 A Mage and his Buffs, magic limitations in perspective |
 Sep 9 2006, 06:55 PM
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 984 Joined: 15-June 06 Member No.: 8,717  |
There's been a lot of off-handed comments about how magic characters are the only viable character builds because of how "uber" they are. The Anti-magic thread was supposed to be encouragement for people to build Sammies. The thread does provide plenty of useful tips, hopefully giving people good ideas for playing their Sammy. But the conversation there always seems to degrade into "Mages are uber! That's no fair! They can do everything better than a Sammy, what chance do they have?" So in an effort to put magic builds in perspective I want to compile a list of reasons why the mages isn't as uber as you think he is. He has limitations, and so does the Adept. People tend to ignore these limitations or cite 400 Karma Initiates as examples of the unbalance between the builds. The first and one of the most important limitations is the limit of one's spells known. Not every mage knows every spell, like the quote above points out. Improved Invisibility, Improved Reflexes, Detect Enemies, Combat Senses, Manabolt, Stunbolt, Control Thoughts, Heal, Inc Attributes, Armor, Astral Armor, Levitate, Physical Barrier, Mana Barrier. If you had all those SURE you'd be prepared for almost anything. That doesn't mean you're not going to have to buy all those spells. That's around 50ish Karma. The mages you go up against aren't going to be prepared for every situation. Sustaining modifiers are a severe limitation. Sustaining hits you with culumulative modifiers making it very unlikely that later buffs or combat spells will reach their full potential. You just won't be able to hit al the way up to Force or even enough to get past modest spell resistance. Many of the "uber" spells above are buffs. Sustaining multiple ones on yourself or others just isn't going to work unless you have many different sustaining foci, which costs even more Karma. Assuming the uber mages out there have their best spells sustained with max hits all the time is absurd and definite grounds for addiction. They just can't do that without foci. An Adept's powers don't slap you with mods, but they do force you into very specialized roles if you don't spread out your Power Points. Spreading them out isn't always the greatest idea, and some times just not worth what you're paying. Several levels of a certain power are neccesary for you to get your Karma's worth. Adepts are often counterd by the same means a Sammy can be, so they aren't really anything to worry about. Everyone knows mages suck up Karma. Sure, magic can replicate much of what an implant can accomplish and then some, but it very tough to pay for and maintain. Whenever you catch yourself thinking "But what if the mage had this?! Johnny Samurai can't handle that particular angle! THat's no fair!" remember, you can't cover all the bases, even if you're a mage Pitch in everyone! Rub the inadequacies of the Awakened in their collective faces. Remind them of their limitations and remind the mundane of their freedom from these silly limitations. Sustaining mods? I spit upon them! NOTE: Don't turn this into Sammy vs. Mages. Keep it to "This is why mages aren't so all-powerful." Thank you for input in advance :D EDIT: Took out my comments that feel into the Sammy vs. Mages category. I want to keep myself on topic :D |
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Posts in this topic
Samaels Ghost A Mage and his Buffs Sep 9 2006, 06:55 PM
James McMurray QUOTE A Sammy with the right gear probably can be ... Sep 9 2006, 07:05 PM Samaels Ghost Yeah, more nonsense on my part. I meant to focus o... Sep 9 2006, 07:32 PM ShadowDragon This goes along with the whole karma sink disadvan... Sep 9 2006, 08:28 PM Mistwalker When a mage has buffed himself up, either sustaini... Sep 9 2006, 08:44 PM James McMurray Mages with active spells set off ward alarms and r... Sep 9 2006, 08:57 PM Slithery D Well, he's vulnerable to the three spirit type... Sep 9 2006, 09:00 PM hyzmarca When it comes to sustained spells, one should not ... Sep 9 2006, 09:21 PM James McMurray All very nice, except that those optimal setups an... Sep 9 2006, 10:36 PM Samaels Ghost Can anyone give an example of the catch-all mage t... Sep 9 2006, 11:47 PM Slithery D If it comes to fighting, the optimal general strat... Sep 9 2006, 11:58 PM James McMurray Also Hyz, you did one thing wrong in your Mage vs.... Sep 10 2006, 02:39 AM hyzmarca QUOTE (James McMurray) Also Hyz, you did one thing... Sep 10 2006, 02:54 AM Jaid QUOTE (James McMurray) Also Hyz, you did one thing... Sep 10 2006, 03:06 AM Dissonance Also, I could have sworn that I've seen it sta... Sep 10 2006, 03:15 AM James McMurray From the spell: "The caster seizes control of... Sep 10 2006, 06:05 AM ShadowDragon QUOTE (Dissonance) Also, I could have sworn that I... Sep 10 2006, 06:16 AM hyzmarca QUOTE (James McMurray) From the spell: "The c... Sep 10 2006, 06:31 AM Jaid QUOTE (James McMurray) It doesn't say "co... Sep 10 2006, 06:41 AM James McMurray That's already factored into the drugs, as som... Sep 10 2006, 06:15 PM Mistwalker Actually, I can't see Influence spell allowing... Sep 10 2006, 06:43 PM Slithery D Those are all suboptimal uses of Influence. Its ti... Sep 10 2006, 06:52 PM Mistwalker Oh, I agree with Influence being much better out o... Sep 10 2006, 07:02 PM James McMurray Nobody said to use Influence to have someone shoot... Sep 10 2006, 07:19 PM Mistwalker Sorry James.
You are right, that exact phrase was... Sep 10 2006, 07:27 PM James McMurray The general idea is the same, but Mind Control com... Sep 10 2006, 07:33 PM maeel the worst nightmare u can come across IMO, is a co... Sep 10 2006, 11:19 PM James McMurray Sounds like one of many reasons to follow the rule... Sep 10 2006, 11:25 PM lorechaser Yeah, that's a horrifically broken special qua... Sep 10 2006, 11:41 PM maeel i agree, on the other hand, u dont need the channe... Sep 11 2006, 12:00 AM Cold-Dragon At least they brought back the 'use your force... Sep 11 2006, 12:30 AM Mistwalker The next resource rush?
would it only affect mate... Sep 11 2006, 01:10 AM Cold-Dragon Well if the spirit is on the astral, it's not ... Sep 11 2006, 01:43 AM Samaels Ghost Astral concealment that you can wear like gear or ... Sep 11 2006, 10:46 PM Shrike30 I'm still working on specs for biofiber body a... Sep 12 2006, 12:10 AM Jaid well, dual natured stuff bypasses immunity to norm... Sep 12 2006, 03:49 AM Cold-Dragon I don't think it'd hurt that much, but it ... Sep 12 2006, 04:04 AM Jaid well, to be fair it's probably at best the equ... Sep 12 2006, 04:13 AM Cold-Dragon nix what I said. I was being half silly for some r... Sep 12 2006, 04:20 AM Jaid hmmm... just had another thought...
the idea stil... Sep 12 2006, 04:42 AM Samaels Ghost Wouldn't the Strain and the spirit contest for... Sep 12 2006, 05:40 AM Jaid why would the force of the FAB matter?
lead isn... Sep 13 2006, 12:17 AM Cold-Dragon A spirits body is also essentially one big blob of... Sep 13 2006, 02:26 AM Talia Invierno QUOTE no, actually control thoughts is only any go... Jul 3 2007, 05:48 PM mfb all you would get from a FAB-filled bullet would b... Jul 3 2007, 06:11 PM sunnyside It's alive!
And I missed it the first tim... Jul 3 2007, 07:35 PM Whipstitch Geek the mage isn't terribly useful if the mag... Jul 3 2007, 07:53 PM CyberKender QUOTE (Jaid)
no, actually control thoughts is only... Jul 3 2007, 08:01 PM sunnyside Mental manipulations are crazy powerful. Especia... Jul 3 2007, 08:23 PM streetangelj I can't believe nobody picked up on the Uncle ... Jul 3 2007, 08:53 PM sunnyside Yes if they play it smooth it can be hard to tell ... Jul 3 2007, 09:05 PM Lilt QUOTE (Samaels Ghost)Improved Invisibility, Improv... Jul 4 2007, 12:23 AM Glyph For an uber mage, I tend to go against the grain a... Jul 4 2007, 01:01 AM ShadowDragon8685 It seems to me...
Unless you have a facility that... Jul 4 2007, 01:45 AM Glyph But then the cloud wouldn't have anything to f... Jul 4 2007, 02:14 AM Ravor The problem is that the various vision enhancement... Jul 4 2007, 02:01 PM Jaid QUOTE (Ravor) The problem is that the various visi... Jul 4 2007, 02:29 PM sunnyside While it has its own risks it looks, a mage can ge... Jul 4 2007, 02:47 PM hyzmarca Except that switching on Astral Perception allows ... Jul 4 2007, 02:51 PM Ravor QUOTE (Jaid)i don't think vision enhancement i... Jul 4 2007, 03:01 PM sunnyside To each his own on the cybereyes. There is no ar... Jul 4 2007, 03:25 PM Particle_Beam Then again, everyone who is attacked when not expe... Jul 4 2007, 03:39 PM sunnyside QUOTE (Particle_Beam) Then again, everyone who is ... Jul 4 2007, 03:49 PM Ravor QUOTE (sunnyside)To each his own on the cybereyes.... Jul 4 2007, 07:31 PM Lilt There are also numerous circumstances where a mage... Jul 4 2007, 09:32 PM Ravor Well something to remember is that unless you use ... Jul 4 2007, 11:17 PM Glyph Sorcery as a skill, and the ability to withold par... Jul 4 2007, 11:19 PM Tarantula Why is thermo out? Dwarf and troll mages get it. Jul 5 2007, 02:52 AM Jaid QUOTE (Tarantula) Why is thermo out? Dwarf and tr... Jul 5 2007, 02:59 AM Dancer QUOTE (Jaid) [QUOTE=Tarantula,Jul 4 2007, 09:52 PM... Jul 5 2007, 03:35 AM Lilt QUOTE (Glyph) Sorcery as a skill, and the ability ... Jul 5 2007, 11:00 AM Lilt Reading my notes from a SR4 mage character, I reme... Jul 6 2007, 11:38 AM Tarantula Going through the gear section, it would seem that... Jul 7 2007, 03:09 AM Glyph For soaking Drain, there are a number of ways to g... Jul 7 2007, 04:06 AM Jaid how do these optical low-light goggles work, exact... Jul 7 2007, 07:31 PM sunnyside At a basic level you use two lenses to "shrin... Jul 7 2007, 08:18 PM Jaid QUOTE (sunnyside) Also while a digital CCD will si... Jul 7 2007, 08:44 PM darthmord Umm, wouldn't the visual aids still work for t... Jul 11 2007, 04:30 PM
Jaid yes. go back and read the discussion, and you... Jul 11 2007, 04:31 PM  |
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