 Can we beatt he Horrors?, It needed its own thread. |
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 Jan 16 2004, 10:02 PM
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#501
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Runner  Group: Members Posts: 2,751 Joined: 8-August 03 From: Neighbor of the Beast Member No.: 5,375  |
And to sum up:
Can too!! -And- GO HUMANS!! 21, baby. Who says you can't say "can-too" and "can-not" a bunch and call it a debate? |
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Jan 16 2004, 10:59 PM
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#502
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
It wasn't a hot idea, the bugs didn't get shit out of it. Ambergel was flavor text. It didn't mark people, it didn't have any mystic power, it was just cool. No-one gained anything from it, except Strice Corporation made some money 'cause it was tasty. Remember, Invae aren't Horrors. They're harbingers. And no-one cared that it was gone excep Strice, which needed a new product. By "they didn't stop carrying it" I meant no-one raised an uproar, no-one ever found out. Strice did not choose to stop carrying it. No one ever did anything about Ambergel, per se. They kicked something else's ass, and then there wasn't any more. All I said before was, if one of the bigger Horrors ended up marketing gifts all throughout the world, that would be pretty cool and would be a good way to spread some Marks. I still think that's the case.
Probably. Which I why I've been arguing that it's not our weapons that matter, it's how much we know when things start out. A united Humankind might do pretty well. The Humankind of the shadowrun world - and the real world - is anything but united.
One of these things is not like the other.
Agreed. Isn't that the point of the Will in the first place? edited for clarity. |
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Jan 16 2004, 11:05 PM
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#503
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,028 Joined: 9-November 02 From: The Republic of Vermont Member No.: 3,581 |
As I read it, the first one was sarcasm, mocking the "Horrors can infiltrate anything because humans have no security whatsoever and never question when people in sensitive positions start acting weird" position the pro-Horrors have been pushing. |
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Jan 17 2004, 01:13 AM
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#504
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,751 Joined: 8-August 03 From: Neighbor of the Beast Member No.: 5,375 |
Thanks, John. Yes, that was my point.
I could be mistaken but I don't think D mentions "Horrors" in the Will. Certainly not in the context that you make it out to be... Anyone want to check that for us? Thanks! (can too!) |
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Jan 17 2004, 01:16 AM
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#505
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 156 Joined: 16-August 03 From: Santa Cruz Member No.: 5,500 |
We have weapons that bigger and badder than forces of nature.Make one of those now,and you'll get a good light show,then nothing. |
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Jan 17 2004, 09:21 PM
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#506
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Target Group: Members Posts: 15 Joined: 12-January 04 Member No.: 5,974 |
I do not agree with the assumption that the horrors will have spent the last age improving, researching, etc. If they did improve this much between scourges, then how did metahumanity survive the 4th age?
Is there any evidence in ED or SR on the power level of the horrors during the 2nd age? I have not seen anything on these boards or in anything I have read that indicated that the horrors were substantially weaker or less intelligent during the 2nd age - I was under the impression that they were even then able to slaughter anything they wanted to, from the young races up to great dragons. However, if this is the case, did the horrors improve between the 2nd and 4th age? Given how much metahumanity has learned during the 5th age, it seems that if the horrors were capable of improving, they would have mopped the floor with metahumanity during ED.] Therefor, it seems to me that the coming scourge will be very similar to the last one. If this is the case, there might be hope for humanity. |
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Jan 17 2004, 11:24 PM
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#507
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 665 Joined: 20-November 03 Member No.: 5,834 |
Since it seems likely that a horror mark will leave the horror vulnerable to a counter-strike through ritual sorcery, I'd say the horrors marking everybody at random is very unlikely. Those who do won't last long once large magic groups start blowing markers away with ritual combat spells. The more I see of the horrors the more obvious it becomes that they're dead meat. They're just screwed when technology takes a hand. Example:
See Chantrel's Horror. See Chantrel. See Chantrel go into Space. See Chantrel's Horror Piss and Moan Impotently. Piss and Moan Chantrel's Horror, Piss and Moan! See Chantrel's Horror send a Construct after Chantrel. See the Contstruct Take an Artisan Test. See the Construct fall back to Earth with no Space Suit. Fall Construct, Fall! See Chantrel E-Mail a picture of herself giving the Finger to Chantrel's Horror. See Chantrel's Horror go into space after Chantrel. See Chantrel's Horror Choke and Die in a Force 10 Mana Warp. Chock and Die Chantrel's Horror, Choke and Die. |
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Jan 18 2004, 12:35 AM
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#508
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
Very poetic, Spider. Very nicely done, indeed.
Go Humans! And all you candy-assed naysayers in the Forum, you can all kiss your Horror-marked asses goodbye cos I'm checking y'all into Smackdown Hotel! (What can i say? I like WWE :rollin:) |
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Jan 18 2004, 12:36 AM
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#509
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,047 Joined: 12-November 03 From: Perilously close to the Sioux Nation. Member No.: 5,818 |
Oh, for Pete's sake, toturi.
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Jan 18 2004, 07:38 AM
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#510
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,751 Joined: 8-August 03 From: Neighbor of the Beast Member No.: 5,375 |
Go Lord Ver'an!
Go Moonstone Spider! Go toturi! Go Humans!! Screw you, Vergem...Verogem...Vergitmite...Whatever! Screw you, Lord of the Horrors!! This post has been edited by kevyn668: Jan 18 2004, 07:50 AM |
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Jan 18 2004, 03:02 PM
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#511
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
Just use the short form "Vergy" |
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Jan 18 2004, 03:22 PM
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#512
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
Vegetable? Venison? Verygnomish? |
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Jan 19 2004, 12:17 AM
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#513
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
Remember that Chantrel's Horror doesn't care about Chantrel at all...because it's off eviscerating everyone Chantrel's ever met. The Horrors sourcebook says it can easily hit a blood relative, spouse, or whatever. With a better success on the test, it can dice business associates, casual friends, or even people who've handled an item that the target has handled. And the flavor text says it can extend from there to friends of friends... When Chantrel left the town she'd settled in, it seems that the Horror stayed behind for awhile wiping out that village and others. Quoting from Horrors p29 -
"My friendship with Cavis had given the Horror a gateway to others in the village and to their kin in other towns. Sometimes it killed one man, other times it slaughtered entire encampments. Even today, many call that region of the Thunder Mountains the Butcher Hills." Chantrel can go to space all she likes, and sit there thinking about what's happening to everyone she's ever met. :) I don't know whether a Mark makes the Marking horror vulnerable to ritual sorcery. My Earthdawn-fu isn't that strong outside of the very basic history, and the Horrors book. Maybe someone else knows. edit - added the quote. |
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Jan 19 2004, 01:12 AM
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#514
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
We have weapons that can outpower them, yes, but we still have almost no defense against them. We could eventually take down the thing by hosing down the place with railgun slugs or HMG fire, but every possibility besides the railguns and some naval guns involves distinct risk. And Req has my back on Chantrel's Horror. The Horror can feed on them just fine; to prevent that you'd have to send everyone neo-Chantrel has ever cared about up as well, in which case Chantrel's Horror goes and finds another victim. ~J |
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Jan 19 2004, 01:17 AM
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#515
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
As opposed to not having those weapons like the poor useless sod who had to hide in their little hidey kaers?
Take the initiative, go on offensive. |
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Jan 19 2004, 02:17 AM
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#516
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Still waiting for an explaination of an adequate way to do so.
~J |
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Jan 19 2004, 02:36 AM
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#517
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
Go metaplanar, invade Horror metaplane, drop metaplanar equivalent of thermonuclear weapon.
Since there are no Canon SR Horror, there need not be a Canon metaplanar nuke at present. |
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Jan 19 2004, 02:39 AM
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#518
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,065 Joined: 16-January 03 From: Fayetteville, NC Member No.: 3,916 |
I am in awe of that logic. The scary part is -- it makes sense. :grinbig: -Siege |
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Jan 19 2004, 02:42 AM
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#519
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Sure there are. They appear in both the adventure Harlequin's Back and the novel House of the Sun. :) |
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Jan 19 2004, 02:43 AM
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#520
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,065 Joined: 16-January 03 From: Fayetteville, NC Member No.: 3,916 |
Well drek, I guess I should've bought the bridge and not the nuke. :grinbig:
-Siege |
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Jan 19 2004, 02:47 AM
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#521
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Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187 |
OK... allow me to rephrase... They aren't invading us at present so we, being peaceful humans, will not need to kick their ass at present. Our present 2063 weapons can take care of those minor Horrors.
And please, H's B is not a Canon SR3 adventure. And House of the Sun is a novel and novels do not need follow the SR3 rules. |
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Jan 19 2004, 03:28 AM
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#522
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Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
If we're going to get pedantic, you never specified SR3. Your statement was that there are no Horrors in SR canon. As Harlequin's back is a published Shadowrun adventure, and since it has not been superceded by any SR3 canon, as far as I knew it was considered canon, especially as far as the timeline is concerned. IIRC, there is even an official (Spanish?) release of Harlequin's Back, updated to SR3 stats (although it might be the original Harlequin instead), which would make it very much SR3 canon if it is true. The novels have always been officially considered canon in Shadowrun, if not for rules then at the minimum for setting and world events. As far as I know, there is only one novel not considered canon, and that wasn't House of the Sun. |
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Jan 19 2004, 04:02 AM
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#523
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Avatar of Mediocrity Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 725 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle, WA (err, UCAS) Member No.: 277 |
Would that be Worlds Without End? Or something else I haven't read?
Are you saying non-SR3 adventures aren't canon? Like, say, Queen Euphoria or the Super Tuesday set? Those things certainly happened... As long as our strategy involves moving to the Horror metaplane and invading...that would be all magicians, right? We haven't talked much about Taint, but he's another named Horror that corrupts any magic used by his targets. Best thing is, he doesn't have to Mark them per se for this to work - targets can be tainted and have their magic serve Taint's ends without actually possessing a Mark that can be discerned by others. And it looks like it doesn't just affect spell magic, but also the talents possessed by other disciplines - basically, adept powers. He's going to be tough to take with magic, but there ain't no other options since he's got no physical form, only astral/metaplanar. And in fully other news, we haven't talked about Ristul either... Ristul is corruption. He's not an entity that can be attacked - in fact it is specifically stated (Horrors, p 64) that Ristul cannot be attacked or destroyed, and will exist until all corruption is purged from the face of the world. I presume this means astral hazing, physiacl pollution, and maybe even corruption as dishonesty and the like; it's not clearly spelled out. He's a sort of a sentient metaplane, and it's hypothesized that three Passions - the ED equivalent of gods - drove themselves mad with corruption trying to keep Ristul from reaching the material plane. They failed, but they're still insane. edit - for clarity. see how considerate Req is. |
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Jan 19 2004, 04:59 AM
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#524
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,066 Joined: 5-February 03 Member No.: 4,017 |
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl: |
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Jan 19 2004, 05:34 AM
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#525
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,047 Joined: 12-November 03 From: Perilously close to the Sioux Nation. Member No.: 5,818 |
Why does the name "Herald of Verjigorm" seem appropriate for this thread?
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