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> More Ridiculousness, and some ridiculous GM ruling questions on pixie snipers...
Laodicea
post Sep 16 2010, 02:16 PM
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So....
I made a post awhile back about how ridiculous my families SR team is. It's pretty fun, but very over the top ridiculous. A co-worker of mine is going to be joining the table. In the spirit of maintaining the ridiculousness, he wants to create a Pixie Sniper.

Not a sniper that shoots pixies, though that would also be entertaining.

I said "YES!" to the concept because it made me laugh. And the group is already so ridiculous, why not?

I made him take Meta-human customization & Weight Reduction mods on his sniper rifle. He also removed the trigger. Presumably the pixie just has to hold the thing and point it accurately to fire it.

His str and bod are 2.

Now, the question:
when attempting to fire the sniper rifle from flight, what should the - dicepool modifier be? I'm already thinking i'll double the recoil, and make the recoil knock him back. I didn't find anything regarding firing the sniper rifle from a standing position, which in my mind should incur a penalty. Any input on this would be appreciated.
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pbangarth
post Sep 16 2010, 02:22 PM
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There are movement penalties in the combat modifiers tables, so those should apply for flying. I seem to recall there being a chance for knockdown from recoil. In Arsenal?

What about the projectile fired from a weapon sized for pixies? Should the bullet have a reduced damage rating because of size?
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Summerstorm
post Sep 16 2010, 02:40 PM
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Well... per rules a Bod 1, Str 1 gnome (or something) can dish out with a minigun without any recoilcompensation on full auto, while running with just 17 dice penalty. So he just needs 18 to be able to hit something *g*.

But maybe sometimes one should let logic govern a few things. (Yeah i know.. no logic allowed).

First of all: WHY can a pixie fly with gear? I needed to discuss with my pixie player about that too. Why do they have such a high strength-allowance? 3 Unaugmentd is too high, in my opinion. They are like what, 45cm high? 4 Kilogram heavy normaly. And build to fly? (Yeah i know they half-use magic apparently). They should be glad if you let them carry 1 or 2 kg.

But ah well: Fitted sniper for a pixie... sure why not... it's not like those buggers aren't the best in everything already, now you can have them concealed in the sky, ready to make unmagical, untraceable attacks... sigh... (Yeah i am a bit frustrated at them... really, who wrote their stats up?)
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Stahlseele
post Sep 16 2010, 02:46 PM
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So, basically, he wants to play something the rigger can build for less than 5k nuyen? O.o
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Summerstorm
post Sep 16 2010, 02:51 PM
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You can have drone at 5k which has -8 to perception, handling+2, Response(+Handling) of 8, astral sight for clearer shots and skilllevels like a metahuman character and a base speed of 50?
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The Jopp
post Sep 16 2010, 02:54 PM
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Just double any recoil to represent that th pixie does not have a steady firing platform.

Even if the pixie levitated the gun the recoil would push the gun in the opposite direction.
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Laodicea
post Sep 16 2010, 02:55 PM
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His dicepool will be right around 22 with the sniper rifle. He'll have a chameleon suit. The rifle also has chameleon coating. Yeah, he'll be damn near impossible to spot even when he's firing.

I wont feel bad about giving him a hefty - dicepool modifier for shooting while flying. I just need a reasonable number and a good rational for it.
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TommyTwoToes
post Sep 16 2010, 02:56 PM
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QUOTE (pbangarth @ Sep 16 2010, 10:22 AM) *
There are movement penalties in the combat modifiers tables, so those should apply for flying. I seem to recall there being a chance for knockdown from recoil. In Arsenal?

What about the projectile fired from a weapon sized for pixies? Should the bullet have a reduced damage rating because of size?

I like altering the damages based on having weapons sized for the user. A heavy pistol for a troll should be cranking out 12.5mm or 14mm ammo, not standard pistol ammo.

As an alternative, you could change the lifting rules to be based on a % of the lifter's mass, rather than based off of flat numbers.
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Stahlseele
post Sep 16 2010, 02:59 PM
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How much?
A Propperly trained human can lift 1.5 times his own weight i think.
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The Jopp
post Sep 16 2010, 03:00 PM
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Let's just looks at things about SIZE.

A pixie is about 45cm high.

A hand crossbow is the size of a SMG for them.

A sports rifle is twice their size. A Barret would be a piece of artillery for him.

I would force him to use gunnery when handling something of that size.

Not to mention...how much weight does a sniper rifle have...
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Summerstorm
post Sep 16 2010, 03:03 PM
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Human standart... maybe double his weight *g*. If he takes one of the military anti-material rifles... maybe triple to quadruple?
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Laodicea
post Sep 16 2010, 03:18 PM
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QUOTE (The Jopp @ Sep 16 2010, 09:00 AM) *
Let's just looks at things about SIZE.

A pixie is about 45cm high.

A hand crossbow is the size of a SMG for them.

A sports rifle is twice their size. A Barret would be a piece of artillery for him.

I would force him to use gunnery when handling something of that size.

Not to mention...how much weight does a sniper rifle have...



He did take meta-human customization & weight reduction on the sniper rifle, also trigger removal and some other mods like personalized grip.

Weight reduction actually doubles the price of the gun. The other mods are rather cheap. He actually took muscle aug 2, so his str is 4. higher than an average human.

Logically, it's really not possible to miniaturize a .50 caliber sniper rifle down to pixie size, but he took all the right mods to come as close as possible, at least not without suffering horrific, shoulder breaking, recoil.
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suoq
post Sep 16 2010, 03:35 PM
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Could someone please point me to the section that describes the mass (or if you must, weight) of Pixies. So far all I have is that they're short and fragile (low body). For all I know, they have the same mass as a troll.
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CanRay
post Sep 16 2010, 03:39 PM
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QUOTE (The Jopp @ Sep 16 2010, 10:00 AM) *
A Barret would be a piece of artillery for him.

Now I have an image of World War I reenactor Pixies on a bolt-action, single-shot .50 Rifle moving like artillery soldiers.

...

I think I need serious help.
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Mooncrow
post Sep 16 2010, 03:40 PM
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QUOTE (suoq @ Sep 16 2010, 11:35 AM) *
Could someone please point me to the section that describes the mass (or if you must, weight) of Pixies. So far all I have is that they're short and fragile (low body). For all I know, they have the same mass as a troll.


Given that I don't know of a place where a troll's mass is listed, I suppose you're right.

The phrase "delicate physiology" kind of implies that they aren't very dense though.
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Neraph
post Sep 16 2010, 03:42 PM
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QUOTE (Summerstorm @ Sep 16 2010, 08:40 AM) *
(Yeah i know they half-use magic apparently)

No, they fly only with magic. Page 65, Runner's Companion, Pixies, first paragraph, last sentence.

EDIT: I think the best thing to do is ignore everything the developers say about height and weight. They really, really didn't have feasibility in mind when thinking about these things. Trolls are supposed to be 8.2 feet tall but weigh 661 pounds, but can weigh up to 771 pounds. That's really, really fat (or ridiculous slabs of muscle - Arnold the Governator only weighs 250 lbs [113 kg]. Trolls would be about 6x more muscular than him, and only about 2 feet taller). Naga are nearly 33 feet long with 0 reach. Pixies are 45 cm (1.4 feet) tall, which is about half that of a gnome, but they don't have the hitbox penalty of gnomes.
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suoq
post Sep 16 2010, 03:44 PM
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QUOTE (Mooncrow @ Sep 16 2010, 09:40 AM) *
Given that I don't know of a place where a troll's mass is listed, I suppose you're right.

Pg 48. Runners Companion and PG 72 SR4A. Trolls "weigh" 300 kg. (Yeah, I get a twitch when I see grams and weigh...)
QUOTE
The phrase "delicate physiology" kind of implies that they aren't very dense though.

I was wondering if "dense, but brittle" might apply.

Hmmm. Pixies: Small magical creatures of living Osmium. That would explain the vanishing....
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Laodicea
post Sep 16 2010, 03:51 PM
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QUOTE (Neraph @ Sep 16 2010, 09:42 AM) *
No, they fly only with magic. Page 65, Runner's Companion, Pixies, first paragraph, last sentence.



The weird thing is, they don't automatically get a magic attribute. Vampires, people with qualities like Astral sight, do. Pixies don't seem to. It seems like a strange thing to over-look. Perhaps they're assuming that all pixes are mages or adepts. That doesn't seem to be a requirement, though.
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sabs
post Sep 16 2010, 03:53 PM
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QUOTE (suoq @ Sep 16 2010, 04:44 PM) *
Pg 48. Runners Companion and PG 72 SR4A. Trolls "weigh" 300 kg. (Yeah, I get a twitch when I see grams and weigh...)

I was wondering if "dense, but brittle" might apply.

Hmmm. Pixies: Small magical creatures of living Osmium. That would explain the vanishing....


In France we say weigh and grams all the time (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Trolls are 7'5" tall 660 pound monstrosities?

Also, a Pixie with a 4 str.. should be able to carry as much as a human with a 4 str. After all, Str is your overall strength stat. It includes leverage, sinking, etc.
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Summerstorm
post Sep 16 2010, 03:54 PM
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Hm? All sapient critters get magic 1. Clearly stated so.

Well, back to the augmentation: You are giving the pixie deltaware? Highpowered game? You do know they can only get deltaware?

Also: if they fly purely with magic, why do they have wings? I always say: magic for the speed and takeoff. Wings for the maneuvres *g*
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Laodicea
post Sep 16 2010, 03:57 PM
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QUOTE (Summerstorm @ Sep 16 2010, 09:54 AM) *
Hm? All sapient critters get magic 1. Clearly stated so.

Well, back to the augmentation: You are giving the pixie deltaware? Highpowered game? You do know they can only get deltaware?

Also: if they fly purely with magic, why do they have wings? I always say: magic for the speed and takeoff. Wings for the maneuvres *g*



I don't see anywhere that it says they require delta-ware. I do see that it says they require a large amount of customization. But that's a vague fluff piece with no crunch to it.\

EDIT: I was wrong. You were right. They can only take deltaware.
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Neraph
post Sep 16 2010, 03:57 PM
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QUOTE (Laodicea @ Sep 16 2010, 09:51 AM) *
The weird thing is, they don't automatically get a magic attribute. Vampires, people with qualities like Astral sight, do. Pixies don't seem to. It seems like a strange thing to over-look. Perhaps they're assuming that all pixes are mages or adepts. That doesn't seem to be a requirement, though.

Magic, page 84, Runner's Companion.

@ wings: I don't know. Logic would also dictate that if they entered enough BC to negate their Magic they would be unable to fly.
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sabs
post Sep 16 2010, 03:57 PM
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QUOTE (Neraph @ Sep 16 2010, 04:57 PM) *
Magic, page 84, Runner's Companion.

@ wings: I don't know. Logic would also dictate that if they entered enough BC to negate their Magic they would be unable to fly.


Or live (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
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suoq
post Sep 16 2010, 04:03 PM
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QUOTE (Summerstorm @ Sep 16 2010, 09:54 AM) *
Also: if they fly purely with magic, why do they have wings?

Vestigial
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The Jopp
post Sep 16 2010, 04:05 PM
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QUOTE (Neraph @ Sep 16 2010, 04:42 PM) *
Trolls would be about 6x more muscular than him, and only about 2 feet taller).


Well, you know, trolls can be really, really dense... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/grinbig.gif)
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