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> Bound Spirits - what good are they?, Is Binding worth the investment?
Buster
post Jul 4 2007, 02:56 AM
Post #1


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I'm thinking about leaving out my Binding skill in my next mage character because I'm not seeing a great benefit to bound spirits. Here's my reasoning:

Say the mage has maxed out his Spellcasting, so his Summoning and Binding skills are maxed at only 4 points each.

If a mage has Magic 5, Binding 4, a Power Focus 2, and a Binding Focus 3, that's 14 dice total so he gets an average of 4 hits or can buy 3 hits. A force 5 spirit rolls 10 dice for 3 average hits or can buy 2 hits. Therefore, the mage is only netting 1 or 2 hits. Since the binding materials cost 2500 nuyen per binding, each service is costing the mage a month's living expenses! He could buy a brand new drone for the cost of each binding. And that isn't even counting the 30,000 nuyen and 3 BP he spent on the binding focus and the 50,000 nuyen and 2 BP spent on the power focus. Even if he maxes out his Edge and uses that in the binding roll, he'd only have 2 more services per binding.

Since each service is costing as much as a couple of missiles, you'd expect the spirit to be a devil in combat, right? A force 5 fire spirit has a (7 + 5 dice) vs (defender's dice) chance of hitting and can do 5 hits of fire damage which is resisted by 1/2 impact armor + fire protection. Nice, but not exactly an overwhelming force.

If combat isn't your thing, it can do a Search or Guard you against fire instead. Meh. There are all kinds of spells, devices, and unbound spirits that can do that for free.

I suppose you could use your service for a +5 bonus to one spellcasting roll, but since he just spent a fortune on a binding focus, it would make more sense to get a Spellcasting Focus instead.

If he maxed out his Charisma to say 5, he could keep 5 spirits bound at a time. He could spend one service each per turn over 5 turns and sick 'em all on a target all at once. That would be impressive, but awful expensive at 10,000 nuyen per combat. If the mage had invested heavily in Charisma (along with his heavy investment in Binding skill, Magic, Edge, foci, and binding materials), unleashing a horde of bound spirits is a nice ace in the hole.

Without a high Magic AND a high Edge AND a high Charisma AND a high Binding skill AND a large bank account, it seems like the only use for Binding is to conjure an ally spirit with the Ally Conjuration metamagic power.

I think I must be missing something here. Am I using the wrong spirit or the spirit incorrectly for combat? Is a lower force spirit still effective in combat? Are there better uses for a bound spirit? Is there a way to get more than 4 or 5 services from a bound spirit which lowers the cost per service to a more reasonable level?
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Posts in this topic
- Buster   Bound Spirits - what good are they?   Jul 4 2007, 02:56 AM
- - Talia Invierno   Er -- isn't Binding the only way to get the tr...   Jul 4 2007, 02:58 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE (Talia Invierno @ Jul 3 2007, 09:58 PM)...   Jul 4 2007, 03:06 AM
- - Talia Invierno   Yes, you did say the second part. However, you me...   Jul 4 2007, 03:09 AM
- - Jaid   i suppose it all depends on how available resource...   Jul 4 2007, 03:28 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE (Talia Invierno) Yes, you did say the second...   Jul 4 2007, 03:30 AM
- - Talia Invierno   To cover everything that bound spirits can do, you...   Jul 4 2007, 03:41 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE (Jaid) i suppose it all depends on how avail...   Jul 4 2007, 03:43 AM
- - Dancer   Bound Spirits have a few useful things: 1) 'A...   Jul 4 2007, 03:44 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE (Talia Invierno) You can even loan out a bou...   Jul 4 2007, 03:45 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE (Dancer @ Jul 3 2007, 10:44 PM) 3) Spel...   Jul 4 2007, 03:51 AM
- - Particle_Beam   Yes, going through high-force bound spirits to thr...   Jul 4 2007, 03:52 AM
- - DireRadiant   Using bound spirits is expensive. But can accompli...   Jul 4 2007, 04:50 AM
- - Cain   QUOTE I'm not so sure a bound spirit is easy t...   Jul 4 2007, 06:22 AM
- - toturi   Remember you need Binding for your Ally.   Jul 4 2007, 06:41 AM
- - Wasabi   Several Bound Guidance/Guardian/Plant spirits with...   Jul 4 2007, 07:50 AM
- - Particle_Beam   Way too expensive. If you need to wreck another en...   Jul 4 2007, 02:05 PM
- - Wasabi   Expensive is a relative term. If you make 15k on a...   Jul 4 2007, 04:05 PM
- - Particle_Beam   Well, your 3k-expense-example would either be for ...   Jul 4 2007, 04:26 PM
- - twilite   Just a note from the dice pools from the OP: Only...   Jul 4 2007, 05:16 PM
- - Particle_Beam   Well, spell binding won't make all spirits to ...   Jul 4 2007, 05:30 PM
- - Eleazar   One aspect I haven't seen mentioned that perta...   Jul 4 2007, 05:33 PM
- - Wasabi   QUOTE (Particle_Beam) Well, spell binding won...   Jul 4 2007, 06:45 PM
- - Lilt   Binding is an option, not a necessity. It allows t...   Jul 4 2007, 09:02 PM
- - bibliophile20   QUOTE (Lilt) [*]Consider using karma on the bondin...   Jul 4 2007, 09:05 PM
- - Jaid   i assume he's confused karma pool with edge =P   Jul 4 2007, 09:06 PM
- - Cain   Actually, you can use karma. If you burn a point ...   Jul 4 2007, 09:18 PM
- - Lilt   Eep... Jaid's right. Edited. Not played for a...   Jul 4 2007, 09:55 PM
- - Particle_Beam   Depends. One conjurer who got bad vibes will surel...   Jul 4 2007, 10:22 PM
- - laughingowl   QUOTE (Lilt) I'd expect a bound spirit to mor...   Jul 4 2007, 11:15 PM
- - Wakshaani   And mad props, here, for the Life and Death notice...   Jul 4 2007, 11:16 PM
- - laughingowl   AS a sideline to the whole thing if you are going ...   Jul 4 2007, 11:25 PM
- - Mistwalker   If you really like binding, and get the Invoking M...   Jul 5 2007, 01:13 AM
- - Particle_Beam   That's of course assuming the heavy drain of a...   Jul 5 2007, 01:27 AM
- - Dancer   QUOTE (Mistwalker) Guardian and Task spirits have ...   Jul 5 2007, 02:09 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE Luckily, you have a Spirit of Man on call...   Jul 5 2007, 02:26 AM
- - Dancer   An aside from Binding - is 'cast and sustain t...   Jul 5 2007, 02:39 AM
- - Jaid   2 things (to 2 separate posts): 1) having a spiri...   Jul 5 2007, 03:08 AM
- - Particle_Beam   QUOTE (Buster)For gather raw materials, an unbound...   Jul 5 2007, 03:13 AM
- - Wasabi   QUOTE (Particle_Beam) That's of course assumin...   Jul 5 2007, 03:38 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE (Buster @ Jul 3 2007, 10:43 PM) I'm...   Jul 5 2007, 04:20 AM
- - laughingowl   Any good math majors out there? /em duck ... Lo...   Jul 5 2007, 10:07 AM
- - Buster   Seems fair to me, a metamagic power is definitely ...   Jul 5 2007, 12:20 PM
- - Buster   QUOTE (Particle_Beam @ Jul 4 2007, 10:13 PM) ...   Jul 5 2007, 10:33 PM
- - FrankTrollman   Urgh. I get so mad about that sometimes. Here...   Jul 5 2007, 11:05 PM
- - Particle_Beam   QUOTE (Buster) Wait, Search is a power, not a perc...   Jul 6 2007, 12:46 AM
- - Da9iel   Except that they look different on the astral. And...   Jul 6 2007, 01:25 AM
- - Particle_Beam   They don't look different. They only have a ma...   Jul 6 2007, 02:03 AM
- - laughingowl   QUOTE (FrankTrollman) Urgh. I get so mad about tha...   Jul 6 2007, 10:47 PM
- - FrankTrollman   QUOTE So your intentions were Ally couldn't Ai...   Jul 6 2007, 10:53 PM
- - laughingowl   QUOTE Ally spirits did the same thing that they di...   Jul 6 2007, 11:09 PM
- - FrankTrollman   QUOTE The true same (actually add to magic rating ...   Jul 6 2007, 11:15 PM
- - laughingowl   So how upset would an Ally spirit be if: You give...   Jul 6 2007, 11:26 PM
- - laughingowl   QUOTE (FrankTrollman) QUOTE If just Force extra di...   Jul 6 2007, 11:46 PM
- - FrankTrollman   QUOTE (laughingowl) So how upset would an Ally spi...   Jul 6 2007, 11:47 PM
- - laughingowl   Frank how is it illegal? No using Sustain Spell m...   Jul 7 2007, 12:06 AM
- - laughingowl   Also sticking to 'raw'. Does anything sta...   Jul 7 2007, 12:08 AM
- - laughingowl   Hmm: Aid Study says only a spirit can add to the...   Jul 7 2007, 12:16 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE (Particle_Beam @ Jul 5 2007, 09:03 PM) ...   Jul 7 2007, 02:42 AM
- - bibliophile20   Except look at the Search modifiers table--if you...   Jul 7 2007, 02:59 AM
- - Buster   QUOTE (laughingowl @ Jul 6 2007, 07:16 PM) Hm...   Jul 7 2007, 03:01 AM
- - Big D   Hmmm. Maybe I was just assuming too much, but I t...   Jul 7 2007, 09:42 PM
- - FrankTrollman   The magical service "sustain spell" does...   Jul 7 2007, 10:42 PM
- - Big D   Wow. I guess that's what I get for assuming t...   Jul 8 2007, 12:07 AM
- - Buster   No limit.   Jul 8 2007, 01:48 AM
- - Jaid   there is no official limit. i believe it has been ...   Jul 8 2007, 01:50 AM
- - Narmio   Is there anything anywhere that opposes Launghingo...   Jul 8 2007, 02:20 AM
- - FrankTrollman   QUOTE Is there anything anywhere that opposes Lau...   Jul 8 2007, 02:43 AM
- - odinson   QUOTE (Buster) QUOTE (laughingowl @ Jul 6 200...   Jul 8 2007, 03:50 AM


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