Apocryphal Rules Errata, Whether revoked or of forign origin this errata may not be official. Options

[Sengir]

Is this stated in the rules? or was it discovered by reverse engineering the examples?

Nope, it's explicitly in the rules. *flipflipflip* Page 50 of Bodytech to be exact.

Looking at that page also reminds me, there's some extra cyber suites in there.

[Draco18s]

The fact that I was kidding aside, 3.5 pounds is still around 80 times the weight of a mouse.

While I am unable to locate any numbers, smaller bodies are effected by forces to a smaller degree than large ones. Sure, 3.5 pounds is 80 times the weight of the mouse, but that "80" value is irrelevant (ants can carry over 100 times their own body weight, for example--mice can carry about a pound and a half in their mouth).

At this point I can agree that the mouse would take some damage, but I do not agree that it would take enough to cause it to hemorrhage blood.

[Synner667]

I'm pretty certain that if I drop an encyclopaedia size/weight book onto a mouse, it will go squelch.

And I think that would weigh less than falling armour.

[Udoshi]

Nope, it's explicitly in the rules. *flipflipflip* Page 50 of Bodytech to be exact.

Looking at that page also reminds me, there's some extra cyber suites in there.

Don't suppose you'd be willing to post those? I'm curious what the germans got that we didn't.

[Ghost_in_the_Sys...]

I'm curious what the germans got that we didn't.

Everything. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[X-Kalibur]

I'm pretty certain that if I drop an encyclopaedia size/weight book onto a mouse, it will go squelch.

And I think that would weigh less than falling armour.

You're comparing weight to mass. By your comparison you would rather have a ton of lead dropped on you as opposed to a ton of feathers? I mean, they are both a ton, after all...

[Ghost_in_the_Sys...]

You're comparing weight to mass. By your comparison you would rather have a ton of lead dropped on you as opposed to a ton of feathers? I mean, they are both a ton, after all...

Indeed, it would be more like setting an encyclopedia on a mouse, which would likely pin it, but not kill it.

Edit: Also, I'd rather have the ton of lead. It'd be alot smaller so I'd have a better chance of getting out of the way (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Draco18s]

Indeed, it would be more like setting an encyclopedia on a mouse, which would likely pin it, but not kill it.

Precisely. Dropping an encyclopedia on a mouse would impart...100 Newtons of force, which would be about....22 pounds.

See? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) The impact force isn't equivalent to the resting weight.

[Sengir]

Don't suppose you'd be willing to post those? I'm curious what the germans got that we didn't.

No.
Well, not until I've finished the list of extra stuff from Arsenal (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)

@Draco18: That would be a light encyclopedia, because a 10 kg book would already exerts a force of ~100 N on the table mouse it rests on...

[Black2754]

Trauma Damper has seen a small change in the German version of Augmentation:

[...]Whenever Physical or Stun damage is inflicted upon a character with a trauma damper, the damper helps reduce the damage. If the damage is Physical, shift 1 box from Physical to Stun; if the trauma stems from Stun damage, subtract 1 box to a minimum of 1 box. [...]

[Yerameyahu]

That's a big difference, wow.

[Draco18s]

@Draco18: That would be a light encyclopedia, because a 10 kg book would already exerts a force of ~100 N on the table mouse it rests on...

If you'd like to do the math yourself, go for it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[Ghost_in_the_Sys...]

If you'd like to do the math yourself, go for it. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

He is correct, a 10kg object at rest on earth exerts roughly 100N of force on whatever is underneath it. Closer to 88N actually, but there you have it.

Math:

CODE

10*2.2*4=88

[Draco18s]

He is correct, a 10kg object at rest on earth exerts roughly 100N of force on whatever is underneath it. Closer to 88N actually, but there you have it.

Math:

CODE

10*2.2*4=88

I was talking 15 N. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

50 pounds falling 2 meters with 1 second of deceleration (they're soft and flimsy, after all, and go whumf, not klunk) exerts about 313 Newtons of force, of which 95% is imparted directly to the floor (the other 5% to the mouse), or 15 N. This is equivalent to the force exerted by a 3.5 pound object at rest. The same 3.5 pound object hitting the ground (same deceleration as above) is 100 Newtons of force (which is itself equivalent to an 12kg object at rest).

You guys keep going "clothing falling on a mouse is like hitting it with a (stack of) bricks!" and it's not.

[Ghost_in_the_Sys...]

Except we're not talking about clothing, we're talking about armor which includes metal plates. I'll agree with you all day long that a cloth shirt falling on a mouse isn't going to crush it, but if you want to tell me that a stack of metal plates held together with some cloth isn't going to cause it problems, I'm going to say you're quite wrong.

And I know you were talking 15N, he was saying that an encyclopedia generally weighs more than that, which it does. [edit]or rather, can and generally does[/edit]

Also the 95% imparted to the floor is basically total crap. That's like saying if a sumo wrestler sits on you, you'll barely feel it because 95% of his weight is 'imparted on the floor'

[Draco18s]

Except we're not talking about clothing, we're talking about armor which includes metal plates. I'll agree with you all day long that a cloth shirt falling on a mouse isn't going to crush it, but if you want to tell me that a stack of metal plates held together with some cloth isn't going to cause it problems, I'm going to say you're quite wrong.

First off, if the guy transforms into a mouse and ends up in the toe of his boot, he's not going to get ANY weight dropped on him.

Second, if he's barefoot, his shirt (armor vest, whatever) is likely going to miss him entirely, as it won't fall strait down, so he only has to deal with his pants, and even then probably only one leg of the pants.

Third, we're talking impact force of the armor falling on the mouse. This is momentary force and objects (especially "soft bodied" objects like living creatures) can survive much higher impact forces than they can sustained forces. It'd be like a Sumo wrestler sitting on you for about a third of a second. You'll feel it and then go "that was nothing."

[Ghost_in_the_Sys...]

Why wouldn't an armored shirt/vest fall strait down? It certainly isn't light enough for the wind to blow it away.

I should remind that I don't think you should take a bunch of damage for shape shifting to a mouse, but there is some potential danger in it if the person is wearing armor.

You're also looking more at the sumo jumping on you as opposed to sitting on you for a fraction of a second.

[Draco18s]

Why wouldn't an armored shirt/vest fall strait down? It certainly isn't light enough for the wind to blow it away.

Hm, I don't know. Maybe you're leaning over to one side, and the mouse-you ends up on the other side. I just mean "doesn't fall towards the mouse for maximum impact potential."

Oh, and FYI: you can throw mice out the window of a 30 story building all day and none of them will take any injury for it.

[MJBurrage]

...Drugs are -supposed- to have a listed Power and Speed, but someone forgot...

The link in the above quote goes to Synner's user page and my SearchFu has failed me on finding a related post.

[Ghost_in_the_Sys...]

That's true for many small things because 1) they have so little mass that even a fall from that distance is a small force and 2) air resistance stops them falling particularly fast.

[darthmord]

I'm pretty certain that if I drop an encyclopaedia size/weight book onto a mouse, it will go squelch.

And I think that would weigh less than falling armour.

Yet I recall a mouse having been run through a laser printer's rollers and survived without injury...

Seriously. The smaller rodents have bones & internal organs more flexible than rubber.

[Draco18s]

Yip. Mice only need about a quarter of an inch to squeeze through. Through a laser printer seems....absurd, but I've heard stranger things.

[Sengir]

Just got a bit colder in hell, because I finally managed to find enough time to put together the stuff from Arsenal 2070: http://www.scribd.com/doc/57395589/German-Extras


I tried to keep the fluff descriptions short and with emphasis on info relevant for gameplay, if you want the full fluff buy the books (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[Stahlseele]

Just got a bit colder in hell, because I finally managed to find enough time to put together the stuff from Arsenal 2070: http://www.scribd.com/doc/57395589/German-Extras


I tried to keep the fluff descriptions short and with emphasis on info relevant for gameplay, if you want the full fluff buy the books (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

Nice, hope you won't get in trouble for that!

[Sengir]

Character generators with that kind of information have been around for some time, so I do not expect to get any trouble for it...and I've got a cover page on my todo list, that will of course have the usual legalese and credits. And all those widows are on that list, too.

PS: MJ, you still got it wrong (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)
The 10% Essence discount from cybersuites is added to other modifiers. The 10% price discount is multiplied.
And that kind of confusion is exactly why I hate this change...