 Can we beatt he Horrors?, It needed its own thread. |
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 Jan 12 2004, 10:52 PM
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#426
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 223 Joined: 23-December 03 Member No.: 5,929  |
imagine if CH could bring her back again. that'd be nasty even the changing of the worlds couldn't keep it away. was there actual ressurection or did it just step in when she tried to commit suicide?
if it was ressurection, that would be a cool ritual to bring someone back mellenia later based on their pattern. imagine the fools lining up at the institute of chantrel's horror to learn that one and bring back some poor lost relative. edit: i am so genuinely sorry this thing has made it to 18 pages. can we banish it without further damage to kagetenshi? |
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Jan 12 2004, 11:22 PM
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#427
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
It was genuinely resurrection caused by a special power that the Horror has that more or less rebuilds the person. It does have some limits on how it can use it, but in general most people are screwed.
Banishing this thread will cause an immediate Astral Slice attack on me. ;) ~J |
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Jan 13 2004, 01:07 AM
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#428
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
That's what you get for binding it to yourself with a little blood.
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Jan 13 2004, 01:20 AM
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#429
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
And I just let a copy of the Horrors sourcebook slip through my fingers. Blast. If anyone reading this thread won it, allow me to now call you a bastard and then congratulate you.
~J |
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Jan 13 2004, 02:41 AM
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#430
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,751 Joined: 8-August 03 From: Neighbor of the Beast Member No.: 5,375 |
Can't let that happen. :) |
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Jan 13 2004, 06:38 PM
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#431
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
I was under the impression that C's H eventually moved on. Perhaps Chantrel eventually went insane enough that the Horror couldn't get any more sustenance out of her. Perhaps the Horror was off chewing on someone else during the years-long period when it let Chantrel think it had forgotten her. One victim at a time, perhaps, but not a single victim for a whole Age. That just doesn't seem cost-effective. :) |
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Jan 13 2004, 07:01 PM
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#432
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 114 Joined: 24-November 02 Member No.: 3,638 |
Oops. We were betting against each other, weren't we? :| I lost too, I don't know who got it. I snagged the Blood Wood book, though. :D |
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Jan 13 2004, 08:11 PM
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#433
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
No, I was waiting to snipe and then lost track of the time. It was my own idiotic mistake. Had I been more on the ball, yes, we would have been bidding against each other :)
~J |
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Jan 13 2004, 08:43 PM
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#434
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 114 Joined: 24-November 02 Member No.: 3,638 |
Maybe we need a repository of Dumpshock users' ebay IDs so we only steal things from each other if we mean to. Or at least so we know who to call bastard and then congratulate. |
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Jan 13 2004, 08:57 PM
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#435
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Or so we can keep track of what items the other is bidding on, in case there's a good one we can steal :grinbig:
~J |
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Jan 14 2004, 07:12 PM
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#436
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 293 Joined: 27-January 03 From: Kentucky, USA Member No.: 3,958 |
Yeah, I missed that copy of Horrors too. :( Ah well.
Managed to pick up three SR adventures for less than $15 though. Trying to collect stuff with all the bug/Horror related info. Speaking of which, are the bug adventures in Super Tuesday and Shadows of the Underworld any good? |
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Jan 14 2004, 07:30 PM
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#437
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 518 Joined: 24-February 03 From: Tucson Member No.: 4,153 |
I can say that the one in Super Tuesday was a pain in the ass to complete, but fun. :D |
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Jan 14 2004, 08:49 PM
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#438
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,362 Joined: 3-October 03 From: Poway, San Diego County, CA, USA Member No.: 5,676 |
Well, presumably they were beaten at least once before. And the people who beat them didn't have jet planes and tanks.
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Jan 14 2004, 08:51 PM
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#439
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
Well, not, actually. We hid and when the mana went away, so did the Horrors. I know there's a lot of thread to read, but I'm pretty sure it's been said before.
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Jan 14 2004, 08:54 PM
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#440
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Why oh why didn't I take the blue pill. Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,545 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gloomy Boise Idaho Member No.: 2,006 |
Or nukes, lasers, nanotechnology, Bio and chemical warfare, an understanding of tactics, Orbital cannons capable of reducing city's to large craters, anti-mana and mana eating bacteria and the list goes on and on.
I'm not saying it will be an easy fight, but it will be a fight we win without question. Unless of course there is some kind of technological apocalypse between now and then. If that happens were screwed. |
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Jan 14 2004, 09:09 PM
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#441
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
Your opposition has a greater history of bio-engineering, has created sentient microorganisms, and has altered the state of a living creature into a different species. Most of your bio-weapons are bacteria and virii that you found and isolated. You mana-active bacteria are also things that were found to be naturally occuping, or an uncontrolled mutation that turned out to be potentially useful.
Nukes: no official equivalent, all debate is theoretical Lasers: magical equivalents are old ideas, the tech version might do better Chemical: whether any compounds that are toxic to humans have anny effect on outsiders is unknown Other biological detail: unless two species have very similar biology, a disease will not be infectious to the target, most biological weapons are more uncertain tahn chemical weapons, only a few show promise Tactics: not new, last time, humanity fought with every tactic and dirty trick they could think of Orbital cannons: calculate the time to drop a rock versus the time to escape the kill zone at 6000 km/h Nanotech: can surpass biological warfare, once you learn enough about a target biology to configure it correctly |
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Jan 14 2004, 09:14 PM
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#442
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Yeah, 'cuz it's possible that humanity forgot about the whole thing in 60 years. There's no official equivalent to trains AFAIK. Or eyeglasses. Or scissors. All debate on the effects of eyeglasses and scissors in the SR world is therefore theoretical.
Nobody is saying that tactics didn't exist back then. However, it's obvious that tactics have improved. The list of tactics and dirty tricks metahumanity knows in 2063 is quite a lot longer than the one back in the ED days, as has been discussed repeatedly before in this thread and the other.
One of the major points of the pro-horror crew has been that the astral forms of the horrors are nigh-indestructible. If the buggers can go totally astral, then they don't need to go anywhere from the kill zone. If they had to, then the good ole 500 megaton trick would work nicely. I'm not trying to start the debate again or anything, just repeating the same counter-arguments about those points that were stated before, but apparently either forgotten or ignored. |
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Jan 15 2004, 01:20 AM
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#443
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Why oh why didn't I take the blue pill. Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,545 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gloomy Boise Idaho Member No.: 2,006 |
They do? How many horror microbiologist are there? How many horrors have spent their whole existence looking for just the right bug that could destroy themselves if it ever got exposed to air? I'm not talking about destroying other species, but themselves.
Aren’t there Barghiest spliced with Piasma's in one of the modules...
Useful is useful regardless of how long you have had it or how you discovered it.
Right. Check your brain at the door did we? Can anyone tell me the damage code on 1,000,000 degrees centigrade? Doesn't matter really though, by the time the horrors get hear nukes will be old school. We will be packing neutron bombs and antimatter torpedoes.
Your probably right there. By the time the Horrors arrive lasers will be as old as bows and arrows. How about Phasers, or proton emitters, Particle Accelerator cannons... I could go on but I think we get the picture. One more: Anti-matter Blasters oooh!
Acid is acid.....
There is more to biologicals then diseases, just ask the US army.
I am sure the ED guys did all they could with their stone knives and bear skins. I am also sure a modern army is far, FAR, superior than anything that is fielded before it. 200 years ago our armies were powerful, but they still marched in a strait line toward enemy fire.
LEO or Low-Earth-Orbit is 41km. Using the simplest of technology a rail gun, you could accelerate a large chunk of nickel iron to about 30,000 km per second. For all intense and purposes it would arrive the moment it was fired. There would be no appreciable time difference. As for how much it destroyed, well the simple answer is: everything at ground zero.
You don't have to know squat. Everything has cells of one kind or another, simply program the little buggers to destroy all tissue and let em go. And in 3000 years I would expect some serious advances in this field. Bottom line: I am not going to convince you, no one is. You believe the horrors are all powerful and mighty cause they were in ED. Big whoop. The human race has kicked more ass and shed more blood than the horrors ever will, and you know what? Were damn good at it. Damn good. And we will continue to get better at it. And when the horrors appear and all of Humanity is united against them, no force on heaven or earth will be able to stop us. We will be hunting them down and killing them while they cry in the corner like little girls. And when there are no more here, we will build dimensional flux agitators and go after them in their home dimension and kick their horned heads in. |
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Jan 15 2004, 02:49 AM
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#444
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 156 Joined: 16-August 03 From: Santa Cruz Member No.: 5,500 |
How many men with swords does it take to kill a vampire?
How many vampires can a highly trained adept/street same in (mil spec)powered amror with laser rifle kill? 200 years ago,that man in could carry the fire power of a company.That's with small arm fire. Humanity has larger armies now,than it ever did in any time of peace.Our armies are built around more fire power per-person,and it is working.The war in iraq is proof of that.I think 500 deaths on our side. Go back 60 years,when assaults on smaller armed bases (than iraq.Towns even!) had that number in a day. We drive tanks that are all but immune to anything predating the civil war.If I am right,this includes navel guns! Our planes can kill planes from 50 years ago and never be seen on radar. Our hellacpoters can stop all the air power 60 years ago. Now, given that 100 years,it unlikely to have fighter/bombers that aren't going into in LO, if not space it's self. Now, given the facts that the speed we are arming ourselves, anything I say now will be pointless in 200 years,let alone 2,000 years. |
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Jan 15 2004, 04:24 AM
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#445
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Target Group: Members Posts: 87 Joined: 8-March 03 From: Northern Virginia Member No.: 4,223 |
I must have missed this in Man & Machine. Are these listed next to the eye guns? In any case, a gun that fits in a person's navel would have to be pretty small, so shrugging it off with a tank wouldn't be much of an accomplishment in my book. (Hey...if I hadn't written it, Fortune would have. And to Fortune, I say... Beat you to it again! Nyah Nyah!) |
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Jan 15 2004, 04:46 AM
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#446
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 665 Joined: 20-November 03 Member No.: 5,834 |
Just for fun I did a few calculations on how powerful that chunk of nickle iron would be. If we assume our Iron-Nickle projectile weighs 5 kilograms (Fairly light, it could easily be triple digits) then:
Energy = 2.250E+9 Joules (2,250,000,000) A ton of explosive translates into 4,184,000,000 Joules. In other words a 5 kilo orbital bombard is worth about half a kiloton. Which, as we've seen already, will wipe out anything. Math is fun. Here's another fun bit of Math: In Earthdawn a great Dragon is worth about 450,000 Legend Points (LP). Verjigorm is worth about 2,000,000 LP. While Dragons were totally unbeatable in Earthdawn, in Shadowrun metahumans are so badass it's quite possible to make an adept capable of killing a great dragon in melee combat at chargen, much less what you can do with 5 initiations and a force 12 weapon foci. Thus a Shadowrunner might well be worth 450,000 LP all by himself. However such characters are generally called munchy so let's ignore that. Instead we'll go back to our old favorite Shadows of the Underworld and Masaru. He got his scaly butt handed to him by 4 elite veteran shadowrunners who then proceeded to steal his most precious possession, his egg. (Incidentally, since we've heard that great dragon lairs are essentially Kaers, does that mean that any old team of Shadowrunners can break into a Kaer, which is capable of holding off the combined might of all the Horrors at once? Dang, those horrors are really looking scary now.) Be that as it may, these shadowrunners had to physically combat the dragon and subdue him (at least one had claw marks), and also deal with any magic and magical defenses the dragon had. That establishes that they couldn't have shot him in his sleep or something, this was a real battle. But they won. So, 4 elite shadowrunners = 1 great dragon. 5 Great Dragons = Verjigorm. Nasty math result coming up. 1 Person with knowledge of Verjigorm's powers and location + 20 elite battle-hardened shadowrunners/mercenaries/specop fighters = no more Verjigorm. He's the toughest horror there is. And yet simple math strongly implies any City, Megacorp, or even the larger street gangs, given reasonable knowledge of what and who verjigorm is and his location, can kill him with a low-budget strike team. Using nothing but current Shadowrun technology, actually stuff a few years out of date. The smartest thing a horror can do is never, ever, come into our world. Or if it does, make like a vampire or insect spirit and hide under a rock praying the authorities never find you. |
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Jan 15 2004, 05:49 AM
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#447
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
I saw it. I just left it for you to give your self-esteem a much needed boost. ;) :) |
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Jan 15 2004, 05:52 AM
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#448
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
Dunno, with a troll sized cyber-torso, there is probably plenty of room behind the navel to stick a naval gun. Technology wins again!
[edit] Screw the nukes and sharp sticks, when the horrors come and see how bad our puns are, they will decide that they couldn't possibly inflict any more pain and suffering on us. Then they will just go home. [/edit] |
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Jan 15 2004, 07:31 AM
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#449
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
Actually, I keep getting told that an explosive device million times as powerful as that won't do shit... |
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Jan 15 2004, 07:40 AM
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#450
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Why oh why didn't I take the blue pill. Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 6,545 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gloomy Boise Idaho Member No.: 2,006 |
All have to say is,
Just watch, and bring the hotdogs. |
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