT&M), while psionics was fringey new age crystal stuff. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

This is much more in keeping with SR canon regarding what nosferatus are like in terms of outlook and personality than what I thought from your original post, and I am glad to see that you are making this character with real depth. My concerns are eased now. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I'm now wondering whether you intend on training and using paranimals or whether you will be mainly using mundane critters for the roles you'll be filling on the team (my guess is infiltration/espionage with some CQC?). I can give you advice for either route, but it would be helpful to know which one you are going with.

Also, do you want your PC to follow an Adept Way?

my apologies, you did indeed ask about the paracritters earlier, and I forgot in my post.

This would be primarily a paracritter trainer/handler, and I've started with several Fenrir Wolves, and am thinking about a Merlin Hawk (the hawk can summon manifesting spirits, and psionics do possession, best of both!).

In terms of supporting them, our group exercises the custom lifestyle rules, so, Rural Home, No Neighbors, Animal Lover 3, and Reinforced Housing II should take care of most special needs for paracritters. Psionics using possession grants access to spirits with animal control who can also possess said critter, making it possible to contain failed training rolls. I've also taken spells such as Control Pack (alleviate allergy for Nosferatu is also Win).

I've arranged with the GM as to a location, which is atm restricted to Seattle and surrounding area. I've opted to be in the outer sticks of Seattle, probably in Snohomish, where paracritter trainers exist already, and since I can then do personally sponsored raids into the Coliseum.

I also spent points for a contact through NAN, which I understand is more famed for dealing in paracritters as a nation, to see about training for a fee, selling, or acquiring new animals. Remember, I care about their treatment, but not their subjugation. A military paracritter, properly cared for in all respects, is no different than the little 3 pack of wolves I keep myself.

Actually they seem close in context, with a distinct difference: Hermetic magicians believe that formula, symbols, rituals, etc, are empirically discovered ways of manipulating the force known as Magic.

Psionics and crystals falls squarely in D&D, if memory serves.

Psionics believe that formula, symbols, rituals, etc, are all crap. The only thing that matters is the will to shape magic. Every other method is delusional; people following formulas because they believe it to be so, and it is their belief in such things that restrict them. It is a possession based tradition, with Intuition as the supplemental stat. Since Intuition is the primary stat for animal training and handling, that did indeed work well for this concept.


This also seemed in keeping with the general superiority that seems to possess most Nosferatu as well.

The caveat here is that the psionicist think that their own will and mindpower is producing the effects directly, magic being an expression of said powers. A marginal branch of chaos magic that considers you will and mind are the only required tools to affect magic (which in turn affects the wrold to create the deisred effects) seems more in line with the charcter's view.

The first is more in line for mine in any case, though I must admit dancing back and forth between them during char gen.

I have not yet taken a Way (had other qualities I felt I needed more) though Likely this would be Magicians Way. Sadly, due to the Totem Way all but requiring a Mentor Spirit, and psionics not taking one, I am not sure what subcatagory would be best for discounts. Warrior is one that seems to have discounts on some of the most expensive powers, when taken to their fill.

Isn't it MIT&T? As in Thaumaturgy?

It is... Good catch... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Seriously? Weird, I've thought that for like 15 years. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

It was MIT&M for a while, since the very beginning (SR1 corebook, p 16). Changing it to MIT&T was a retcon that occurred...I don't know, exactly. I'm not sure when Texas A&M became Texas A&M&M, either, but it wasn't the latter in the original corebook.

Any beasthandler pitfalls as well?

Don't buy the animals. They are expensive and die easily. Just get them ingame via your skills.