Snow_Fox's quote did seem to imply the $1 (today) = 1 nuyen. Which is what I quoted and was replying to.

Since there are no prices for items listed in 2070 UCAS dollars, any exchange rate you wish to use would be reasonable. I have no problems with the 1:5 ratio there.

None of you guys seem to be factoring in tax and retirement savings into your caculations. If you're paying a middle lifestyle, and say pay 30% in tax, and save 15% for retirement, you need to earn 7500 Nuyen a month.

Average US salary for full time workers is 3750 a month (pre tax)

If you assume average salary is a middle lifestyle (a big assumption), you actually get 1 Nuyen = 2 (2007) US Dollars.

Median income for a bachelors degree is ~50k (both sexes) is 4200 a month, so thats 1 Nuyen = 1.8 dollars.

So its not going to be quite 1=1 though thats not a bad approximation. Its probably 1 = ~1.5-1.75 approx.

I'm not sure how tax can come into it though. The day job quality says that you get 5k a month for 40 hours so that must be post-taxes. The middle class lifestyle I would assume would be including all relevant taxes so players don't need to worry about it.

So as noted previously a Shadowrun nuyen has about the same buying power as real life U.S. dollar.

As for the Shadowrun era conversion rates for the relatively devalued national currencies, we have the information below (which suggests that the UCAS dollar gained some strength between 2050 and 2062):

The Neo-Anarchist's Guide to North America (2050)

Economy [of Québec] ^(p.66)
The currency of the Republic of Québec is the New Franc (f) , which is divided into 100 centimes. Currently, the exchange rate is bouncing around two francs to one nuyen (2f = 1¥). By law, the rate is considerably lower when you go to a government-sanctioned bank to exchange your nuyen, which is required as soon as you enter the Republic. One nuyen converts to as little as 1.95f (1 franc, 95 centimes).
When buying nuyen, 1Â¥ will cost about 2.05f. The government pockets the difference. The shadows offer less official venues for exchange. The rates are sometimes better than in the banks, especially if the exchange is part of some other kind of deal.

Economy of the UCAS ^(p.84)
The UCAS unit of currency is the dollar. The official exchange rate makes one (1) nuyen worth approximately five (5) UCAS dollars. In reality, the dollar fluctuates plus or minus 20 percent against the nuyen on a day-to-day basis.
Almost all financial transactions are handled electronically and are subject to government tracking. A thriving shadow economy based in cash and corporate scrip also exists, despite official attempts to quash it.
For gaming purposes, whenever a transaction is conducted in UCAS dollars, roll 2D6 and consult the Dollar/Nuyen Exchange table.

• Die Roll | Result (One nuyen equals)
•     2     | UCAS $6.25
•   3–4   | UCAS $5.75
•   5–6   | UCAS $5.25
•     7     | UCAS $5.00
•   8–9   | UCAS $4.75
• 10–11 | UCAS $4.50
•    12    | UCAS $4.00

Shadows of North America (2062)
“At a Glance� sidebars:

• CAS Currency: CAS Dollar (nuyen also accepted) Exchange Rate: 1$ = 0.33Â¥ ^(p.58)
• Québec Currency: New Franc (nuyen also accepted) Exchange Rate: 1f = 0.5Â¥ ^(p.102)
• UCAS Currency: UCAS Dollar (nuyen also accepted) Exchange Rate: 1$ = 0.25Â¥ ^(p.166)

The UCAS economy is based on the dollar, which is worth anywhere from four to six dollars to a nuyen, depending on the gyrations of the stock market, the day of the week, and quite possibly the motion of the stars.^(p.170)
_{–Note this paragraph matches the 2050s conversion value from NAG-NA, but not the 2062 conversion value on p.166 of SoNA and in “Cost of Doing Business� (see below).}

“Cost of Doing Business� (unpublished excerpt) with detailed rules for currency conversion circa the 2060s.

What? I agree that the day job quality is post taxes and thats exactly my point.

You pay income tax when you earn money, not when you pay lifestyle.

So we're comparing pre-tax current day salaries (in US dollars) to post tax nuyen lifestyle costs (2070 nuyen)

So to do it right, you need to take the 5k post tax fro the day job quality and work out what it would be pre tax to compare it to the current US dollar salaries to work out purchasing power parity.

We don't even know if various nations have income taxes in Shadowrun. They could have switched to a Value Added Tax, or some other type of consumption tax instead. The game (probably deliberately) ignores this detail.

The approximation (1 Shadowrun nuyen = 1 present USA dollar) is just useful for things like the cost of a nice bottle of Scotch, or a meal at a restaurant, or anything else you can't find in a table but you know the real cost.

So a fancy meal out, that would cost $120 today, will cost 120Â¥ in Shadowrun. No muss, no fuss, quick reasonable estimate.

Ok I see that now. I get what you're saying.

Yeah, I'm not even sure taxes work in shadowrun-verse as described, so I just don't think about it to much. 1 - 1 is a reasonable estimate, just point out that 2:1 is probably a better estimate.

I'm guessing that there are probably taxes, and that they're probably comparable to our own, but they never bothered to tell us about it, because very few shadowrunners file a 1040.

I figure that taxes are covered by a combination of Lifestyle and fake SINs. In my opinion, a decent (phony) money trail and tax record are part of what makes up the higher rated fakes.

For what it's worth, I would assume that most governments in the Sixth World have switched to taxing consumption (VAT and/or Sales Tax) rather than income.

Income taxes would only come from those with a SIN, everything earned by the SINless would go untaxed.

Consumption taxes would come from a smaller source pool (companies instead of people), and be easier for government agencies to track and collect. By taxing production and/or sales, a greater amount of economic activity is captured meaning that a smaller tax rate collects what the government needs to function.

Fair enough point about my shadowrun in game assumptions being about after tax dollars, and my IRL assumptions being pre-tax dollars. However, the lifestyle definitions in Shadowrun are abstract enough that a 10-30% fuge from taxes doesn't really make all that big a difference in my currency exchange rate guesstimations. The value of the current dollar to the nuyen could certianly very but I think 1:1 is a nice gameable estimate.

Another explination as MJBurrage would be that income tax has been done away with, and all taxes are sales taxes. A regressive tax of this nature would certianly fit the setting. But collecting these sales taxes from the extra-territorial corps might be an issue (though you might consider their possible immunity to them a key factor to their success). Much more reasonable to me is a continuation of the income tax on those who have SINs. Part of the responsibilities that come with the 'privilage' of having a SIN/being a citizen is taxes after all.

Yeah, just saying. Retirement savings are another awesome issue. But shadowrun economics are not exactly fleshed out, so its really not clear how it would all fir together.

But really, its just color (who cares how much anything costs, I just hand wave absolutely everything as part of lifestyle, and tell the suckers on low lifestyles to get with the program) so 1:1 works great.