What don't wound modifiers modify? Options

[Herald of Verjig...]

So, if you say that pre-existing wound modifiers apply to drain resistance, do they also apply to resisting combat spells (especially mana versions)? Your description implies that the effect is similar.

[mighty]

I think that the shock and pain change how the character can deal with drain as well as more damage. I also see damage resistance as how well the the character can "roll with the punch' explain small people with high body scores, and of course the combat pool. so should likely apply wound mods in this case. I cannot wait for a official answer.

[BitBasher]

[Corporate Raider]

[Fortune]

I'm not sure I understand the point of adding Wound Modifiers to Drain resistance. As was said above, resisting Drain is exacly the same as resisting damage. Do you demand that the Street Sam add his wound modifiers to his Body resistance roll every time he tries to resist damage from getting shot?

Wound Modifiers apply when the wounded person tries to accomplish something, ie. shoot, pick a lock, drive a car, cast a spell, etc. The act of doing is what is made more difficult by being wounded, not the act of resisting.

[Wutasumi]

You're kinda dodging the question guys. The real question is wether a gunshot and drain are the same thing game-wise, and realisticly.

[toturi]

As far as the game goes, I think the designers were thinking that they were almost the same hence the qualifier about the Specific mods thing.

But realistically, I've never been shot or cast a spell. So i wouldn't know.

[Wutasumi]

Fine, Peduso-Realisticly...

[Fortune]

[Arethusa]

Edited for my protection.

[Wutasumi]

We know CANNON that's how it is, but I'd like to know pedsuo-realisticly.

And jeeze people, quit with the ask a spellcaster line, it's annoying and stupid. At least TRY.

[Fortune]

Try what? To compare the real damage of a bullet with the fictional draining that might or might not happen to some fictitious spellcaster?

I gave my opinion. It should be no harder for a wounded spellslinger to shrug off Drain than it would be for a wounded gunbunny to shrug of a hit from a baseball bat. Ther is no concentration involved in resisting the Stun damage, as it's purely a function of the body's own ability to absorb punishment.

[Arethusa]

[Kremlin KOA]

[Arethusa]

Actually, a broken leg does make you more vulnerable to being punched. Stand still while I take this cricket bat to your knee and then we can see how well you handle a stand up fight with me.

[Kremlin KOA]

wouldn't that be represented by a +tn on my unarmed skill?

I was saying that a broken leg didn't make being punched in the gut more painful

And I've played rugby with a broken leg

[Arethusa]

It would be. No one's really arguing that damage resistance tests should be modified by wound modifiers. Even if it pretty much is a fact that I'm less likely to take a punch well if I've already been shot, which is basically af act, that damage resistance tests are abstract and it doesn't entirely make sense to modify them. What is being argued is that drain is not directly comparable to physical damage, and that one's ability to not get tired and keep going is going to be impacted by the current state of one's body.

[Kremlin KOA]

Arethusa. the punch after bullet thing is represented by wounds stacking and filling more boxes, and in my experience "drain" is akin to the 'damage' one takes from pushing onesself too hard athletically YMMV

[DrJest]

Damage Resistance and Drain resistance are exactly the same thing, just using different stats.

"Drain is like an attack against the caster by the mana channelled into the spell" (SR3 p. 180).

Both are attempting to reduce damage done to you. Neither should have wound modifiers applied. Frankly, mages have it hard enough with the Drain thing without stacking tn modifiers to their Drain tests.

Think about it. Average mage with Will 6 and a spell pool of 6 throws a Moderate Manabolt with a Force of 6. He's resisting 6M Drain. The odds say that he's going to get 2 successes, so he's going to take an average of Light Drain every time he casts his primary combat spell. Not going to be casting a full force spell very often! In practice, I rarely see mages in my games casting spells over Force 4 without a damned good reason; they tend to make up the deficit in power with magic pool (oops, spell pool these days) dice, and many of them carry spell locks or quickened spells with Increase Willpower just to get through the runs without flaking out half-way. Believe me, the last thing a mage needs is harder Drain.

[Ombre]

Actually, one could even argue about applying wound modifiers to Damage resistance test (I know, I know, it's not in the book...): the more trauma your body suffers from, the less it will be able to take...seems quite logical to me...although I've never applied Wound mod to damage resistance tests. As far as Drain resistance is concerned, I've made my point. I know it's not cannon, but it seems far more logical to me...and as I said, drain TN is not such a big deal: tossing mana spells or stun spells is not very hard on the spellcaster compared to the damage he can inflict over and over in the case of unmodified drain resistance tests...

[Austere Emancipa...]

Actually, results from actual combat situations would suggest that if you receive a not-that-serious wound (hole through the lower leg that doesn't shatter a bone or rip open a main artery, a Light wound), you are less likely to then be disabled by a following more serious wound. This is mostly because the lesser trauma already prepares the body to work in bad conditions -- adrenaline levels shoot up, etc. (People shot right at the beginning of a combat situation often drop on the spot, while others who've already been hammered for a while can continue to function with similar wounds, or so it would seem from reading combat reports.)

"Rolling with a hit" and other more conscious ways of trying to limit the damage caused might be hampered by being wounded previously, however. I personally view the Damage Resistance test as simply the build of your body and certain unconscious protection methods employed by it, so having Wound Modifiers affect the DamRest test does not make sense for me.

This post has been edited by Austere Emancipator: Oct 18 2004, 09:21 AM

[Kremlin KOA]

Austere, that would explain so many of my nastier RL fights, thanks.

[Thistledown]

Until a few weeks ago, my group always assumed wound modifers were used on damage resistance tests as well, until somebody who transfered in from another group showed us otherwise. If it's not supposed to act on drain either, hmmm, well I definatly wouldn't have my mages going unconcious so often.