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CanRay
post Sep 5 2010, 11:08 PM
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"You will give me my Cork-Filtered Menthol Ciggies right fraggin' now or there will be trouble in this Stuffer Shack!" "*Gibbers incoherently in Aztlaner Spanish*" "AND LEARN SOME FRAGGIN' AMERICAN!!!"
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Wounded Ronin
post Sep 6 2010, 04:59 AM
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QUOTE (Kruger @ Sep 3 2010, 07:59 PM) *
I've been running for years and don't smoke, so yes. Got the Philip Rivers' charity 5K fun run tomorrow actually, not that 5K is very much of a run.

You, you mean shadow runners.

Yeah, probably not. Cigarette smoke carries forever, hangs around, and it's very distinct and unlikely to be mistaken for something else. But there are plenty of substitutes one can use even today. My brother has one of those electronic cigarettes, there's nicotine gum, patches. Heck, by 2072 I'm sure you can get an implant that slow releases. Chewing tobacco or dip isn't really a great alternative for runners because you're gonna have to spit out the juice unless you are all that is man (Maybe a 5 point positive quality in the making there) and swallow it.


If you were a shadowrunner living in Seattle, and you wanted a good Athletics skill, how would you train running in an urban environment?
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Tyro
post Sep 6 2010, 06:37 AM
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QUOTE (Wounded Ronin @ Sep 5 2010, 09:59 PM) *
If you were a shadowrunner living in Seattle, and you wanted a good Athletics skill, how would you train running in an urban environment?

AR overlay on an indoor obstacle course & track
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Saint Sithney
post Sep 6 2010, 08:28 AM
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QUOTE (ColdEquation @ Sep 5 2010, 12:37 PM) *
Overestimating? Why, my guard dogs can smell ya whether you've been smoking or not.

But you do raise a good point- humans have let their sense of smell degrade over the millennia because our primary sense, sight, is so much better than our other senses. The idea of tracking someone by smell is not something that comes naturally to humans, and besides, for the last 8,000 years or so, we've had dogs to do the smelling for us. (Fun historical side note- during the Vietnam War, the US Army issued electronic 'sniffers' to scout units to try and track the Viet Cong by the scents in their urine. Not a super-practical idea, and the project was canned in favor of deploying more K9 teams.)

So, not being a smoker will not contribute to your chances of survival. Go ahead and light up, right? Well...

Think about this. Where are your Shadowrunners going to be where they can get away with smelling like smoke? Most office buildings don't allow smoking inside. Nor do research facilities, as the fine ash and chemical trails that cigarette smoke lets off can mess with sensitive equipment. Someone who smokes a lot may set off chemical detection alarms is a clean room or other sensitive areas.


Actually, tracking dogs aren't typically used to track smokers because cigarette smoke does permanent damage to a dog's smell receptors. They will smell a person alright, but the nicotine makes them blurry targets at best.

QUOTE


Mechanical sniffers would naturally not have this problem.
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CanadianWolverin...
post Sep 6 2010, 08:43 AM
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This reminds me of when I asked about Improved Sense: Scent and Olfactory Booster in the SR4A BBB. The idea of being able to use scent in dark places like shadows intrigues me, could lend some great uses if the GM allows for the use of all the 6th world senses. If a GM only thinks and describes things in terms of sight/visual when it comes to perception, the GM tends to get annoyed when the player asks about what info the other senses is picking up (at least in my experience). But gameplay hurdles aside, I think fluff wise, it would be remiss for some Shadowrun characters to ignore possible sources of mission critical information so they can get the drop on their targets.
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Dumori
post Sep 6 2010, 01:43 PM
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QUOTE (CanadianWolverine @ Sep 6 2010, 09:43 AM) *
This reminds me of when I asked about Improved Sense: Scent and Olfactory Booster in the SR4A BBB. The idea of being able to use scent in dark places like shadows intrigues me, could lend some great uses if the GM allows for the use of all the 6th world senses. If a GM only thinks and describes things in terms of sight/visual when it comes to perception, the GM tends to get annoyed when the player asks about what info the other senses is picking up (at least in my experience). But gameplay hurdles aside, I think fluff wise, it would be remiss for some Shadowrun characters to ignore possible sources of mission critical information so they can get the drop on their targets.

Adepts are a bitch for this for 0.25 pp they can pick up any enchanced sense that is toggable from sent, to infer/ultersonic hearing and more. You can easily make daredevil as an adept for only 0.25 pp you can have echolocation you can also get a +3 on all sight or sound lest for 0.25 pp enhance sense is the most versatile power written. You can mimic any bio/cyber/tech that doesn't rely on none natral mediums. So a super human sense of direction and ultrasound are ok but radar not so much. While some of these are better magic vs essence wise as the implant you mimic they are free and void of any negatives brought on by not being able to toggle they some times have. And some adept powers can mimic more than one implant at once.
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Yerameyahu
post Sep 6 2010, 03:38 PM
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Sure, but you can do most anything just by buying gear, too. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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Glyph
post Sep 6 2010, 06:00 PM
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For a quasi-biological version of ultrasound, you need echolocation, improved hearing, and boosted vocal ability, so an adept doing it purely with adept powers would need improved sense: echolocation, improved sense: hearing enhancement, and voice control. And it would also be a good idea to pick up improved sense: sound dampening, too. So that's 1.25 power points (although everything but the echolocation would be useful for other things, too).

I would probably allow any mix of cyberware, bioware, and adept powers that did the same thing. So for example, someone with echolocation bioware, improved sense: hearing enhancement, and a voice modulator would be fine as far as I'm concerned.
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Snow_Fox
post Sep 6 2010, 07:04 PM
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QUOTE (Wounded Ronin @ Sep 5 2010, 11:59 PM) *
If you were a shadowrunner living in Seattle, and you wanted a good Athletics skill, how would you train running in an urban environment?

just try jogging up the freaking hills going from first to 4th.

For Cordite I know after the range my hands do have a small and residue on them but it washes off easily. I know because my husband complains when I don't.
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Yerameyahu
post Sep 6 2010, 07:09 PM
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Nothing wrong with simply calling any 'gunpowder' residue 'Cordite', inaccurate or not. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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CanRay
post Sep 7 2010, 03:50 AM
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QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ Sep 6 2010, 02:09 PM) *
Nothing wrong with simply calling any 'gunpowder' residue 'Cordite', inaccurate or not. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Gun Nuts are a strange lot (I know, I'm one myself.).

Call a magazine a "Clip" around one and find out.
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Yerameyahu
post Sep 7 2010, 04:19 AM
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Good comparison. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) A magazine is totally a clip, as far as normal English is concerned.
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Kruger
post Sep 7 2010, 05:13 AM
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QUOTE (CanRay @ Sep 6 2010, 07:50 PM) *
Gun Nuts are a strange lot (I know, I'm one myself.).

Call a magazine a "Clip" around one and find out.

Really not a Gun Nut thing. Just a general knowledge thing. The "smell of cordite" is one of the more common mistakes people make when writing about gunfights, and such. Just as nobody who knew what they were talking about would refer to a clip as a magazine, using the term cordite to refer to the smell of burned gunpowder might elicit a snicker from people who know better. Sure, cordite is somewhat more romantic sounding than smokeless powder, or nitrocellulose, or a specific modern propellant name like WC844 or WW231 (lol), but it's wrong.

/shrug I only offered the correction as a bit of interesting trivia. Nobody's hands should ever smell like cordite unless they're firing surplus British rifle ammo from the middle of last century, heh. And the game should have referred to weapons using internal magazines with an (i) instead of an (m) since only a handful of weapons are actually loaded with a clip and all of them would still have internal magazines. It's amused me that even after twenty years and essentially five editions, nobody's ever bothered to correct this when it's an easy fix.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Clip_M1-SKS.JPG

On the left being an actual rifle clip for an M1 Garand, and the right being a stripper clip holding 7.62x39 rounds for an SKS rifle. The one on the right wouldn't actually be loaded into a weapon, it is just there to hold ammunition together before being placed into the rifle's internal magazine.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm...Clip_charge.JPG

Called a stripper clip because the rounds are "stripped" off of the clip as they are pushed down into the weapon's internal magazine. The clip is then discarded, or saved for later reloading.

The easiest way to understand the difference is that a clip holds ammunition so it can be fed into a magazine. A magazine holds ammunition that goes directly into the weapon's chamber for firing. Weapons that use clips have an internal magazine that the clip is fed into.

http://www.yogadork.com/wp-content/uploads...ow1-300x197.jpg

But, clip being incorrect is almost common knowledge these days. Then again, common vernacular isn't always acceptable just because it "is". People refer to laptops as labtops, and say things like "for all intensive purposes". Myself, I kinda like learning things and applying that knowledge rather than making the same mistakes other people do. I'm not a scientist but I still know the difference between a theory and a hypothesis. Shadowrun, for all its attempts to update itself to 21st century tech is still using the 1980's ignorant vernacular, heh.
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Glyph
post Sep 7 2010, 05:54 AM
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QUOTE (Kruger @ Sep 6 2010, 10:13 PM) *
Shadowrun, for all its attempts to update itself to 21st century tech is still using the 1980's ignorant vernacular, heh.

At least cell phones don't weigh 1 kilogram any more.
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Elfenlied
post Sep 7 2010, 08:32 AM
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QUOTE (Glyph @ Sep 6 2010, 07:00 PM) *
For a quasi-biological version of ultrasound, you need echolocation, improved hearing, and boosted vocal ability, so an adept doing it purely with adept powers would need improved sense: echolocation, improved sense: hearing enhancement, and voice control.


SR4A, unfortunately, no longer allows infra or ultrasound for voice control.
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Dumori
post Sep 7 2010, 11:23 AM
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QUOTE (Elfenlied @ Sep 7 2010, 09:32 AM) *
SR4A, unfortunately, no longer allows infra or ultrasound for voice control.

Why it's still referenced in all the other related books that just an annoyingly stupid and pointless change.
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