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The Ancient Files: Filler, The Annotated Aztlan Annotations

Ancient History View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 02:12 AM Post #1
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935	Because the Blood Magic page isn't done yet and you need a fix: Uncle Ancient's Annotated Aztlan Annotations

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toturi View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 03:00 AM Post #2
Canon Companion Group: Members Posts: 8,021 Joined: 2-March 03 From: The Morgue, Singapore LTG Member No.: 4,187	gasp pant Oh my god. It was good, in an almost orgasmic kind of way... :D Great going, AH. I enjoyed it.

Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_*

Feb 2 2004, 03:49 AM

Post #3

Guests

QUOTE

Umsondo the Watcher. Very quiet, and given a measure of respect. The only hints to Umsondo's origin is his/her name, which is presumably African; and thus presumably a representative of the Zulu Confedertion and/or Heavenherds of Azania. It is unlikely Umsondo serves/represents Mujaji the Rain Queen, as a later comment on her ellicits an odd response.

Umsondo is s specific skin color of a breed of cattle of the Ngumi tribe. Umsondo is, well, it's this color. The Nguni are a Bantu people, described in a definiton as:

QUOTE

1. A member of a group of peoples of southern and southeast Africa, including the Swazi, Ndebele, Xhosa, and Zulu. 2. Any of the Bantu languages of the Nguni.

Umsondo would almost assuredly be Zulu, and specifically of the heavenherds more likely than almost anything else (esp. someone connected to Mujaji). However, the context of the Watcher could be anything from an Archaeoastronomy historical context of shamanism (Gee, you think he{?} might be magical?), or he could be someone charged with protecting the nation (viz. watching Mujaji), or a global context of watching on the activities of the other immortals.

Buzzed View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 03:50 AM Post #4
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 348 Joined: 20-June 03 Member No.: 4,782	Viewing the page shows me how little I actually know about the sixth world and the events leading up to it. Seattle suddenly looks one hell of alot smaller and insignificant.

Herald of Verjig...

Feb 2 2004, 03:51 AM

Post #5

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QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0)

this color.

Are you implying that Usmundo is a cow shifter (were-cow for the traditionalists)?

Buzzed

Feb 2 2004, 03:57 AM

Post #6

Moving Target

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QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0 @ Feb 1 2004, 11:49 PM)

or a global context of watching on the activities of the other immortals.

Nice work. Perhaps the Watcher is a spy, or an organisation of spies, created as a result of some sort of ancient cold war?

Fortune

Feb 2 2004, 03:58 AM

Post #7

Immoral Elf

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QUOTE (Herald of Verjigorm)

Are you implying that Usmundo is a cow shifter (were-cow for the traditionalists)?

Gives new meaning to the phrase "Were's the beef?"

Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_*

Feb 2 2004, 04:42 AM

Post #8

Guests

No. I'm implying that Umsondo is a reflection of his identity--regionally, and possibly, how should I put this, as a reflection of his nature.

I have been thinking two things, reading this document.

1. I am leaning more towards Juan Atzcapotzalco (hah. No looking.) being a bound spirt, and

2. he was bound by Dunkelzahn to serve as a conduit and actor in the rise of Aztlan's religious-magical practices and the attempt to focus blood magic as a weapon. Dunk's bequest to Juan was his pardon.

I think Dunkelzahn was ultimately responsible for the effective creation of Aztlaner blood magic. It has been said over and over and over again, that dragon's motives are far different than ours. And their perspectices are much longer-term, and focused on the complext interplay of action-reaction-and counterreaction. I think that Dunk believed that crisis precipitates change, and he needed a crisis to move them off their asses. He was "encouraging" them with no real subtlety to deal with the Corruption and the threats that would emerge.

I also think about this in the context of an admitted sense of grief at the demise of faith, and of the fact that he did appear to acknowledge that he saw the world differently in the Sixth World than the Fourth--and was more hollistic and ready to accept his place in the Universe. How curious a 10,000 year-old Great Dragon--greatest of his kind--could lament the loss of faith and the idea that there is some greater purpose than even himself and his ideas.

He provoked a crisis, and he did it by taking a culture that practiced what has been considered for 500 years as a vile practice, but which reflected Old Practices (no doubt related to the Old Practices themselves) and manipulating a state religion and magical practice to effectively force a response.

And I also consider this in the context of the Will. I learned that 65-75% of Americans die without wills. But yet a 10,000 year-old Great Dragon was not only so fascinated with humanity that he created a Anglo-American will, but that he kept it constantly up to date (Which begs the question, who the Hell signs off on a Great Dragon's holographic will to make it official? Daviar didn't seem to be one.), and did it because he had created the Dragonheart and was probably plotting his demise for years--if not decades. A document which itself would have, and did, provoke a Hell of a lot of reactions that did indeed shake the world. I also want to mention that as a practice for my Wills & Trusts class I did what should be unthinkable, and wrote one. It's an interesting feeling to sit there and create something that is, as he stated himself, an instrument of, "encouragement and revenge." Especially for a self-described sentimental creature.

QUOTE

I have been compiling and updating this document off and on for many years, always striving to make my will accurately represent … well, my will. (My understanding is that most humans use their wills as instruments of encouragement and revenge, and it seemed like an excellent idea.) If I appear to have missed the mark, then please view my efforts charitably, and keep in mind that I take the very long view of things. In addition to designating specific recipients for the many things I have accumulated that will serve a better purpose in other hands, I have made bequests that I hope will foster the development of some of my favorite metahuman characteristics.

No doubt Faith is among them, somewhere.

He had been plotting this for a long time. Create the Aztlaner blood rite, uncover the Locus (funny isn't it, that the Locus was in present-day Texas? You don't think that nationalist pride was the only reason why southern Texas was reconquered, and kept?), create the Dragonheart, and power it when the blood magic had reached a precipitous point in the construction of two bridges at roughly the same time, in order to make sure that--in fact--it was a kick in the ass, but not a axe to face.

And that makes Dunkelzahn, by my own definition of the word, about as Evil a being as I can think of.

QUOTE

Just for the record, the New Jesuits are one of those groups of Awakened Catholics. Brightlight might have interest as Leonardo is very interested in the Church, espeically magical groups related to it.

But didn't the Aztlan SB also suggest that the New Jesuits were explicitly NOT Awakened. They know a lot about magic, but none are magically active for their own safety.

QUOTE

:::::[HECATE] What is an "Awakened jaguar"??

:::::[JUNGLE CAT] That would be me.

:::::[THE LAUGHING MAN] <chuckle>

:::::[UMSONDO] And he is hardly alone.

:::::[THE LAUGHING MAN] Ah, our leonine friends. perhaps I should take a closer interest in such matters.

:::::[UMSONDO] Perhaps you should.

This singular reference points to Jungle Cat as a were-jaguar, or other form of shape-shifter. Umsondo's comment may mean that Umsondo is a were-lion, explaining that poster's Azanian interests...but the evidence is too scanty for sureties.

One of the interesting things over the years has been how "Awakened jaguar" has always--or at least more consistently than any other--to be substituted as a Were-jaguar. Whatever happened to all of the references to "our leonine friends"--the Awakened lions in ED that could harm a Horror with their gaze (IIRC)? Might it not be so simple to suggest that Awakened jaguar==American eqv. to these lions?

QUOTE

:::::[LADY OF THE COURT] So is this civil war a Mayan versus Aztec cultural clash? This says most of the people in the Yucatan are of Mayan descent.

:::::[JUNGLE CAT] It is not a cultural war, though I have seen undertones of those feelings at times.

Not incredibly important, I think.

Given the original context of the conflict, I think it is an tragic disregard of the circumstances.

QUOTE

::::[WORDSMYTH] I trust we shall be enlightened regarding this enigmatic exchange. For my part I already see steps must be taken. I have underestimated Aztechnology.

:::::[THE BIG 'D'] You will note that, from the information here, it does not appear that Lofwyr has made that mistake. I am surprised he has not told you more of his plans.

The Jewel of Memory is rather grand, isn't it?

QUOTE

:::::[LADY OF THE COURT] Lofwyr has nuclear weapons?

:::::[THE BIG 'D'] Of course. Wonderful irony, isn't it?

It's interesting how willingly he accepts and exploits the toxics. This also brings up an interesting point. Aztechnology and Aztlan share their home ground in one of the most toxic cities on Earth. Perhaps it is telling that the Giant Evil Conspiracy of Doom was not headquartered in a remote, environmentally-neutral/good locale.

I also like the idea of Hecate being Aina. Even more reason for her to be on the DF Board of Directors, than to reign in her arrogance and keep her under his control.

toturi

Feb 2 2004, 06:40 AM

Post #9

Canon Companion

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QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0)

He provoked a crisis, and he did it by taking a culture that practiced what has been considered for 500 years as a vile practice, but which reflected Old Practices (no doubt related to the Old Practices themselves) and manipulating a state religion and magical practice to effectively force a response.

He had been plotting this for a long time. Create the Aztlaner blood rite, uncover the Locus (funny isn't it, that the Locus was in present-day Texas? You don't think that nationalist pride was the only reason why southern Texas was reconquered, and kept?), create the Dragonheart, and power it when the blood magic had reached a precipitous point in the construction of two bridges at roughly the same time, in order to make sure that--in fact--it was a kick in the ass, but not a axe to face.

And that makes Dunkelzahn, by my own definition of the word, about as Evil a being as I can think of.

You might want to add crazy and suicidal and half a dozen things to your description of D since he sacrificed himself to power the Dragonheart.

Evil guys to my knowledge usually have a pretty good sense of self preservation. Unless they are betting on the afterlife.

last_of_the_grea...

Feb 2 2004, 07:15 AM

Post #10

Running Target

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QUOTE (Buzzed)

QUOTE (Crimsondude 2.0 @ Feb 1 2004, 11:49 PM)

or a global context of watching on the activities of the other immortals.

Nice work. Perhaps the Watcher is a spy, or an organisation of spies, created as a result of some sort of ancient cold war?

Well, yes, the Watchers are a secret global organization that watches and records the activities of immortals but never interfere...

...Because in the end there can be only one!

Digital Heroin View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 07:23 AM Post #11
Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,458 Joined: 22-March 03 From: I am a figment of my own imagination. Member No.: 4,302	This is me wishing my ISP didn't hate geocities...

L.D View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 08:02 AM Post #12
Harlequin Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 331 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 861	:notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:

simonw2000 View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 10:30 AM Post #13
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 402 Joined: 23-April 03 From: London, UK Member No.: 4,491	To the first party to determine what lies behind the door of room 1835 in the Renraku Arcology in Seattle and report their findings to the Draco Foundation, I leave 5 million nuyen. -Dunkie's Will Ancient History, I've just read Arcology Shutdown. It turns out that the Draco Foundation upped the reward to 8 million! You need to keep up with the SOTA more often!

Ancient History

Feb 2 2004, 01:35 PM

Post #14

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Yes, yes. I'll get there.

Good work on Umsondo, though. Must write that down.

QUOTE

But didn't the Aztlan SB also suggest that the New Jesuits were explicitly NOT Awakened. They know a lot about magic, but none are magically active for their own safety.

See Harlequin's pun on the subject.

QUOTE

One of the interesting things over the years has been how "Awakened jaguar" has always--or at least more consistently than any other--to be substituted as a Were-jaguar. Whatever happened to all of the references to "our leonine friends"--the Awakened lions in ED that could harm a Horror with their gaze (IIRC)? Might it not be so simple to suggest that Awakened jaguar==American eqv. to these lions?

Said critters were not sentient back then, but we know Mujaji protects a family of were-lions nowadays. Lofwyr tried to take 'em in the Rite of SUccession.

QUOTE

Given the original context of the conflict, I think it is an tragic disregard of the circumstances.

If ye would elaborate, I'd be more than happy to revise that section.

QUOTE

The Jewel of Memory is rather grand, isn't it?

Aye, but I have no idea why ye mention it in this context.

moosegod View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 04:00 PM Post #15
Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,047 Joined: 12-November 03 From: Perilously close to the Sioux Nation. Member No.: 5,818	The New Jesuit says that the New Jesuits in Aztlan are not Awakened, although they know quite a bit about it. This does not prevent other New Jesuits from being Awakened. It would expose them to "unacceptable risks", whatever that means. Big D is the only good dragon. Well, except for maybe Masaru. I highly doubt he taught anyone blood magic.

Kagetenshi View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 07:00 PM Post #16
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,008 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802	Sirrurg is the only good dragon. ~J

moosegod

Feb 2 2004, 07:17 PM

Post #17

Running Target

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QUOTE (Kagetenshi)

Sirrurg is the only good dragon.

~J

Ummm....

Jason Farlander

Feb 2 2004, 07:45 PM

Post #18

Running Target

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QUOTE (Kagetenshi)

Sirrurg is the only good dragon.

~J

Come on now... you can't make a claim like that and *not* back it up with a huge sermon/rant. I'm disappointed.

Senchae View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 07:55 PM Post #19
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 114 Joined: 24-November 02 Member No.: 3,638	Ok, that's the first time I've read a lot of those. While a lot of comments to Hecate make contextual sense if it were Aina (references that could be conjuring/dealing with a Horror), I would, from what I've read in WWE and such, be surprised if Big D and Laughing Man were to take that tone with Aina, whereas I can totally see them taking the tone they do with Alachia.

Guest_Crimsondude 2.0_*	Feb 2 2004, 07:56 PM Post #20
Guests	Why, exactly, was Dunkelzahn the "good" dragon? Because he claimed to be working towards humanity's best interest? Eh, I'm probably not alone in thinking that is incredibly naive. But the other problem is, he was playing games with them. He seemed to have a remarkable grasp of what was going on, and did everything short of saying, "HEY! DO SOMETHING! STOP THEM!" but he did not. Crisis preciptates change. As for the responses: The NJs can be, fine. It was my understanding from Aztlan that they weren't. At least, not the ones in Aztlan. I wasn't sure of H's comment, frankly. I did not suggest that this Awakened Jaguar was sentient, nor did I suggest that's what Jungle Cat was. I just thought it was interesting that what used to be clever note X years ago when Aztlan was first released has not been mentioned for a while. I specifically do not think that Jungle Cat is said creature. I think he/it/other is a dragon, a free spirit, or something else. Finally, I only mention the Jewel of Memory to suggest that Dunk had more insight into Lofwyr's plans, and was probably working around them... one way or another. I still stand by my assertion about Dunkelzahn. Hell, I am beginning to think that there are in increasing number of allusions between Dunkelzahn and Quetzalcoatl himself.

Kagetenshi View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 07:57 PM Post #21
Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,008 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802	He kills off the IEs involved in the downtime hunting, and so far as we know doesn't concern himself with the doings of the other races. In other words, he minds his own business. ~J

Playing Games View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 08:13 PM Post #22
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 156 Joined: 16-August 03 From: Santa Cruz Member No.: 5,500	Good?Evil?What do you call good?What do you call evil?These ideas are oddly not even wholly formed in the fifth world.Many part parts of the world did not have good or evil until, some europens came over and tought them these ideals. And who is to say that all dragons aren't good?Just that some are less good than others?After all what is is best for the whole is often best for the part.Hestby,may wish to change people by force, but she also wishes to make the world a better place.Then in the end,isn't that the goal of everyone.Take the Humanis,they wish to make the world a better place..They simply wish to do in a way,that many think is wrong.Does that make them evil?NO it makes them different.

Connor View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 08:15 PM Post #23
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 511 Joined: 30-May 03 From: Tulsa, OK Member No.: 4,652	Exactly. Shadowrun isn't about Good vs. Evil, but about the shades of grey.

last_of_the_grea...

Feb 2 2004, 08:17 PM

Post #24

Running Target

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QUOTE (Kagetenshi)

He kills off the IEs involved in the downtime hunting, and so far as we know doesn't concern himself with the doings of the other races. In other words, he minds his own business.

~J

Who does?

last_of_the_grea... last_of_the_great_mikeys View Member Profile	Feb 2 2004, 08:21 PM Post #25
Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,359 Joined: 25-June 02 From: Vancouver, B.C., Canada (go Canucks!) Member No.: 2,904	I always kinda thought of Dunkie as that annoying "older brother" who knows everything. I could see him starting stuff (like Aztlan) as a way of teliing everyone what he wanted to tell them without saying a damn thing and having to face the combined might of lots of immortals who are angry that he gave away their advantage. Also, what better teacher than experience. The invae gave a whole lot of ractical experience in dealing with planar beings. Why not experience in blood magic to show everyone the dangers?

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