Dual handing weapons question, I've not been here in a long time, please forgive my derpherp. Options

[Thadeus Bearpaw]

Hi everyone!

We've started playing Shadowrun again after a three year hiatus trying other games. I have not read the rules in ages and discovered a problem with the rules when I tried to read them concerning the following issue. I was hoping you all could shed some light on the correct way to handle the problem. For the record we're using the 4th ed 20th anniversary rules.

My Street Sam is dual wielding pistols, he has the ambidextrous quality, and he firing gun A as the first shot of the pass and gun B as the second shot of the pass. Does this count as a split pool or not and how should I handle the recoil?

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

That is not a Split Pool, since you are trying to fire 2 different guns in 2 different actions.

Recoil is handled across the IP, and across hands. SO, 1st shot causes no Recoil, 2nd Shot Causes 1 Point. If the 2nd pistol has at least 1 RC (or you have a 6 Strength), you are fine, and will suffer no recoil.

Good Luck.

[Thadeus Bearpaw]

Ah okay, so as long as he is not firing simultaneously according to the rule back he suffers no penalty other than bog standard recoil rules?

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Ah okay, so as long as he is not firing simultaneously according to the rule back he suffers no penalty other than bog standard recoil rules?

Correct... Since he has ambidexterity, the penalty for off-hand does not apply. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[UmaroVI]

Right. Actually, you can use this to your advantage by doubling up on recoil compensation; for example, using a pair of SMGs, each of which has Gas-Vent 3, would allow a fully compensated short burst with one followed by a fully compensated short burst with the other, whereas you'd take -2 on the second short burst if you fired both bursts from the same gun.

[Krishach]

If you wanted to dual wield simultaneous shots, since shooting is a simple action and you get 2 simple actions a turn, you could potentially get 4 shots with your two guns.

You'd split your dice pool before bonuses (smartlink/laser sights don't count), and roll for each hand. It's a lower chance of hitting, but you can then dual wield for the next action as well, giving 4 shots for SA. If you have a target you are having trouble hitting, then you stop splitting and take one shot at a time.

This post has been edited by Krishach: Aug 4 2012, 12:39 AM

[Thadeus Bearpaw]

Ah okay, I understand. Thanks everyone.

[Umidori]

Also worth mentioning just in case, weapons weilded in the off-hand suffer a -2 dice pool modifer (unless you have the Ambidexterity Positive Quality or certain Martial Arts Maneuvers), and if you change targets between shots that also applies a separate -2 dice pool modifier to attack the second target. When I first got started I played half a campaign with a novice GM without anyone realizing we were getting more dice than we should have.

~Umi

[Medicineman]

That is not a Split Pool, since you are trying to fire 2 different guns in 2 different actions.

Recoil is handled across the IP, and across hands. SO, 1st shot causes no Recoil, 2nd Shot Causes 1 Point. If the 2nd pistol has at least 1 RC (or you have a 6 Strength), you are fine, and will suffer no recoil.

Good Luck.

Sorry ,but I have to disagree (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
The Recoil is per Weapon
so left Gun first shot = no Recoil
right Gun first shot = no Recoil either
(even if its the second shot for the Char it's still the first shot for this Gun)

with an Akimbo Dance
Medicineman

[Dakka Dakka]

Recoil is handled across the IP, and across hands. SO, 1st shot causes no Recoil, 2nd Shot Causes 1 Point. If the 2nd pistol has at least 1 RC (or you have a 6 Strength), you are fine, and will suffer no recoil.

Not exactly. Recoil accumulates across the IP per weapon. Uncompensated recoil is only tranfered from the weapon if you use two weapons with the same simple action (i.e. dual-wiedling).

Weapons that fire more than one round in an Action Phase suffer from an escalating recoil modifier as the rounds leave the weapon. Semiautomatic weapons that fire a second shot receive a –1 dice pool modifier for the second shot only.
Burst-fire weapons receive a –2 recoil modifier for the first burst fired in that Action Phase and –3 for the second. Long bursts suffer –5 (first burst in phase) or –6 recoil (second). Full auto bursts suffer –9 recoil.

Dang, ninja'd by Medicineman

[Tymeaus Jalynsfe...]

Sorry ,but I have to disagree (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
The Recoil is per Weapon
so left Gun first shot = no Recoil
right Gun first shot = no Recoil either
(even if its the second shot for the Char it's still the first shot for this Gun)

with an Akimbo Dance
Medicineman

Ahhh, okay, Better for me then... My Mistake. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[UmaroVI]

The followup example would be if you have two SMGs firing short bursts with 0 RC each. You fire the first one and are at -2, then you fire the second one and are at -4 (whereas if you fired two bursts from the same one, it would be -2 and -5).

(No contradiction to MM, just adding another example to clarify).