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Krule
post Sep 17 2008, 09:05 AM
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Been seeing the talk over the various Metamagic Techniques, and have been fiddling with technomancers over the last few days, so heres a few thoughts regarding Echos. Also, seen a lot of worries and concerns over the following combination: [Biowires/AccellerationX3/Overclocking/AdvancedOverclocking/Multiprocessing/Mesh Reality] but, for the Shadowrunner Technomage, these aren't the best Echos... in fact, I don't think you should be looking at these very soon, into your submersion.. there are far more important ones for you to be picking up. I will be rating each Echo, with the following ratings

AAA+[Awesome, Absolute Must have, ASAP]
AAA [Must Have, get this soon.. one of your first 3]
AA [Must Have.. get this in your first 5 echos]
A+ [Very Good... but depends on Circomstances]
A [Great, all around usefulness]
B [Good, useful, concider this later on]
C [Ok.. take or don't take, up to you]
D [Don't take unless it's nessary for your Character Concept]
F [Useless for all but specific builds]
F- [Useless, avoid this Echo]

Applification - Increase your signal.. has it's ups and downs, but every two levels you raise your resonance, your going to be raising your signal anyway.. automatically.. so it's less useful then the other Echos that increase your Living Persona [Rank: C]

Biowire - Ok, generally, this Echo is sweet, gives you the ability to gain skills cheaply, though I'd wait until around Submersion grade 4 at least, to get maximun effect from it. Also, don't forget, Biowires work like Skillwires, your skills here are Skillsofts learned as Complex forms, and can not be enhanced with Edge. Also, it gives access certain very good Advanced Echos [Rank: AA]

Blur - For the Shadowrunner... this is the second most imporant Echo you can get, IMO. It makes it harder for you to identify, and recongize, and it lets you better hide the fact your a Technomancer.. something that is often very important to Technomancers in the 2070s.. [Rank: AAA]

Coenesthesia - I sense a disturbance in the resonance.. a presense I've not felt in years.. Essentially that's what this one is, lets you better sense the presense of anything in resonance. Take this Echo, and you've just made your GM's job easier, at least, so you might make him/her happy, but mostly, this one is a plot device. However, you havn't done much for yourself.. Oh, and this one is somewhat useful in countering Blur, but doesn't really give you enough to be worth much... take it if you really want it... otherwise, forget it. [Rank: D]

Defragmentation - Not bad, this is a sort of medic program, that works on your persona, useful, though not for everything, concider it later along the road [Rank: B]

E-Sensing - Sweet.. a major upgrade to your perception abilities, this one gives you the Technomancer version of Assessing, if your perception and intuition is high.. take this one early on, it's too useful not too.. if not, pick it up soon anyway. [Rank: A]

Firewall Upgrade - Nice bonus here, but... there are other things to concider first. Still, this one is a fairly good Echo, if you looking to upgrade your defenses.. [Rank: B]

Flexible Touch- AWESOME!! - Why are you still thinking it over, take this one your First Echo!! This one, is IMO, hands down, the first one you should be looking at, I mean, you can alter your Matrix signature, and reduce the time it lasts?! Down to None with enough submersion? For someone looking to hide thier tracks, and move in and out of nodes with greater ease, and avoid attention, this is the ultimate Echo. And that, btw, sounded like every shadowrunner to me [Rank:AAA+]

Immersion - Ok, this one is most useful to Technomancers who are drone focused, otherwise, if you don't make major use of drones, look at other ones first. [Rank: D]

Info Sortilege - this is nice, but there is a problem, Code Sprites can do this all on thier own, if you don't have access to Code Spirits, take Sprite Link - Code Sprite instead, sense you'll have indirect access to this, and other abilities of the Code Sprite too.. in other words.. unless it is nessary to your character concept.. this Echo is useless to you.. and even if it is, you should be looking elsewhere.. like maybe an Echo Bond with a Free Sprite Code Spirit. [Rank: F-]

Living ECM - Hmm.. not bad, however, there are so many other echos, and there are plenty of other ways to develo ECM, so this particular Echo should be low on your list, unless it specifically is nessary for your concept. Or your going to be somewhere where you need this ability, and don't have access to any sort of tech or spells that can do this.[Rank: D]

Macro - Hmm... gives you another action.. not bad, but again, there are plenty of other good options out there, more then this, unless.. you've picked up Mesh Reality, in which case, concider it's rank one higher [Rank: C]

Multiprocessing - Great! The options this gives you, make this one too good not to take very soon, you can pay attention to mutiple nodes, and defend in all of them, plus Observe in Detail becomes a free action.. really, this Echo is too good not to take [Rank: AAA]

Neurofilter - Increase the level of your Biofilter.. this is good, not as good as some of the others, but something you may want to concder after a while, however, with a high Charisma, you don't need to worry about it too much. [Rank: C]

Overclocking - This is the best Echo in the main book, increase your Response, your Matrix Initiative, and number of Matrix IP's.. what's not to like. While some of the Echos in Unwired suprass it, it's still one of the best out there, and one you should be getting early on [Rank: A]

Resonance Link - Unwired, and resonance mesh increased the versitality of this one greatly, seriously concider this if your part of a Guild, as the Advanced Echos avalible make it more and more useful as you add them. Outside of a Guild, it's usefulness is more limited. I've given this one a split ranking, based on that [Rank: D || In Guild Rank: AA]

Sift - very good, turn your data search skill into a nearly prefectly sucessful one, lower thresholds on all such tests, this Echo is one you should be concidering early on, and it becomes more useful the deeper you submerge[Rank: AAA]

Skinlink - Hmm.. not bad, not great, but not bad, if you have more then one Technomancer in your group, this can be even more useful, if both of you develop it. [Rank: B]

Sparky - This one is up to you, I say, it's not bad against Technological devices, but it's uses are limited, compared to other Echos.. depends on your biuld, and concept really... can be invaluable in some situations. [Rank: C]

Spirite Link - This one is Awesome, Access to more sprite types?! What's not to like here? It's a great Echo.. it's not a must have, but otherwise.. it's one of the best Echos out there, and every technomancer should be looking at it after they've picked up a few of the more important Echos [Rank: A]

Swap - Make sustaining threads easier? take two levels of this, and you can sustain a thread without any negatives? While there are other Echos you should be looking it first.. this is a very good echo.. after your more developed, concider it. [Rank: B]

System Upgrade - Another increase your Living Persona Echo.. pick this up if and when you please. [Rank: C]

Widget Crafting - Create Widgets that enchance your ability in the Matrix?! This is a great Echo, and one that you should be picking up very soon.. grab it when you can. [Rank: AA]

Advanced Echos

Accerelation - An Echo that increases your real world Attributes and IP's? This is a very good echo, but concider carefully if you want it, or something else. There are lots of other very good Echos out there [Rank: A]

Advanced Overclocking - Again, another very good echo, increasing your response and your Matrix IP's.. once you pick up Overclocking, this should likly be your next echo, or the one after that.

Enhanced Resonance Link - See Resonance link, if you've a guild, this one can be invaluable, otherwise, its usefulness is limited... though if you've more then one Technomancer in your party... actually, in that case, you should form a guild between you.. Another Split Rank [Rank: C || In Guild Rank: A+]

Mesh Reality - Upgrade your regular initiative with your Matrix Iniative, which is going to be much better, espeically if you've overclocking, and act in both worlds simultaniously.. this is generally, a very good echo. I say, great Echo.. up to you if you take it. [Rank: B]

Mind Over Machine - Good for the Drone focused Techno, otherwise, look at other echos first. [Rank: D]

Resonance Exchange - See Resonance Link, and Enhance Resonance Link, both apply.. for a Guild, and a Mesh, this is invaluable, a must take.. otherwise, its uses are limited. You have to take it Twice for full effect, as well.. so, I give it once gain, a Split Rank [Rank: C || In Guild Rank: A+]

Resonance Trodes - This one, well, its uses depend entirely on your build, it can be very awesome.. and of limited usefulness.. it all depends. [Rank: C]

*****************************

And there you go, disagree, agree, discuss, flame, whatever, I look foward to peoples replies.
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Rasumichin
post Sep 17 2008, 08:31 PM
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QUOTE (Krule @ Sep 17 2008, 10:05 AM) *
Also, seen a lot of worries and concerns over the following combination: [Biowires/AccellerationX3/Overclocking/AdvancedOverclocking/Multiprocessing/Mesh Reality] but, for the Shadowrunner Technomage, these aren't the best Echos...


I totally agree here.
Yes, the effects of Mesh Reality/Multiprocessing are nifty indeed.

But the rest?
Getting a whole bunch of IPs?
That's something a hacker can get much, much easier.

It's nice that TMs don't have to consider loosing resonance for these effects and are theoretically able to be almost as fast as a hacker with fully maxed INI, but blowing 6 echos on that is a steep price, even if you consider that losing resonance is even worse for a TM than losing Magic is for a mage, as RES is also always one of the fading stats.

I wouldn't go down that route, leave the superfast hacking and combat usefulnes to the hackers and concentrate on the TM-only stuff.


I more or less agree on the rest, too.
Exact evaluation would depend on the specific TM build and the overall focus of the campaign, but for default playstile, i think you're mostly correct.

Where i beg to differ strongly :

QUOTE
Widget Crafting - Create Widgets that enchance your ability in the Matrix?! This is a great Echo, and one that you should be picking up very soon.. grab it when you can. [Rank: AA]


When reading up on that, my first thoughts where similar, until i realized the major downside of widgets :
Too much prep time.
While crafting a widget, you could as well register (or re-register) a decent sprite, which can do similar things for you, is more flexible, lasts longer and doesn't require an echo.

I wouldn't bother with that one.
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Krule
post Sep 18 2008, 06:27 AM
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QUOTE (Rasumichin @ Sep 17 2008, 01:31 PM) *
When reading up on that, my first thoughts where similar, until i realized the major downside of widgets :
Too much prep time.
While crafting a widget, you could as well register (or re-register) a decent sprite, which can do similar things for you, is more flexible, lasts longer and doesn't require an echo.

I wouldn't bother with that one.


I think you need to reread the Widget part again, regarding Widget Crafting.. I know what you mean, I went back and forth on this... first thinking it was great, then not so great, then great again... ultimately, I suppose I could downgrade this one to an A..

However, before I do, allow me to point out some things. First, the higher your resonance climbs, the better this one becomes... sense you can build a higher level widget with less fading... also, within a guild with a resonance mesh, and someone else with both Widget Crafting, and Resonance Exchange - Widgets.. it becomes much more valuable, for a group of Technomages. In this case, someone else can do the crafting, and more or less, turn the widget over to you.

Also, some of the things Widgets can do, Sprites can't. For example, RAM can sustain a CF for hours, where a Sprite will only do so for turns, and a Rendering Widget can increase your ability to Asemble Spirits. Also, a Widget adds to your skill, not just to a single Complex form.. a Amp Widget for example, increases all of your Cybercombat tests, for hours.

Example: I need to Hack into Aztechnology Node X.. in about 6 hours... so, I spend the next hour crafting a level 4 cheat Widget... then, I decide things might get a bit rough in there, so I decide to create a level 3 Displacer Widget and a level 3 Amp Widget.. also... this takes me 3 hours.. so I spend the next 3 hours resting, still leaving my Widgets active for another 5 hours. For the examples sake, say I have a 5 in cybercombat and hacking.. but due to my Cheat widget my hacking is 9 right now, and my Amp widget is rasing my Cybercombat to 8.. also, say I have the shield CF at 5.. with my Displacer Widget, that's presently 8 also. And, lets say, for the arguements sake, I have the maximun number of Sprites possible for my Charisma.. to add to other things.
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Posts in this topic
- Krule   Echos   Sep 17 2008, 09:05 AM
- - Nigel   Wow. Definitely bookmarked. Thanks for compiling...   Sep 17 2008, 09:52 AM
- - Muspellsheimr   QUOTE (Krule @ Sep 17 2008, 02:05 AM) App...   Sep 17 2008, 09:55 AM
|- - SleepIncarnate   QUOTE (Muspellsheimr @ Sep 17 2008, 04:55...   Nov 30 2010, 12:25 AM
- - Ryu   Nice post! I disagree somewhat on the evaluati...   Sep 17 2008, 11:09 AM
|- - Mr. Unpronounceable   QUOTE (Ryu @ Sep 17 2008, 12:09 PM) Biowi...   Sep 17 2008, 01:58 PM
|- - Krule   QUOTE (Ryu @ Sep 17 2008, 04:09 AM) Nice ...   Sep 17 2008, 06:15 PM
|- - Saint Sithney   QUOTE (Ryu @ Sep 17 2008, 04:09 AM) Mesh ...   Jun 15 2010, 09:07 AM
|- - Sengir   QUOTE (Ryu @ Sep 17 2008, 11:09 AM) Mesh ...   Jun 15 2010, 12:11 PM
|- - Ryu   Quoting self for ease of reference... QUOTE (Ryu ...   Jun 15 2010, 01:47 PM
|- - Sengir   QUOTE (Ryu @ Jun 15 2010, 01:47 PM) 2008 ...   Jun 15 2010, 02:28 PM
- - Aaron   I think maybe Skinlink could be more useful than y...   Sep 17 2008, 11:56 AM
- - Ryu   You spend the Echo, the money (first Emulation, th...   Sep 17 2008, 03:03 PM
- - Mr. Unpronounceable   Since when do Technomancers spend money on their a...   Sep 17 2008, 04:03 PM
- - Ryu   I would permit threading of existing skill CFs (up...   Sep 17 2008, 05:20 PM
|- - Mr. Unpronounceable   QUOTE (Ryu @ Sep 17 2008, 05:20 PM) I wou...   Sep 17 2008, 05:58 PM
- - Tiger Eyes   Since Threading is technically instantaneous, havi...   Sep 17 2008, 05:28 PM
- - Ryu   My reason for the D is effectivly that I see more ...   Sep 17 2008, 06:23 PM
|- - Krule   QUOTE (Ryu @ Sep 17 2008, 11:23 AM) My re...   Sep 17 2008, 06:44 PM
- - Mr. Unpronounceable   Max options: good, I thought that looked a little ...   Sep 17 2008, 06:38 PM
- - Rasumichin   QUOTE (Krule @ Sep 17 2008, 10:05 AM) Als...   Sep 17 2008, 08:31 PM
|- - Krule   QUOTE (Rasumichin @ Sep 17 2008, 01:31 PM...   Sep 18 2008, 06:27 AM
|- - Sally   QUOTE (Krule @ Sep 18 2008, 12:27 AM) I t...   Jun 14 2010, 09:37 PM
- - Nigel   Widgets seem great to me, at least. RAM alone is ...   Sep 18 2008, 08:31 AM
- - Wasabi   Widgets are great if you have a few hours to whip ...   Sep 18 2008, 11:28 AM
- - Rasumichin   Hm...maybe i should give them another try. I'l...   Sep 18 2008, 04:21 PM
- - Udoshi   I need to chime in real quick here, on a few of yo...   Jun 15 2010, 08:24 AM
|- - Mäx   QUOTE (Udoshi @ Jun 15 2010, 10:24 AM) Ma...   Jun 15 2010, 08:30 AM
- - jakephillips   THanks for the great feed back.   Nov 28 2010, 11:10 PM


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