reasonable powered armour and cyber limbs Options

[DocMortand]

"ECM includes radio, infrared jammers, chaff and flare dispensers, wave harmonic disrupters that confound sensor systems and jam the communications of opposing remote-control operations." (R3, pg. 143) So if the ECM is jacked up as high as it can go, the dread can function as a pretty good drone remote jammer. Probably wouldn't be effective against military - they would have ECCM higher than 6, methinks. Altho the Light Scout in R3 has ECM/ECCM 5...so that might be wrong.

And if the guns on the dreadnought are remote turrets, how are they fired? through the VCR using gunnery? What kind of modifiers would there be for firing while walking then? (never did know how to do that even in a van with remote turret)

As far as turrets - small turrets are good. The max I see in R3 is assault cannon, autocannon, vehicle lasers and water cannons. This would include rocket launchers, miniguns and everything else fun. Good enough. I wonder what the equivalent to the Meltagun is...*chuckle*

By the way, with Body 4, how big/tall would the dread be? I know in 40K the thing is almost twice man sized (if you go by model size), but is more wide than tall. *shrug*

[Austere Emancipa...]

[DocMortand]

So can we replace the ECM with that instead? or is there no room in the inn?

Ya know, this might actually make this useful in battlefield operations - except for the price. But if we can jam as much anti-drone machinery in there and have a fantastic rigger (which you would need no matter what vehicle you used), it would be worth it. What's the updated price?

Grawr! I wish I could help build a better walker for humanity, but I don't have the chops (yet)...I will tho, I will....

[Austere Emancipa...]

You absolutely shouldn't replace the ECM with that, since that's far from being the main purpose of the ECM system. And being able to do MIJI doesn't make this walker or walkers in general any better relative to other vehicles -- you can do the exact same thing with any vehicle or even without a vehicle, the only difference the vehicle makes is indirectly through extra Flux gained from the Body rating, and even that's just one 1 extra Complementary die on the MIJI test(s, can't remember how they all work) per 2 Body.

You'll be much better off with one dedicated Electronic Warfare vehicle per company, with maximum rating everything and several riggers. All those MIJI tests take Complex Actions (or more), so the lone pilot of a walker might not be willing to engage in MIJI on the battlefield anyway.

[mfb]

s'why you pack an extra drone brain into your vehicle, with AIS and the electronic warfare vehiclesoft.

[Austere Emancipa...]

Advanced Drone Pilot-5 + AIS-5 + EW Autosoft-5 = 550,000 nuyen + 1 CF on this particular chassis
You can get it for 161,000 nuyen at rating 4, which is more affordable, but you'll be stuck with 4 dice when you can bet your opponent is rolling 6 from skill.

[Hero]

->mfb

The drone brain is the invisable co-pilot, in that it takes over most of the tracking of targets after the pilot designates a target, or the threat status of those in its sensor range cause the drone to engage them automatically. Or the pilot wants to do the targeting on his own, he can switch piloting controls over to the drone computer, so he can concentrate on engaging targets. And if the pilot is incapacitated, the drone computer can make limited but flexable dicisions on it own, mainly how to get back to the base or insertion/extraction point.

->General

Went throughout the build a few times to see where I messed up, also with the Amendments to the Drive-by-Wires, the price came down by a 1 million plus. Should be easier to swallow now. I have been considering removing the Drive-by-Wires, as this will most likely be piloted by some with a VCR 1 or 2 at least and that will cancel out the handling increase due to the armor, but then it is also designed to be piloted by those without it. I guess a handling of 4 is not to bad.

Well here is the amended Dreadnought

T.A.W (Tactical. Assault. Walker) Mark IV Dreadnought
Hand: 2/2
Speed: 72
Accel: -
Body: 4
Armor: 12
Sig: 4
Autonav: 4
Sensor: 7
CF: 4
Load: 376
Seat: 1
Entry: 1h
Fuel: 160L Diesel
Econ: 4km/l
Chassis: XL-Walker
SI: *
Avail: *
Cost: 1,526,500
*GM discretion

::Control::
• Drive-by-Wires 3
• Rigger Adaptation
• Secondary Controls
::Protective::
• APPS
• Crash Cage
• Enviro Seal Gas/Water/Engine-Seal/Over-pressurized)
• Life-Support (48hr)
::Weapons::
• Modular Weapon Arm*(2CF Internal ammo bin; Smartlink II interface)
• 2x Power Claw Arm*(Strength: 20; external flame thrower/chaingun)
::Electronics::
• ECM: 6
• ECCM: 6
::Accessories::
• Spot Light

*There are one modular mounting space, both arm attachments(power claw or weapons turret) use the same modular mounting space, either one or the other can be used per mounting space.

[mfb]

it's expensive, sure, but i think it'd be worth it. and, actually, if the rigger is in control of the vehicle himself, he wouldn't need a second drone brain. just slap a rating 4-5 in place of the default. give it standing orders to defend against MIJI attacks, and give it a pre-programmed command for MIJI'ing targeted transmitters.

in case you can't tell, i'm a big fan of versatile riggers.

[Austere Emancipa...]

Yep, now it's down to the same price range as conventional vehicles with similar capabilities, only it retains the maneuverability advantage while being lighter armed and armored and having slightly lower device ratings.

mfb: Second drone brain?

[Edit]BTW Hero, you do realize that it can only have one small turret, right? Those things take 2 Hardpoints per turret, and you get one Hardpoint per 2 Body.[/Edit]

[mfb]

indeed. i doubt it's strictly allowed by the rules, but it shouldn't be that hard to install a second drone brain in a vehicle, for handling secondary tasks.

[Hero]

Oops. Well having a mechanical arm and a weapon turret still make it a versitile vehicle, also frees up some CF and weight too, though an expensive one at that. But since there can be only one small turret on it, that means a minor reduction in price, 35,000:nuyen:.

[mfb]

unless you've filled them up with other stuff, those two arms can contain internal cyberweapons.

[DocMortand]

Gah...I tried to recreate this from scratch and I'm not getting the same numbers here.

How did you get the speed up to 72 (the max is 60, additions add 30 to it, and if you pumped all of the 10% addon from the drive-by-wire you still will only increase it 6, max...so it could be 66, or 90, or 96...not 72.)

Also, with the 12 armor the handling would be 3/3 not 2/2...

And also what would the price be if you just only had the 1 mech arm, 1 remote turret...create several models, don't make it modular. It jacks up the price.

I know it comes with a drone brain - where do you find the stats on how to raise it's intelligence and assign it to certain duties?

Also I have more CF...oh I see, never mind. *confused by multiplicity of arms/turrets*

[mfb]

drone rating = intelligence. assigning it certain duties is just a matter of giving it commands, or (for more complex stuff) creating pre-programmed commands.

[DocMortand]

By the way, where the heck is a R/C Emulator? in the EW section is specifies you need that for MIJI attacks just to be able to sleaze into the system.

This Dreadnought is looking better and better, frankly...especially if you have a drone brain doing constant MIJI attacks while you're stalking the battlefield. I still need to know if there are modifiers to firing while walking...you're dividing your attention between two systems - is it even possible? Or is that what you have the autonav for? Autonav 4 does have some nice features...can you use autonav 4 to retreat under fire while firing the remote turret?

BTW...most Dreads in 40K have one power claw and one weapon mount, so the fact that it turns out you have to do it that way in designing it here is ironic.

[Austere Emancipa...]

[Garland]

I'm sure he meant "stalking" in the "lumbering about ominously" sense. :P

[DocMortand]

[Hero]

->DocMortand

I got the speed rating up to 69 by using the Smart Materials design enhancement feature, it increases acceleration, load and speed ratings by 15% each, on top of giving a -1 modifier to handling test for stress. Then I increased the speed up to 72 with Drive-by-Wires by increasing the speed further by 5%. And as for the rest of it, I was trying my best to make it so that when it was purchased, it had all the parts for the three primary patterns; Tactical, Furioso, and Firestorm. Tactical is where it has a vehicle weapon and one power claw equipped, Furioso is where it is equipped with two power claws, and Firestorm is equipped with two vehicle weapons. Unfortunately the Firestorm pattern cannot be done if I follow the Rigger 3 rules to the letter, maybe I could get away with over looking that I only have 2 hard points, but I am sure that it will raise an eye brow or two and confuse the newbes on the forums. But then again if the different patterns where sold separately, the price could be reduced greatly.

And as for the co-pilot computer system, it was not incorporated into the Dreadnought, the co-pilot computer is featured in the HAA-3 Mk. III Powered Armor. But making it standard in the TAW Mark IV Dreadnought would be a good idea. For an additional 200,000:nuyen:, you get the Invisapliot™ Co-Pilot system, follows as bellow

->General

Invisapliot™ Co-Pilot system

There is a special drone computer that takes over much of the target tracking and control, it also is can take control of the vehicle when the pilot is not actively piloting or is incapacitated. The drone computer takes over all of the primary functions of tracking and firing at the target, the pilot only must make a gunnery test. The advanced software package includes Robotic Reflexes 3, Robotic-Pilot Advanced programming, Fuzzy Logic 5, Improved Neural Network Algrorithms 5. Treated as a robot with adaptation pool 10 (+10 to adaptation pool to comprehension test), when not controlled by a pilot.

[DocMortand]

THanks - that fills in the blanks. I'm loading in more electronics gizmos over here now that I think I've caught up. CMCs in particular strike me as useful - as well as other things. Want me to publish my variant once I've got it done? I'll understand if you'd rather I didn't.

[edit] Heh...Invisapilot. *nod* Makes sense to put that in there. Other things you really want are Power Amplifiers (boosts your flux ratings of ECM/ECCM, R/C decks, etc. by as much as 10 for only 5 design points/.25 CF per point)]

[Hero]

No problem at all, go ahead, I wouldn't have posted them if I did not want others to use/modify them.

[DocMortand]

OK, here's my variant - I had to reconstruct a lot, and then expanded a bit. I'm not quite sure where your money went, but I haven't paid for all the weapons you have, either. The R/C Deck with EW warfare addons are not calculated into the price, but the slot to put it into is ready.

TAW-EW Mark V Dreadnought
Hand: 2/2
Speed: 72
Accel: -
Body: 4
Armor: 12(18 with 3 points ablative armor)
Sig: 5
Autonav: 4
Sensor: 7
CF: .25
Load: 555 [no weapons yet]
Seat: 1
Entry: 1h
Fuel: 160L Diesel
Econ: 4km/l
Chassis: XL-Walker
SI: *
Avail: *
Cost: 1,176,100
*GM discretion

::Control::
• Drive-by-Wires 3
• Rigger Adaptation
• Secondary Controls
• Contingency Maneuver Controls 3
::Protective::
• APPS
• Crash Cage
• Enviro Seal Gas/Water/Engine-Seal/Over-pressurized)
• Life-Support (48hr)
::Weapons::
• Remote Small Turret*(2CF Internal ammo bin; Smartlink II interface, 9pts Gunnery adjust)
• Power Claw Arm*(Strength: 20)
::Electronics::
• ECM: 7
• ECCM: 7
• Power Amplifier: 10
• Electronics Port (R/C Deck w/addons to be added to this port for EW ops)
::Accessories::
• Spot Light
• Radar Absorbent Materials (+3 Sig), Smart Materials

Of course, you need to add the price of the weapon in the turret - and I'm not exactly sure how to put the chaingun in the arm...the CF for the arm is accounted for, so change it how you wish. You'll notice there is still a little wiggle room for more gadgets. Someone more knowledgeable than I will have to fill it up. :)

This is the first vehicle I've ever constructed - thanks for the blueprints, they taught me a lot on how to build the bloody thing when I reconstructed it. *dances a happy dance*

[Edit]: Doh! Forgot the power amps...they're added on now.

[Hero]

The price difference between my version and yours might be from the changes they did in the Rigger 3 Revised, I am still using the first run of Rigger 3. And as for the weapons on the power claws, those are bolted on by a armored equipment box with its own ammunition, I was not sure that would consume CF of I did not use any CF for it. I just might add Power Amps to my design, and I am still trying to figure away to make the Firestorm Pattern, maybe change the remote turret size to tiny but then it can't use any of the medium powered vehicle weapons. I know there is away I can make it work within the rules, there has to be away.

[DocMortand]

Well, even in 40K there really wasn't a true Firestorm design - there never was a Dread with two Lascannons or two Missile Launchers. It has been a while tho.

Yeah, I have R3 Revised, so a lot of the pricing probs are gone. I still need to do a little more research into how to get the drone brain to do piloting/gunnery while the rigger is doing EW, or a drone brain doing EW, etc. Can anyone point to a place where it explains how to roll the drone brain doing EW while the rigger is doing gunnery/piloting?

From what I can tell, the RC Deck would need the Protocol Emulator at high level to do MIJI attacks effectively, and adding it all in there (the CF for the deck is accounted for on the plans - .25) would up the price a bit - but I'm not sure yet how much...too tired to finish up.

By the way, does anyone know if you need something to broadcast with to do EW attacks (like a microwave dish, or something similar) or does it come with the RC Interface?

[Cynic project]

And you missed the point. Dreads are too big. They simply are not what I am looking for.

I mean the reason why you could think of power armour is the fact that you can fit intobuildings. Even more so when you have buildings built with trolls in mind. Now Troll sized powered armour is going to limited in it's use, but it will still be small enough to work in pure ubran warfair..If not urban peace keeping. Note that in urban wars, you tend to blow out walls for doorways, and do nto care if the building you are going into will be standing in 24 hours.you just want to go in and clear things out.

Also in shaodwrun you have things like bugspirits that wile they can't take out tanks, are capable of taking unit of normal troops. But it is unknown if a power suit would either make a tropper better or at least more equal to a threat like a bug.