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#1
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Target ![]() Group: Members Posts: 42 Joined: 4-May 10 From: Helsingborg - Sweden Member No.: 18,547 ![]() |
As the topic says, I am a bit confused here...
Are Catalyst Game Labs releasing two different kind of Shadowrun producs; The Anniversary edition books and the 4th edition ones? I really like the Anniversary books and hope they will release more of them. Can someone bring light to this matter? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Thanks /T |
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#2
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,705 Joined: 5-October 09 From: You are in a clearing Member No.: 17,722 ![]() |
They're updating the SR4 books to reflect the SR4a changes, but they're not writing books based on pre-change rules..
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#3
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,091 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 ![]() |
The Anniversary Ed is an upgraded version of the original 4th Ed rules, not a separate "branch" like AD&D vs D&D.
And AFAIK Anniversary versions of the other core books were considered but ultimately the idea was dropped...probably because we are quite late in the current edition's life cycle. Also, Anniversary Editions would amount to errata, and CGL doesn't do errata (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) |
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#4
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 187 Joined: 3-May 11 Member No.: 29,372 ![]() |
Also, Anniversary Editions would amount to errata, and CGL doesn't do errata (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Then what do I see here? |
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#5
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 ![]() |
The Anniversary Ed is an upgraded version of the original 4th Ed rules, not a separate "branch" like AD&D vs D&D. And AFAIK Anniversary versions of the other core books were considered but ultimately the idea was dropped...probably because we are quite late in the current edition's life cycle. Also, Anniversary Editions would amount to errata, and CGL doesn't do errata (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) I do not like the sound of that. |
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#6
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Neophyte Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,328 Joined: 2-April 07 From: The Center of the Universe Member No.: 11,360 ![]() |
I wouldn't say it is long in the tooth yet---as changing the system to an SR5 at this point would be counter productive. I think we have at least a couple of years before that happens. But only Jason and the Catalyst crew would have real info on that. We're all just speculating here.
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#7
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Immortal Elf ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,358 Joined: 2-December 07 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Member No.: 14,465 ![]() |
I wouldn't say it is long in the tooth yet---as changing the system to an SR5 at this point would be counter productive. I think we have at least a couple of years before that happens. But only Jason and the Catalyst crew would have real info on that. We're all just speculating here. So, who is going to GenCon with duct tape? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) |
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#8
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 595 Joined: 12-May 05 Member No.: 7,392 ![]() |
So, who is going to GenCon with duct tape? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) *raises hand* Me! Oh, wait. I might not be the volunteer you were looking for. Jason h. |
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#9
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Prime Runner Ascendant ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 ![]() |
*raises hand* Me! Oh, wait. I might not be the volunteer you were looking for. Jason h. But, Can you answer the Question? I too think that a New edition is a ways off (Here's to hoping anyways), but it is a topic of concern. Do you have Any news on that front? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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#10
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,989 Joined: 28-July 09 From: Somewhere along the brazilian coast Member No.: 17,437 ![]() |
But, Can you answer the Question? I too think that a New edition is a ways off (Here's to hoping anyways), but it is a topic of concern. Do you have Any news on that front? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Any answer will come in the likes of a Jedi hand waving... This is not the developer you are looking for or something. |
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#11
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Prime Runner Ascendant ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 ![]() |
Any answer will come in the likes of a Jedi hand waving... This is not the developer you are looking for or something. Heh... yeah, I know... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) |
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#12
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Immortal Elf ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,358 Joined: 2-December 07 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Member No.: 14,465 ![]() |
Maybe Bull can stage a Shadowrun Missions LARP where they need to get a Game Studio Worker, and force the info from him?
Hey, if there's karma and (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) involved for Missions characters, a lot of folks might be interested. Be also good publicity as an actual Shadowrun goes down at the CGL booth itself. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) |
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#13
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Prime Runner Ascendant ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 ![]() |
Maybe Bull can stage a Shadowrun Missions LARP where they need to get a Game Studio Worker, and force the info from him? Hey, if there's karma and (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nuyen.gif) involved for Missions characters, a lot of folks might be interested. Be also good publicity as an actual Shadowrun goes down at the CGL booth itself. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif) That is just awesome, Heh... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) |
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#14
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 595 Joined: 12-May 05 Member No.: 7,392 ![]() |
But, Can you answer the Question? I too think that a New edition is a ways off (Here's to hoping anyways), but it is a topic of concern. Do you have Any news on that front? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) There will be a 5th edition at some point, but I have nothing more specific than that, except to say there will not be a 5th edition at GenCon 2011. Jason H. |
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#15
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,091 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 ![]() |
I wouldn't say it is long in the tooth yet---as changing the system to an SR5 at this point would be counter productive. I think we have at least a couple of years before that happens. 4th Ed will be six years old this fall, and it's rare that an edition of an actively developed RPG sees its tenth birthday...so I expect a 5th Ed in one or two years, simply based on "it's always been like that" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) @Dez384: Have you looked at the release dates of the errata docs? The official release date for the Augmentation errata is "maybe Christmas" since a couple of years... |
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#16
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Moving Target ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 187 Joined: 3-May 11 Member No.: 29,372 ![]() |
I was just remarking that there was errata, but it is nice to know that the game doesn't have to be "fixed" on a monthly basis.
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#17
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,379 Joined: 16-April 02 From: the LI shadows Member No.: 2,607 ![]() |
Shadowrun 4th Edition (SR4) & Shadowrun 4th edition/20th Anniversary Edition (SR4a) = the main rules. If you already picked up SR4 before the Anniversary Edition, there's an errata you can download & print that will bring you up to speed (if you don't want to buy the Anniversary Edition book).
If you did pick up SR4a, then you're fine. If you have the books that were already printed after SR4 but before SR4a, there are individual errata for each of those books available on shadowrun4.com. Later printing of said books were adjusted/corrected before being re-printed, brinig them up to SR4a speed. But I feel picking up SR4a, even if you already have the previous edition, is well worth it. And I'm NOT one to buy a re-issue of a book, just for some little additonal bit they put in the latest printing. Never Again. SOTA ain't easy, chummers. |
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#18
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Prime Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 3,803 Joined: 3-February 08 From: Finland Member No.: 15,628 ![]() |
If you already picked up SR4 before the Anniversary Edition, there's an errata you can download & print that will bring you up to speed (if you don't want to buy the Anniversary Edition book). If you did pick up SR4a, then you're fine. Actually there really isn't, there is the changes document, but it doesn't list all of the changes and some of the changes in it are wrong. |
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#19
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Old Man Jones ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,415 Joined: 26-February 02 From: New York Member No.: 1,699 ![]() |
Plus SR4a itself has problems that need errata too.
-k |
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#20
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,801 Joined: 2-September 09 From: Moscow, Russia Member No.: 17,589 ![]() |
Then what do I see here? Dunno, really, just look how old those are; look at the number of glaring errors, inconsistencies and weird rulings in the books both new and old not covered by those. Look at the incomprehensible horror that is the "official FAQ". Dumpshock has regular discussions of rule failures, and most of those could be fixed with an errata - but no real movements on that front, mphm. |
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#21
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,091 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 ![]() |
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#22
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,532 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Calgary, Canada Member No.: 769 ![]() |
4th Ed will be six years old this fall, and it's rare that an edition of an actively developed RPG sees its tenth birthday...so I expect a 5th Ed in one or two years, simply based on "it's always been like that" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) @Dez384: Have you looked at the release dates of the errata docs? The official release date for the Augmentation errata is "maybe Christmas" since a couple of years... Well... The Rigger Black Book hasn't come out yet so we should be OK for a while yet. |
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#23
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,091 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 ![]() |
You got a point there...although who knows what the new SR Optionals line may bring
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#24
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Immortal Elf ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,358 Joined: 2-December 07 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Member No.: 14,465 ![]() |
You mean other than Options? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)
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#25
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,840 Joined: 24-July 02 From: Lubbock, TX Member No.: 3,024 ![]() |
So I just found out that the pdf of SR4A is different from the physical printing.
I think I'm done buying SR stuff until some work on errata is put forth by CGL. |
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#26
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Prime Runner Ascendant ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 17,568 Joined: 26-March 09 From: Aurora, Colorado Member No.: 17,022 ![]() |
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#27
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Old Man Jones ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 4,415 Joined: 26-February 02 From: New York Member No.: 1,699 ![]() |
Depends on which physical printing.
Also, German SR4A has errata incorporated, from what Ze Germans say. -k |
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#28
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,768 Joined: 31-October 08 From: Redmond (Yes, really) Member No.: 16,558 ![]() |
So I just found out that the pdf of SR4A is different from the physical printing. I think I'm done buying SR stuff until some work on errata is put forth by CGL. That seems to be a common sentiment. I know I decided that a while ago, with the exception of mini-releases like the recent Adept pdf. |
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#29
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 1,989 Joined: 28-July 09 From: Somewhere along the brazilian coast Member No.: 17,437 ![]() |
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#30
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,091 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 ![]() |
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#31
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,768 Joined: 31-October 08 From: Redmond (Yes, really) Member No.: 16,558 ![]() |
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#32
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Neophyte Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,336 Joined: 24-February 08 From: Albuquerque, New Mexico Member No.: 15,706 ![]() |
I was just remarking that there was errata, but it is nice to know that the game doesn't have to be "fixed" on a monthly basis. You don't get it. The Augmentation errata was done and incorporated into the latest printing of the books years ago. It was set to be released for download years ago. Now days, they usually just ignore anyone bringing this up. Not to mention a decent chunk of current problems that should have errata but probably never will. Oh yea, and the latest printing of Street Magic does not have any errata, errata that is available for download and included in the second printing. The majority of these problems started with Catalyst's recent financial 'difficulties', and the resulting loss of multiple strong employees. So I just found out that the pdf of SR4A is different from the physical printing. I think I'm done buying SR stuff until some work on errata is put forth by CGL. The SR4A pdf was released before the book was sent to printers. There where a number of problems with it. Some got fixed, some didn't. The changes where incorporated into the hard cover printing, and an updated copy of the pdf was made available to anyone who purchased it. If your pdf & book doesn't match, your pdf is out of date. Regardless, given Catalyst's recent releases, I still think you should just not buy SR products anymore. I have not purchased anything past Running Wild, and I would not suggest anything past that point, except maybe Seattle 2072, to anyone (granted, I haven't read everything sense then, but I have read enough plus reviews on Dumpshock to make me confidant of this). Depends on which physical printing. There is only one physical printing of SR4A that I am aware of; if any later printings exist, they do not have any changes. See above. |
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#33
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,801 Joined: 2-September 09 From: Moscow, Russia Member No.: 17,589 ![]() |
Regardless, given Catalyst's recent releases, I still think you should just not buy SR products anymore. I have not purchased anything past Running Wild, and I would not suggest anything past that point, except maybe Seattle 2072, to anyone (granted, I haven't read everything sense then, but I have read enough plus reviews on Dumpshock to make me confidant of this). Well, Vice and Attitude had their bright points.
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#34
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,768 Joined: 31-October 08 From: Redmond (Yes, really) Member No.: 16,558 ![]() |
I like the way of the adept pdf, but there shouldn't be a limit on number of powers the discount applies to. You shouldn't be punished for being well-rounded, and as written the way of the warrior is stupidly good compared to the others.
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#35
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Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 2,705 Joined: 5-October 09 From: You are in a clearing Member No.: 17,722 ![]() |
Plus SR4a itself has problems that need errata too. -k Pfff. Just buy the latest printing if you want errata. Unless it's Street Magic. Then buy the second-to-most-recent printing, since the most recent removed all the errata changes. I often think I need to improve meine Deutch. |
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#36
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Prime Runner ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 3,803 Joined: 3-February 08 From: Finland Member No.: 15,628 ![]() |
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#37
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,091 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 ![]() |
I often think I need to improve meine Deutch. If you need further incentives, the German version of W! is out...Recharge can only charge devices which fit into one's hand, Slow and the "Holocaust victim's ain't dead enough yet" run got axed...now Pegasus just needs to come forward with PDFs. |
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#38
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Freelance Elf ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 ![]() |
I like the way of the adept pdf, but there shouldn't be a limit on number of powers the discount applies to. You shouldn't be punished for being well-rounded... For what it's worth, I happen to agree with you. Playtesters and higher-ups disagreed, so I put in what discount I could. They're all optional, anyways -- just talk to your GM, present your argument, and see if she/he will let you apply the discount to more stuff. QUOTE ...and as written the way of the warrior is stupidly good compared to the others. They get a bigger discount because their powers cost more. Because their powers cost more, IMHO, they needed the bigger discount. Guys that are getting +1 die to their main schtick for .25 don't need to be cut a break as badly as the guys that are getting +1 die to their main schtick for .5, the way I see it. *shrugs* You're free to disagree (no one's going to come to your house and steal your stuff because you're playing "the wrong way" or anything), and if your GM sides with you, play it however you want to play it. |
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#39
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Great Dragon ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 5,091 Joined: 3-October 09 From: Kohle, Stahl und Bier Member No.: 17,709 ![]() |
You don't get it. The Augmentation errata was done and incorporated into the latest printing of the books years ago. It was set to be released for download years ago. Don't worry, after J Hardy finally admitted that all previously printed errata was handled like CGL's money (it's gone but they're trying to find it), he announced that he's working on new errata with a release date of "maybe next month"...as of September 2010. |
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#40
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Immortal Elf ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 14,358 Joined: 2-December 07 From: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Member No.: 14,465 ![]() |
Maybe he needs to punch people in the neck like he does with the novels. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/nyahnyah.gif)
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#41
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Shooting Target ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,768 Joined: 31-October 08 From: Redmond (Yes, really) Member No.: 16,558 ![]() |
For what it's worth, I happen to agree with you. Playtesters and higher-ups disagreed, so I put in what discount I could. They're all optional, anyways -- just talk to your GM, present your argument, and see if she/he will let you apply the discount to more stuff. They get a bigger discount because their powers cost more. Because their powers cost more, IMHO, they needed the bigger discount. Guys that are getting +1 die to their main schtick for .25 don't need to be cut a break as badly as the guys that are getting +1 die to their main schtick for .5, the way I see it. *shrugs* You're free to disagree (no one's going to come to your house and steal your stuff because you're playing "the wrong way" or anything), and if your GM sides with you, play it however you want to play it. Disclaimer: I understand what you're saying; I just want to make the reasons behind my stance clear to others. My issue is that if you want a whole bunch of smaller powers, even if they're all on the list for your archtype, mechanically it could be significantly better to choose way of the warrior even if you aren't combat focused and just want a little improved reflexes and combat sense to keep you alive when things hit the fan. Removing the limitation on number of discounted powers eliminates this issue without significantly raising power levels. |
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