Consider this stolen. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

9-out-of-10 ghouls agree that Adepts are "Magically Delicious". (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

While I'm sure there should be a rule against this, what's stopping an adept from getting Increased Reflexes 1, then buying two rating 4 qi foci to get up to Increased Reflexes 3? That would do the trick, and would be legal for a starting character, if cheesy.

Well, the number of Foci that can be active is equal to your Magic attribute, so that's not too bad, but could come into play if you insist on doing the Force 1 Cheese method.(Total force you're pretty lucky since it's Magic x 5). However, you need to check for Focus Addiction if the total Force of Bonded Foci exceeds your Magic Attribute, so abusing Qi Foci for the more expensive things will have you rolling for Addiction pretty quickly.

For Foci, the Addiction Rating is the total Force of all active Foci(8 in this case-for a comparison, equal to Jazz, while Bliss has a 5 and BTLs range from 6 to 8 ). Every time you use the total Foci for 11-Focus Rating weeks, so in this case every 3 weeks...if you use anymore you'll be testing a lot)-and it's a *logic + Willpower* test for Foci since it's psychological(and we know how often Adepts stack Logic and Willpower.) So essentially, yes, Adepts can use Qi Foci cheese if they want to test for addiction all the time, and eventually they're going to run out of luck. It's Threshold wasn't 1 either-I believe it was a 2, which is considered a nastier addiction, with 3's being the stuff like Kamikaze and Tripchips.)

(However, it's almost the same-except for Availability, which is what the cheesy part is. 2 Force 4 Qi Foci cost the same as 1 Force 8, in terms of bonding and nuyen-but it's the Availability that can be worked around. That I'd rule against...even though I don't use the limit at Chargen anyway, if I was playing a game where I did enforce it, I'd make the call that sure, you can get Reflexes 1, but you'll have to be content with a Force 4 Reflexes 2 and get the rest in game, or you can get Reflexes 2 and get a force 4 to raise it to 3, but not two force 1's.)

EDIT: Hint: GMs, play up Focus Addiction hard. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Is the addiction Roll for all BONDED or ACTIVE Foci? Away from Books currently...
If that is for BONDED foci, that is very Harsh. If that is for ACTIVE Foci, then not all that bad, especially for those who only use Foci when Needed, rather than all the time.

Active foci, so you can just turn stuff off when you are not needing it to help lessen the risks.

I intended it to mean ACTIVE. It's a psychological addiction in the fluff (but as your mind limits your ability to work magic, it's worse than usual).

Focus Addiction.

That was what I was thinking. Thanks (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

Has this been confirmed as to be actual errata or where you just overruled?

I plead the Fifth.

"You can't, you are Canadian."

Shut up!

You plead Question Period? That doesn't even make sense...

So...

I recreated my Current Mystic Adept (312 Karma), and there were a few changes to the character. Maybe he comes out a bit more powerful, and in other ways he lost out.

Biggest Changes Are
He is now a 5s/5a Adept (Whereas he was a 3s/2a Adept originally - Could have stayed at 3/2, but I did not want a 5 Edge)
He has lost several spells to Rituals (had to pick up actual Rituals so he could use that Ritual Magic Skill) and He lost several Spells to Starting Limits (Priority lessened the available Spells from what he originally started with). So a loss of 12 Spells overall (if my count was right), because I also had to make up some skill deficiencies due to the reduction in Knowledge Skills, as well as Karma Changes in the Cost of a Sustaining Foci. Oh well.
And no Initiations. Original Character had just received his 4th Grade of initiation (Group and Ordeals used - 44 Karma).

Assuming that the Adept Abilities and Qualities remain the same as in 4th Edition Books, he is pretty well set, though lacking in some key areas (like Initiations).

Dice Pools are essentially the same (Spell Casting gained about 3 Dice or so, Ritual Casting gained a Die, Social Skills all lost a Die). The change to Counterspelling hurt a bit, but not that big of a deal.

Only real combat loss was the +2dp for Smartlink, which can be recovered should I really care about having something transmitting. But since the Skill is strictly for backup, I don't see me using a wireless bonus on anything (since I have no ware at all, and my base equipment has no need of it).

Had I converted, rather than rebuilt him, he would be much the beast, I think, with fairly high skills, but that seems like I am cheating. *shrug*

So he is a Professional in the same things he was specialized in previously (Skill 6), and Competent in most other skills (Skill 3), with an Exceptional in Counterspelling (Skill 9) which was his primary specialty focus in SR4A.

Still, I prefer my SR4A Version. BP/Karma Gen is so much more precise in character creation *shrug*

EDIT: The Conversion gave some interesting results, but the biggest benefit is that he does not lose any Spells (and his Sorcery/Adept Split stays at 3/2), so a bit behind the rebuild in Spellcasting power, but still 12 spells more versatile, and 4 grades of initiation.

You're comparing a chargen fresh rebuild to a 312 karma gained character, and you only have minor changes, and admit you possibly come out more powerful?

Do you have the original chargen stats of your prior edition character to compare to? Because that would be quite illuminating.

~Umi

No, it is a Chargen Build with additional 300+ Karma for his experience...
It is a Rebuild, using received Karma to compare Actual Karma Expenditures across the two editions for a Character with 300+ Karma. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Way too much typing involved.
Attributes were the same for both editions: 3/3/4(6)/2/4/4/4/4
Magic went from 3/2 to 5/5
Edge stayed the same

Almost all Karma was spent into Foci and Spells.
Sadly, the Rebuild did not get the Initiations, unless I was willing to carve out some more spells. Oh well. Forgot to add that to the list, will go back and edit.

whew! had us worried for a sec (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Heh... I can see why. Sorry I was unclear.

Overall, in advancement for SR4A, I had spent 250 on Spells (an additional 50 Spells), 44 on Initiation (4 Initiate Grades), and 18 on Skills/Specialties. Totaling 312 Karma.
Does not go as far in SR5, unfortunately, but you can start out of chargen a bit stronger, overall... Especially as a Mystic Adept.

Now, here's the question... if someone doesn't leave it active all the time, just when they're on runs, how often do you have to test for Focus Addiction? If they only have > Magic in active foci one or two hours at a time, how long will it take before they need to make a test?

I'd certainly agree to that as a house rule, but the problem is that I don't see this as a core rule. I'm looking for ways to limit the cheese within the rules.

We invoke Section 13. Which to me, sounds much more badass anyway. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Only if Section 13 is tougher than Section 9 is.

Warehouse 13 on the other hand is just plain weird.

What, the right not to be arbitrarily detained or imprisoned? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

Section 9 does not imprison people, it kills people.

Would you care to list which spells you bought? 50 seems an unusually high number, and I'd be interested in seeing which ones you wanted.

That said, while you can start 5/5 as opposed to 3/2, I believe I'd rather take 3/2 if I could have the spell rules of 4e.

Indeed, I will PM it to you.
I also agree that 3/2 is a better split, in my opinion. I prefer much of SR4A over SR5, to be sure. Some things in SR5 are very interesting (I don't mind the refocus on Drain, for instance), but some of it is just crazy.