Seriously? Damn, I hope the freelancers aren't getting too personally attacked over that kind of stuff, it must be intensely frustrating to see something like that happen.

And not just for the Freelancers... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wobble.gif)

I was giving 5th ed a chance as my last hopes of continuing to support SR. The core .pdf was OK, but lack of errata on digital, yet, is disappointing (but not surprising). From what I've seen on this thread, I'm not going to bother with Run and Gun and, barring some amazing change, giving up on the IP for new products.

no no, the freelancers are usually respected around here . .
well, the ones actually bothering to come and talk to us about things anyway . .

I do seem to recall there being some reason behind the second printing going to print unerrataed... Something to do with Amazon's orders/bullshit release dates, I think?

that's no excuse, that's a cop-out . .

Indeed - Amazon does not control production. Any error on dates is their own to bear.

It should be. Realities of customer service tend to be different from what things should be.

Funny that they suffer for their inaccuracies when it comes to other companies (Onyx Path comes to mind). Probably because those other companies don't bend to the retailer's screw-ups.

Might be related to how long it took before Catalyst had a release date out.

Sure, that could be. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Well, I am getting nervous that there hasn't been a peep about the physical release of the Beginner's Boxed Sets, two months after the digital version has been released.

Would really love to take those to my local cons...

That would mean a model where errata is only done on the occasion of a new physical printing. Better than nothing, but I like some support past release...

Alternatively, a print-on-demand model that offers the most current version, either in place of or in supplement to additional print runs.

Yeah, I'm not being impressed yet. 5th seems to be an improvement from the launch of 4th, but it looks like I'll still be waiting for 6th or maybe till Topps gives the license a better chance.

I am still hoping there is a hidden gem in Crossfire or something that comes out and isn't riddled with errors. At least Shadowrun Returns has been a runaway success so maybe the franchise can still keep on kicking somehow.

how?
disregard me whining and grining and hating on SR4 all the time, but i genuinely believe that, aside from the nazi bullshit in war and the war over trees SR4 is the better product.
and it had a better start, despite the license ownership issues in the middle. and aside from the war fiasco and the stupid war about trees and the dragon war, it was a more or less well made line even though a million dollars suddenly went bye bye in the middle of it all . .

Honestly though, why would they come here?

Dumpshock has become a massive haven of negativity. The more I read the more I realise that most of the complaints come not even from anecdotal evidence but from theory crafting from people who I sense had already decided to hate the edition before it came out.

When you go to the official forums there is 10 times the traffic with less nagativity. People are genuinely discussing how the rules work and trying to nut out the problems. I'm getting more inclined to spend more time there myself because by reading that forum it seems pretty clear that most people are reasonably happy with this edition.

That would be awesome, and with todays technology I can't see it being that hard to implement.

The cynic in me thinks that perhaps this is not done because they want us to buy reprintings.

And to add to this...

To the people who think that the users on the regular SR forums are all a bunch of ass-kissing yes-man who think that nothing is wrong and Everything is Awesome...

That's not true. At all.

In fact, over there people have been VERY vocal about the problems of Run and Gun. Errata thread over ther has been steadily filling. And that some of the crunch added are very head-tilting. So no, no one is exactly giving 5/5 reviews over there.

I, for one, was entirely enthusiastic about the new edition. I eagerly bought it shortly after it came out, and I've regretted it heavily since.

I joined the SR community late in the cycle of 4E, grabbed up most of the books for it, and aside from a few quibbles here and there like War!, I was generally satisfied with the quality of the products and with the game system. Yeah, 4E had problems, but they were in the far out reaches of the game system, in the dark and largely disused corners - the rules didn't start falling apart until you tried pushing the envelope well beyond what most people would call reasonable. They were easily explained problems, and most of them were rarely encountered and worked around easily enough.

When I picked up 5E, I was excited for more of the same. I didn't get it. I got a horribly edited, confusingly laid out, astoundingly unclear collection of incomplete rules that looked more like a rushed prototype than a completed product. I and many others voiced our displeasure. There has been no response. There have been no fixes. We're not even being told that fixes will be coming eventually. Dead silence. New books have been put out with more errors, more shoddy quality, more astoundingly confusing rules that require professional linguists to properly parse.

So personally? I view any negativity present as highly justified. Perfectly and entirely justified? No, perhaps not. But in general? Yeah, I think most of it is very valid. I personally feel like I've been cheated, and I feel like no the game world and system I found myself so incredibly drawn to is no longer being properly tended to by its keepers.

I also think it is massively unprofessional and unwise to leave a substantial portion of your dedicated playerbase upset with your products. Fault us for being impatient and grumpy if you like, but where there's smoke there's fire, and if CGL doesn't take steps to address the concerns of their playerbase, they're going to regret it. Unhappy customers do not remain customers for long.

~Umi

Wizards has been leaving their fanbase unhappy for over a decade, and yet people keep going back for more!

Considering that a one man operation + freelancers to do the writing has done it for almost a dozen new books in the last 2 years and has a release schedule with something like 20 more books on it for 2014/15 I know it can be done.

Pardon me for my ignorance but...

...what happened to "Voting with your Wallet"?

unfortunately they got me hooked. i'll buy anything with the words shadowrun on it, whether it's 15 years old or 2 weeks. i mean i'm not breaking the bank but i'm looking forward to any releases cause i wanna see the idea thrive, even if my votes are going to be misused.

its' not unfortunate, i love the SR universe. i just wish it was handled as awesomely as it really is