OK, so...I was thinking about how we have now have all these combat drugs in Shadowrun. More then we had in previous editions, in fact. Sure, some are old "friends" come back(like Kamikaze). This got me thinking though...

Can you now, make a viable Street Sam role character with just a smartlink, and an autoinjector set-up?
If so, what drugs would you say said Samurai would need?

Yes, I know..this is a one-way trip to high grades of addiction, and, eventually, to dying because you are so hopped up on combat drugs all the time you are either going to die from the let-downs or from Lone Star...but..

I still think it could be an interesting character concept just to see what the general community can do with it...

Kind of reminds me of the "Juicers" class from the Rifts rpg. That's essentially what they are after all, just a bunch of druggies with auto injectors.

I'm gonna have to play with this now, see what happens...hehe
I suspect a lifespan of about a week...maybe less...

One player in our game does something like this. Some of the drugs are for the character, but others she'll load into bullets and use on targets.

If you're feeling really crazy, you could always mix in the genetic infusions from Augmentation along with your combat drugs.

I don't think it would work. Cyber you buy once and it works forever. Drugs are cheap, but they drain your nuyen with every dose. And the crash effects of multiple drugs are actually pretty likely to kill you, not to mention the addiction rates.

The rules are also unclear -- do drug effects stack? Can I take cram and jazz to get 3 IPs? Ostensibly yes, but I don't think the rules say one way or the other. Regardless, the cybersamurai will still beat your ass based on superior attributes. You can pump attributes a little bit with drugs, but nothing like what you get out of cyber.

However, your idea would work for a regular samurai. Drugs could give an edge that others wouldn't have. And it wouldn't take much away from a standard build just to add auto-injectors and buy chems.

Awesome! In the SR3 campaign i ran like 10 years ago this was part of the story arc of one of my players. It was a pretty gritty game, a run went bad most of the team were captured by lone star, the razorboy was picked up by the corp they were running against, he was f'ed up, bleeding from every orifice and well into his overflow boxes. They took him down to R and D for a makeover. When they gave him a shot of epi on the table to bring him around long enough to sign a release form, he agreed thinking they were going to make him some sort of super sam. The effect of the program was an autoinjector implant, and comp controller. The problem was this was first generation gear and the kinks werent worked out, so even though he was fast his hands shook so bad he couldnt shoot straight to save his life. He couldnt sleep without using tranquilizers, and the cocktail of drugs the streetdoc put together to replace the designer stuff he couldnt get from the corp he started building a tolerance to. It worked out pretty well, for my story anyway

Well....not saying that I would epect them to survive..it would definately be a character starting in a downward spiral of addiction and crashing..maybe even takign some drugs to fight the crash of others...But, I am still curious if it is actually possible for such a character, even short term....

well, it would work at least to some extent. you'd be much better off with a mix of drugs and cyber though, but you could get a very cheap version of a street sam. i expect it would be a popular set of mods on the streets, for gangers and such.

I'd be interested in corp setups that put autoinjectors on guards, with their use tied to the security office. Assuming that runs against a particular facility aren't very common, it might be more cost effective than ware. Especially considering that guards are likely to die within the first 30 seconds of an encounter with runners anyway. Certainly most of them won't live long enough for addiction to be a problem, probably not even long enough for the crash effects to take hold.

Lots of interesting things can happen if you break away from the min/maxing and the need to have the best stats and dice pools.

it is an observable fact that wired reflexes makes you a lot faster (able to perform most combat actions in half the time with no loss of accuracy) and gives you better reflexes. it is not suddenly a lack of roleplaying for someone who is intending to be a combat-oriented character to want something that gives them a massive, objectively-observable edge in combat. there's a reason you don't see any of the modern militaries equipping their soldiers with swords and platemail, and it's because they spent a lot more time thinking about what was effective than they did about what would look cool. it's not unrealistic for someone who is going to be routinely risking their life to want the best gear possible to have the best chance of staying alive.

Jaid, you're quite right, such choices are logical.

I think what Shard was saying, correct me if I'm wrong, Shard, is that if the player decides to try a character in the Shadowrun world who did not have the same opportunity for the best mix, the player can still have a lot of fun and contribute to runs.

Indeed, and it might be the fact that they're not as fast as a chromed out wired up sam that makes the character more interesting. I'm a peasant hero fan at heart, but that's just me. I just hate seeing fun ideas shot down because they're "not as viable", when they could turn out to be a blast story-wise.

playing with the concept

need some help finding a rule
how much/many of the drugs can stack?

got a half made character with a reaction of 9 with cyber/genetech and autoinjectors. depending on the stacking rule, i could have a reaction of 12 to 15 with several passes added on

I am looking at Nitro and overdrive as some of he drugs he will have stacked in his injector, with 6 doses total

i thought about infusions, but they take time to kick in and I don't that with a Juicer.

Addictions: combat drugs, the thrill & rush of extreme stuff like combat

well, the drugs can all stack with each other afaict, but they can't take you beyond your racial maximums. so while 12 might be doable, i'm not entirely clear how you're hitting 15 reaction given that it would require a racial natural maximum of 10.

ah, i wasn't sure if the drugs could push you pass the max

thank you

still, i can drop some of the cyber to balance the numbers out when maxed/ overdosed on the drugs

Some food for thought is that in a world where ( Dicepool 6-8 ) before equipment covers the average corp sec-guard and life is cheap, I'd expect drugs coupled with cheap cyber to be the sop for corps in all but the highest security zones, after all, who really cares if a guard dies from his "safe" dosage?

Screw autoinjectors, you want a Second-Hand Chemical Gland. For 15k + (50*One dose cost), you get enough drugs to keep you happy forever. All this for 0.36 essence!

You may need Restricted Gear, but the ability to use, say, K-10 whenever you freaking want is pretty cool.

Though K-10 is a sure path to death quickly, if you take a natural immunity (to whatever drug of choice, and the GM allows it), you can get all the bonuses of your chosen combat drug/drugs and none of the drawbacks with a single dose every (12-Body) Hours...

This is the path that I took for my Juicer Samurai... he came out okay... though in the end, it does lead to a spiraling path to destruction...

It seems to me that if your body were immune to a drug you wouldn't reap the benifits either.

You would think, but that is not the way it works for the quality, as you are not totally immune to the drug, you just get a pass for the detrimental side effects for a time...

You get to ignore the drawbacks of a single dose once every (12- Body) Hours... You still get the benefits... Don't ask me why, but there it is... However, because you are a character that is constantly using drugs, eventually, you will be forced to eventually exceed this limit (due to ever increasing addiction) and begin to suffer the drawbacks, more and more often, until you have spiraled out of control and overdosed yourself into oblivion... the concept is generally a very short lived cycle for the character as you are forced to abuse those very drugs more and more often until you die...

It is an interesting character concept, but generally a short lived one...

i'm inclined to agree.

See Above, We posted at same time apparently...


Also, the entire concept of the Natural Immunity is adjudicated by the GM, so this may or may not fly in any particular game... but if you are willing to allow this concept, the Natural Immunity is more a drawback in some cases thatn you might think, as it acts as an enabler for quicker addiction times, as the character is more willing to use, and abuse, the drugs which he relies upon for his abilities... Just like the Juicer in RIFTS, they would tend to have a short life expectancy...

Also... just as a side note, you could use Bioware (with some minor drugs and gene tweaks) almost exclusively to mimic the Juicer concept from Rifts...

hmmm... i note only one place where it mentions drugs, and am inclined to think that it was not intended to mean you get only the positive benefits.

nevertheless, i have to agree with you, that is what it says. i suppose if your GM agreed to it, then it's his problem. i probably wouldn't allow it, myself; you should either get the drawbacks as well as the benefits, or you get neither.

What about using nanites to repair the damage caused by drugs?

As for augmenting corp sec people... Wired Reflexes are CHEAP! I mean, come on, 11000 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) for Wired 1 and 32000 for Wired 2. That is REALLY cheap.