 World Of Darkness |
  |
 Sep 9 2007, 02:34 PM
Post
#1
|
|
|
Shooting Target  Group: Members Posts: 1,955 Joined: 6-December 06 From: Payson, Utah Member No.: 10,237  |
Can anyone tell me about the game "World of Darkness?"
A kid in my group really wants to try it. And is horrible at explaining anything. So Id like to know more. |
 |
 
|
|
Sep 9 2007, 08:51 PM
Post
#2
|
|
|
Immortal Elf Group: Validating Posts: 7,999 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,890 |
The setting and even the rules are decent in theory. It just gets a bad rap from the types of players it typically attracts (emo goth kids and elitist roleplayers). Several of the expansion books are the same way, catering to those types of players, and they usually come out really, really bad as a result.
The World of Darkness itself is just our own world, set a few years in the very near future, where the supernatural wage wars and play politics in the shadow of humanity. Vampires, werewolves, mages, ghosts, faeries... all living amongst humanity, each having their own issues to deal with, and each interacting with the others in completely different ways. One theme that runs through each game is that each "race" is split up into multiple "subraces," each with their own unique abilities, general outlooks, and themes. Like any game, it's worth trying at least once. Thumb through one of the books at a bookstore and see if it sounds interesting. If it does, give it a try and see how you and your group like it. In the end, that's all that matters. |
|
|
|
|
Sep 9 2007, 10:01 PM
Post
#3
|
|||
|
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
nWoD, maybe—I haven't looked at the numbers involved. oWoD can without contradiction be said to be awful rules-wise (it can create situations which produce essentially the same odds of success for everyone no matter how few or many dice they're rolling, among other things). ~J |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 9 2007, 10:56 PM
Post
#4
|
|||
|
Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
SinN , I know you, I know your group. I have my suspiciouns on who the 'kid' is. For your sake and his, just shoot the kid. In the face. For money. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 9 2007, 11:08 PM
Post
#5
|
|||||
|
Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,180 Joined: 22-January 07 From: Rochester, NY Member No.: 10,737 |
Ouch. What did he do to merit such a response? |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
Sep 9 2007, 11:53 PM
Post
#6
|
|
|
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 609 Joined: 13-August 07 Member No.: 12,615 |
Just be warned. Some of the older White Wolf books, especially those with the "Black Dog Game Factory" imprint, can contain material which is quite revolting. I still shudder when I think of "Clanbook: Baali", "Clanbook: Tzimsce", and "Path of Screams".
|
|
|
|
|
Sep 10 2007, 12:32 AM
Post
#7
|
|
|
Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
It's not so much the game it's self. Or the player him self. It's just that ending it all would be a better alternative than putting the two of them together. There's one thing that will instantly make me dislike a new SR player. If they sit down, start working out their new character idea, ,and utter the words "can I be a vampire". I'm not going to say it's wrong, but it's a huge pet peeve of mine.
|
|
|
|
|
Sep 10 2007, 12:49 AM
Post
#8
|
|
|
Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
Bear in mind that in the "new" World of Darkness, there's a core WoD book that allows you to play humans in the setting; if you want to play Vampires, then you grab the Vampire book, etc. I haven't played nWoD, but I like the core book a great deal and think it's quite well put together [and some of the art is really, really nice.]
|
|
|
|
|
Sep 10 2007, 12:51 AM
Post
#9
|
|||
|
Immoral Elf Group: Members Posts: 15,247 Joined: 29-March 02 From: Grimy Pete's Bar & Laundromat Member No.: 2,486 |
Well, I now know what my next character concept for one of your games will be. :D |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 10 2007, 01:29 AM
Post
#10
|
|||
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,640 Joined: 6-June 04 Member No.: 6,383 |
Hmm. Well, I've never read that, but I frequently check www.xanga.com/rpgpundit and there the guy writes about how White Wolf issued in an era where people took up RPGs in order to play at pursuing some kind of artistic of deep intellectual endeavor, and that their shallow snobbery directly lead to the phenomenon of malodorous socially helpless people (such as myself) flocking to RPGs for a sense of self-worth whereas sociable and well adjusted people began to ridicule RPG players and move away from the hobby. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 10 2007, 02:12 PM
Post
#11
|
|
|
Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
The nWoD morality system is completely untenable, but other than that the system isn't bad.
The morality system is untenable because a character who has committed no crime other than stealing a loaf of bread in order to feed starving orphans and rolled badly is morally equivalent to a person who has committed no crime other than flaying a child alive because he wanted to turn the kid's skin into a nifty leather jacket and rolled badly. In fact, with good rolls a tailor who habitually slaughters children for their skins can end up having a higher morality score than the nun who shoplifts to feed orphans has (though this is unlikely). There is also the small fact that characters can gain derangements as morality points are lost, meaning that it is possible to gain a debilitating mental illness because you forgot to pay for a 25 cent pack of chewing gum once. If you make some adjustments to the morality system, there is some good stuff and some bad stuff, as there is with any RPG. The rules generally encourage roleplaying over rollplaying, with specifically codified personality traits that you are rewarded for playing to (a wrathfull person can regain willpower points for getting angry and beating the crap out of someone). This is rather obvious when scanning through the main book, which has more text than is necessary and far fewer tables than would be useful. The combat system appears to be complete, but I can't be sure since I've never actually played it. There is a great deal of similarity between the nWoD dice mechanics and the SR4 dice mechanics. If you know SR4, then the learning curve will not be terribly great, though some of the differences are rather striking. |
|
|
|
|
Sep 10 2007, 02:29 PM
Post
#12
|
|||||
|
Great, I'm a Dragon... Group: Retired Admins Posts: 6,699 Joined: 8-October 03 From: North Germany Member No.: 5,698 |
Aw, the cute old couple again. :D |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
Sep 10 2007, 03:12 PM
Post
#13
|
|||
|
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Man, that's just horrible. Saying something as minor as that is on par with theft? ~J |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 12 2007, 06:39 AM
Post
#14
|
|||
|
Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,955 Joined: 6-December 06 From: Payson, Utah Member No.: 10,237 |
What Fisty is trying to explain is not about me. We're good friends and wen he used to live in utah, He was my GM. After he moved, I started up my own group and became the GM. One member of my group I knew from high school and is obsessed with vampires. ALL of his charactors are either vampires, or some kind of "Dark Outsider." He makes the same fraggin thing and gives a diffrent name every time! Needless to say, it drives me insane. Fistandtantalus3.0 came for a visit, and for old time sake, I decided to run a game for them. Invited the whole group over. Most of them knew Fisty from when he lived here. The player in question had not. That was his first mistake. Long story short, it got to him worse than it got to me. :rotfl: Thanks for all the info guys. Very important. I think Doc is right though. Im gonna try it atleast once. Most likely be the only time I ever do. Ill let you know how it goes. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 12 2007, 07:50 AM
Post
#15
|
|||||
|
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,640 Joined: 6-June 04 Member No.: 6,383 |
VIDEO!!!!!! |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
Sep 13 2007, 05:45 PM
Post
#16
|
|
|
Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,955 Joined: 6-December 06 From: Payson, Utah Member No.: 10,237 |
Oh god, if only Id thought to film some of our sessions. You'd be laughing for hours.
|
|
|
|
|
Sep 13 2007, 06:36 PM
Post
#17
|
|
|
Deus Absconditus Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,742 Joined: 1-September 03 From: Downtown Seattle, UCAS Member No.: 5,566 |
The morality system is like the PA/Notoriety/Street Cred system in SR4 - you're better off playing it by ear and using the little chart as a guideline. In a couple of the books they actually state that if people are abusing the morality system, be sure to slam them down 2-3 points without even a roll.
IMO, some of them work better than others. Wisdom for Mages is a lot better than Humanity for vampires in terms of sensibility, especially after the lead dev went on record and said, "Yeah, all those 'sins' about hurting people with magic only count if you're doing it maliciously. Get mugged, punk a bitch, and you're still all good." |
|
|
|
|
Sep 13 2007, 06:41 PM
Post
#18
|
|||
|
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Which is in itself a pretty good argument against playing the game. ~J |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 13 2007, 06:49 PM
Post
#19
|
|
|
Deus Absconditus Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,742 Joined: 1-September 03 From: Downtown Seattle, UCAS Member No.: 5,566 |
I fail to see the connection between the two. That's like suggesting that since SR4 uses device ratings as a guideline for matrix stats, even though sometimes it doesn't make any sense (Stealth RFID tags having more signal than a bottom-level commlink), the game shouldn't be played under any circumstance.
That said, Morality ratings actually play very little part in Mage, which is by far the best of the nWoD. Which may, I admit, contribute to my liking it. Also, on the subject of RPGPundit: he SAYS a lot of things. He says a lot of things in very good language for convincing people. He also doesn't do a damn thing to support most of his arguments, and takes it as true that everyone agrees with his assumptions. Take the 'whiny WoD players chased gamers away from RPGs.' I've never met a SINGLE person that this is true of. I've heard of people getting scared away by a WoD LARP, but that's because it was a LARP, and they're scary. In fact, I know more people who now game because of WoD than any other game than D&D. (WoD is followed closely by Shadowrun.) |
|
|
|
|
Sep 13 2007, 07:02 PM
Post
#20
|
|||
|
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Not remotely, though SR4 does do this with the magic-user edges. No, the warning sign is the "this is broken, we're not going to fix it, just slap the player with an arbitrary penalty if they actually think about how the rules work". Numbers that don't make sense are a bad sign, but aren't by themselves a sign of developer failure to care about good rules. ~J |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 13 2007, 07:04 PM
Post
#21
|
|
|
Deus Absconditus Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,742 Joined: 1-September 03 From: Downtown Seattle, UCAS Member No.: 5,566 |
To be fair, that's always been a hallmark of WW outside of Exalted. And even INSIDE Exalted a lot of the time. The unfortunate thing is that you're suggesting throwing the baby out with the bathwater, if I may use a cliched turn of phrase. The core rules and settings for the nWoD are quite nice, very interesting, and lend themselves to a lot of possibility. I personally like using the nWoD rules for Delta Green instead of Delta Green.
But you're never gonna catch me saying it's perfect. Jesus, the Armory book alone gave me hives. I don't think they did ANY playtesting on that shit. |
|
|
|
|
Sep 13 2007, 08:27 PM
Post
#22
|
|||
|
Technomancer Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,638 Joined: 2-October 02 From: Champaign, IL Member No.: 3,374 |
I resemble that remark! :D |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 13 2007, 10:02 PM
Post
#23
|
|||
|
Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
Sinn's leaving out the worst part. The player in question was playing a character that wanted to be a vampire, and was looking for someone to make him into one. Well, my wife and I both have vampire hunter characters that have managed to survive through way more than they should have, and Sinn asked us to play those two in particular. We only threatened him direclty once, but apparently, we should have done more. Sinn told me that a few weeks later, the character did indeed become a vampire. So Sinn asked us to send him copies of our character sheets. Still waiting on that end result. I think I'm a bad person for it. But at least I know that Sinn is worst. :) |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 14 2007, 12:44 AM
Post
#24
|
|||
|
Target Group: Members Posts: 42 Joined: 25-July 07 Member No.: 12,367 |
You don't seem to be very familiar with the morality rules. First, a person stealing to feed their family /could/ go down in morality, from 7 to 6, where humanity 7 is the average "good" person, on a 10 point scale. I won't say that's not possible, it is. But if that is their only sin they'll only ever go down to 6. Period. Where as a person who flays children alive and makes them into clothing is on a quick trip to morality 0. You make the system sound much more unreasonable than it actually is. You even forget to mention that the reasons for the sin are factored in and considered in awarding bonus dice or taking away dice for the degeneration roll. |
||
|
|
|
||
|
Sep 14 2007, 01:35 AM
Post
#25
|
|||||
|
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,013 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
You say this, but you just said:
So which is it? Is the system not unreasonable or is it? ~J |
||||
|
|
|
||||
|
|
Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: 14th August 2025 - 08:09 PM |
Topps, Inc has sole ownership of the names, logo, artwork, marks, photographs, sounds, audio, video and/or any proprietary material used in connection with the game Shadowrun. Topps, Inc has granted permission to the Dumpshock Forums to use such names, logos, artwork, marks and/or any proprietary materials for promotional and informational purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not affiliated with the Dumpshock Forums in any official capacity whatsoever.