Things allowed in Missions, I have some questions (BULL) Options

[Zolhex]

Ok so I'm looking at a character I was sent and I have some issues. (I think)

The following is for a character being created:

Now my thought is attributes were (again I think) listed as only allowing 1 at max or 2 at 1 point below max to curb massive attribute builds & to help players stay in the 200 bp max.

Yes I know these are the rules for skills but I thought it was the same for attributes if i'm wrong no problem.

Next thing:

I'm sure it was said that In Debt is no longer allowed for Missions characters please advise on this.

Next:

Money if a character takes no lifestyle and has left over money they have a street lifestyle and can convert 300 nuyen to a +3 to the die roll of 1d6 x 10 nuyen for a max starting cash of 90 nuyen?

I think that covers what i've found so far if I have more questions due to lacking the ability to find an answer in the books i'll be back.

[Wasabi]

characters cannot have more than one attribute at their natural maximum.

Mentioned with pageref so Bull can validate or rule otherwise a bit faster. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

The starting nuyen roll is detailed on p82 SR4a and like all rolls done between missions is subject to the 4:1 buy-hits rule so its a pretty bad deal and in your example gets you no benefit. Yay houserules. Its better to invest in a drop comm, disposable commcode, some light sticks, handcuffs, etc with any leftover Nuyen unless you have a High or Luxury starting Lifestyle.

For the record I'm against the 4:1 buy-hits rule as an arbitrary mechanism and wish it were GM discretion whether to use it or witness dicerolls in con games.

[Chance359]

According to the FAQ in debt is allowed.
SRM03 FAQ

[DWC]

The spoken intent is to add In Debt to the FAQ. Unfortunately, because it was not added before the start of Season 3, it will still be around until at least the start of Season 5.

[Fringe]

The spoken intent is to add In Debt to the FAQ. Unfortunately, because it was not added before the start of Season 3, it will still be around until at least the start of Season 5.

Did I miss something? Why not Season 4? It hasn't started yet.

[Fringe]

The starting nuyen roll is detailed on p82 SR4a and like all rolls done between missions is subject to the 4:1 buy-hits rule so its a pretty bad deal and in your example gets you no benefit. Yay houserules. Its better to invest in a drop comm, disposable commcode, some light sticks, handcuffs, etc with any leftover Nuyen unless you have a High or Luxury starting Lifestyle.

For the record I'm against the 4:1 buy-hits rule as an arbitrary mechanism and wish it were GM discretion whether to use it or witness dicerolls in con games.

I wonder about this, though. The starting nuyen roll is not a normal roll, and so "buying hits" is meaningless (since there are no "hits" to be bought). I could see ruling this to start at the statistical average, but I just have new characters roll it when they sit down to play.

You're right, though, that the bonus to the roll isn't a good buy at lower lifestyles.

[DWC]

Did I miss something? Why not Season 4? It hasn't started yet.

It hasn't started yet, but until the new FAQ arrives, people can still make characters with In Debt for Season 3, and I'd be amazed if the retirement cap is low enough that a character can't be played for more than one season.

[squee_nabob]

Hello, I'm new and I also have a few questions about SR Mission character creation (I hope this is the place to ask, otherwise I appologize).

First off, are the weapon modification rules listed in Arsenal used in Missions?

Secondly, is there any good way to tell what things (gear, builds) are considered acceptable, and what things are considered unacceptable? I don't mean bad player preformance (doing things that hurt the team and make the game less fun), I mean things like Assault Rifles with Chameleon Coating that have only a +2 Concealment Modifier (as much as an off the rack machine pistol).

Third and finally, what sort of sensory channels are normally considered to be acceptable in a tactical network, and which are unacceptable?

EDIT: word choice

This post has been edited by squee_nabob: Aug 31 2010, 04:37 PM

[DWC]

Hello, I'm new and I also have a few questions about SR Mission character creation (I hope this is the place to ask, otherwise I appologize).

First off, are the weapon modification rules listed in Arsenal used in Missions?

Secondly, is there any good way to tell what things (gear, builds) are considered acceptable, and what things are considered unacceptable? I don't mean bad player preformance (doing things that hurt the team and make the game less fun), I mean things like Assault Rifles with Chameleon Coating that have only a +2 Concealment Modifier (as much as an off the rack machine pistol).

Third and finally, what sort of sensory channels are normally considered to be acceptable in a tactical network, and which are unacceptable?

EDIT: word choice

1) Yes. Missions uses the weapon modification rules.

2) Missions (at least the Manhattan season) actively encourages doing things that hurt the team and can make the game less fun for other players. The chameleon coating assault rifles thing is pretty explicitly stated, though I'd imagine a GM is going to ignore the modifier when someone pats you down or waves a MAD sensor at you.

3) I don't think I've ever run into an issue with tactical network channels. Then again, I tend to stick to audio and video modifications, RADAR, ultrasound, and things of that nature. I'd imagine olefactory and touch sensors would probably be the place that a judge would draw the line.

EDIT:
Let me update 2, lest it sound overly negative and possibly deter someone from joining into what's ultimately a really fun campaign. In Manhattan, the fixers are hopelessly terrible at vetting shadowrunners, so almost everyone sells out and ends up discretely working for one or more of the megacorporations. Sometimes the corporate overlords want you to do something random for them, and sometimes they're bribing you to betray your team.

[SaintHax]

I wonder about this, though. The starting nuyen roll is not a normal roll, and so "buying hits" is meaningless (since there are no "hits" to be bought). I could see ruling this to start at the statistical average, but I just have new characters roll it when they sit down to play.

You are right, the 4:1 can't apply to this roll at all. That means you need to roll it in front of the GM, as it's your only option. I personally just jotted down the average roll since no one will question it, it's not a big deal, and it saves table time.

First off, are the weapon modification rules listed in Arsenal used in Missions?

Yes as above: note that you can't "buy" modifications as far as I can tell. You have to buy the mod parts, and have the skill (using the forced 4:1) and kit/workshop/facility requirement to get this at character creation. After character creation, you can find another character to do it for you or do the former yourself.

[Fringe]

It hasn't started yet, but until the new FAQ arrives, people can still make characters with In Debt for Season 3, and I'd be amazed if the retirement cap is low enough that a character can't be played for more than one season.

Good point...current characters likely would be grandfathered in, regardless of what goes into the new FAQ.

And I can see purposefully playing up to just below the cap and then waiting to start the next season's first mission reward to go over the cap. It's a trade-off, though, since you'd be putting off existing missions in favor of waiting for new ones to trickle out. If I had even one character anywhere near a likely cap number, I might consider it more. But since I started playing in Season 3, and haven't played all of those, it shouldn't be an issue for me (as a player).

If I had more time--and friends who played (or, more importantly, GMed) more often--I might like to start a character from Denver and play through.

[Zolhex]

I got a new question I had someone say Pixies are allowed in Missions I was like um no they are not.

The point was made that non-metahuman sapients are allowed.

In the faq it says no to: Drakes, Infected, Shapeshifters, Free Spirits, & AI BUT it says Sapient Critters, Metavarients, & Changelings are allowed as well as the core rule book options.

SO.........

What is considered a Sapient Critter?

NO a Pixie is not a Sapient Critter IT IS listed in the alternative character concepts section under Non-Metahuman Sapients along with Shapeshifters which are not allowed.

IF Pixies are allowed then the following should be also allowed: Centaurs, Naga, Sasquatches, & Shapeshifters.

[Halabis]

1. The list of Sapient critters is Centaurs, Naga, Sasquatches, Pixies, Drakes, & Shifters.

2. Sapient critters are explicitly allowed.

3. Drakes and Shifters are explicitly not allowed.

4. Therefore Centaurs, Naga, Sasquatches, & Pixies, are the only possible sapient critters allowed, and therefore by the FAQ must be allowed.

[UmaroVI]

I got a new question I had someone say Pixies are allowed in Missions I was like um no they are not.

The point was made that non-metahuman sapients are allowed.

In the faq it says no to: Drakes, Infected, Shapeshifters, Free Spirits, & AI BUT it says Sapient Critters, Metavarients, & Changelings are allowed as well as the core rule book options.

SO.........

What is considered a Sapient Critter?

NO a Pixie is not a Sapient Critter IT IS listed in the alternative character concepts section under Non-Metahuman Sapients along with Shapeshifters which are not allowed.

IF Pixies are allowed then the following should be also allowed: Centaurs, Naga, Sasquatches, & Shapeshifters.

Sapient critters are Pixies, Centaurs, Naga, and Sasquatches - see runner's compendium page 84. Shapeshifters are not sapient critters, they are shapeshifters.

Sapient critters and shapeshifters are both "non-metahuman sapients," as are a bunch of other things, but that's not relevant. Non-metahuman sapients as a whole aren't mentioned in the FAQ, only sapient critters (yes), and shapeshifters (no).

[Zolhex]

Ok now to answer other posts.

Wasabi ~ Yes SR4a says one at max I was referring to the earlier prints of 4th and wanted to be sure that it wasn't something over looked in the editing of SR4a

As to the starting nuyen it is not a roll in-between Missions so no it does not use the 4:1 ratio you roll this in front of a CDT Shadowrun Missions GM.

The character I looked at had no lifestyle bought so I went with street which is free per page 86 SR4a.

Per page 88 SR4a starting nuyen it states if you have any nuyen left over from resources you may add +1 to the die roll for every 100 nuyen left over, up to a maximum of 3 times the number of dice rolled.

Street level is 1d6, 1d6 times 3 is 3 so if you have a street lifestyle and have more than 300 nuyen left you loose any nuyen over that it's just gone poof no rolling it over the character i saw had like 24,000 left so the person needs to spend it or loose it.



Chance359 ~ I am aware of the faq as I am a Catalyst Demo Team Member in good standing.

I was asking because it HAD been stated that in debt was going to be added to the banded list.

Yes at this time it is not on said list so yes TECHNICALLY you can take it BUT..... if you know the people running the campaign want it removed I would say people should not use it.

There are issues happening with the company and they are racing to get things done sadly this means some things they want implemented are going to fall through the cracks for a bit.

As players and GM's we should be diligent in keeping up to date.



DWC ~ I am aware as I just said it is Technically allowed but as I also said things are kinda in a mess I guess this is just something that will continue to be lost in the cracks for now.

I would hope by the time season 4 starts we have a new faq to use as I know bull has said he wants to try to make Missions more fun and interesting.



Squee_nabob ~ Question 1 Yes you can mod your weapon and vehicles and on the upside (not really) the optional rule that limits the amount of mods allowed is not a rule that Missions uses so you can over mod your weapons & vehicles all day long have at it.

Question 2 the rule is you can buy anything at character creation in the books that has an avilability of 12 or lower.

Unless you take the quality Restrict Gear (you can take this quality 3 times maximum) then you can have UP TO 3 items that have a max of 20 availability

Question 3 at this time I have never run into any information saying this or that is not allowed vs. tactical networks.



Sainthax ~ At this time it has been my understanding that at character creation you can just buy weapon & vehicle modifications at book price and you have them no need for a roll.



Fringe ~ Yes anything an older character has that was obtained via character creation like qualities are there to stay unless you role-play out the removeal of it with a gm before or after a Mission.

Missions does not allow players to retcon their characters not does it require you to make your character meet new guildlines when they are released.

I am thinking that with a new Missions Coordinator running things he has a few ideas to try to improve the system and the adventures which is also one reason i see the retirement thing going into play so that characters that don't mess with the new rules are gone anyway.



OK so those are my thoughts on questions and answers given so far as well as inquires made hope I covered things well enough.

reminder yes I am a CDT GM but I just use the rules I don't make them and as such I am easily over ruled.

[Zolhex]

SIGH!!

Ok first and formost Shadowrun Runners Companion is the book

Number two: the page is page 63 Non-Metahuman Sapients.

Number three: listed in this section are Centaurs, Naga, Pixies, Sasquatches, & Shapeshifters

Number four: in the discription for shapeshifters its states they are a sapient race and they are considered to be a critter!

NOW for those of you who would like to go to page 84 do me a favor and turn the page for the rules on makeing a shapeshifter character on page 86 where it is again refered to as being a sapient being and a critter.

I seen no rules anywhere that make a shapeshifter any more or less a sapient critter than the other races listed so I put it to Bull to explain why it is that this one sapient critter is not allowed.

[Halabis]

Even if the shifter is a sapient critter, it explicitly dissalowed as a missions race.Thats realy all there is to it.

[Caine Hazen]

We let Bull out of the house to have fun today... so he's not likely to answer for a few more hours. Or maybe until tomorrow. You can consider speculating further until such time (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I would likely hazard that a new FAQ is on Bull's plate as we speak... amongst other things. I'm pretty sure we'll be hearing more on Season 4 here soonish

[UmaroVI]

Yeah, the terminology is poor. Shapeshifters are nonetheless clearly, explicitly, and unambiguously banned, whereas the naga, centaur, pixies, and sasquatch are clearly allowed. Shapeshifters have a blurb about "yeah we didn't really playtest this, you might not want to include it in your game" at the start, so maybe that's why they are banned but sapient critters are OK.

[UmaroVI]

Squee_nabob ~ Question 1 Yes you can mod your weapon and vehicles and on the upside (not really) the optional rule that limits the amount of mods allowed is not a rule that Missions uses so you can over mod your weapons & vehicles all day long have at it.

I think it's the armor mods that have max mod slots as an optional rule. Weapon and vehicle mods have the max mod slots as a default rule and an "At the GM's option, the GM can let you have continue modding stuff." See Arsenal p129.

[Whizbang]

I might have missed it, but are awakened creatures like blackberry cats allowed?

[Zolhex]

@ Halabis & UmaroVI Yes I get that Shapeshifters are not allowed the question was more aimed at Bull to go look at these classes and if he can tell just why that is so.

I like the Idea of a shapshifter as one (Striper) was the focus of her own novel and if memory serves she was in at least 1 if not 2 other novels.

Course as per the rules only humans are allowed to be shifters where as for me I'd make a troll or an elf shifter but alas that requires the dreaded "Optional" rules.



@Caine Hazen Now why oh why would you ever let him out ????? you may regreat haveing done that lol.

[Wasabi]

I might have missed it, but are awakened creatures like blackberry cats allowed?

Runners companion is almost all Optional Rules but Running Wild isnt so you're fine.

[SaintHax]

Sainthax ~ At this time it has been my understanding that at character creation you can just buy weapon & vehicle modifications at book price and you have them no need for a roll.

This is per Arsenal. If you read the rules for weapon modding, it states that the prices in the books are for the mod. It then gives you the rules for applying them. No where does it list costs to pay someone to mod it, or to get a weapon already modded.

[Hida Tsuzua]

I just had some question in case registration for programs stays the same.

1.) Is there any way to begin play with pirated programs? Technically they don't have an availability rating.

2.) Assuming you're willing to pay the nuyen for it, is there a maximum soft or hard cap on downtime?

3.) Is there anything special about the quality Trust Fund in missions games that I need to be aware of?