Jul 4 2007, 02:56 AM
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Running Target ![]() ![]() ![]() Group: Members Posts: 1,246 Joined: 8-June 07 Member No.: 11,869 |
I'm thinking about leaving out my Binding skill in my next mage character because I'm not seeing a great benefit to bound spirits. Here's my reasoning:
Say the mage has maxed out his Spellcasting, so his Summoning and Binding skills are maxed at only 4 points each. If a mage has Magic 5, Binding 4, a Power Focus 2, and a Binding Focus 3, that's 14 dice total so he gets an average of 4 hits or can buy 3 hits. A force 5 spirit rolls 10 dice for 3 average hits or can buy 2 hits. Therefore, the mage is only netting 1 or 2 hits. Since the binding materials cost 2500 nuyen per binding, each service is costing the mage a month's living expenses! He could buy a brand new drone for the cost of each binding. And that isn't even counting the 30,000 nuyen and 3 BP he spent on the binding focus and the 50,000 nuyen and 2 BP spent on the power focus. Even if he maxes out his Edge and uses that in the binding roll, he'd only have 2 more services per binding. Since each service is costing as much as a couple of missiles, you'd expect the spirit to be a devil in combat, right? A force 5 fire spirit has a (7 + 5 dice) vs (defender's dice) chance of hitting and can do 5 hits of fire damage which is resisted by 1/2 impact armor + fire protection. Nice, but not exactly an overwhelming force. If combat isn't your thing, it can do a Search or Guard you against fire instead. Meh. There are all kinds of spells, devices, and unbound spirits that can do that for free. I suppose you could use your service for a +5 bonus to one spellcasting roll, but since he just spent a fortune on a binding focus, it would make more sense to get a Spellcasting Focus instead. If he maxed out his Charisma to say 5, he could keep 5 spirits bound at a time. He could spend one service each per turn over 5 turns and sick 'em all on a target all at once. That would be impressive, but awful expensive at 10,000 nuyen per combat. If the mage had invested heavily in Charisma (along with his heavy investment in Binding skill, Magic, Edge, foci, and binding materials), unleashing a horde of bound spirits is a nice ace in the hole. Without a high Magic AND a high Edge AND a high Charisma AND a high Binding skill AND a large bank account, it seems like the only use for Binding is to conjure an ally spirit with the Ally Conjuration metamagic power. I think I must be missing something here. Am I using the wrong spirit or the spirit incorrectly for combat? Is a lower force spirit still effective in combat? Are there better uses for a bound spirit? Is there a way to get more than 4 or 5 services from a bound spirit which lowers the cost per service to a more reasonable level? |
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Buster Bound Spirits - what good are they? Jul 4 2007, 02:56 AM
Talia Invierno Er -- isn't Binding the only way to get the tr... Jul 4 2007, 02:58 AM
Buster QUOTE (Talia Invierno @ Jul 3 2007, 09:58 PM)... Jul 4 2007, 03:06 AM
Talia Invierno Yes, you did say the second part. However, you me... Jul 4 2007, 03:09 AM
Jaid i suppose it all depends on how available resource... Jul 4 2007, 03:28 AM
Buster QUOTE (Talia Invierno) Yes, you did say the second... Jul 4 2007, 03:30 AM
Talia Invierno To cover everything that bound spirits can do, you... Jul 4 2007, 03:41 AM
Buster QUOTE (Jaid) i suppose it all depends on how avail... Jul 4 2007, 03:43 AM
Dancer Bound Spirits have a few useful things:
1) 'A... Jul 4 2007, 03:44 AM
Buster QUOTE (Talia Invierno) You can even loan out a bou... Jul 4 2007, 03:45 AM
Buster QUOTE (Dancer @ Jul 3 2007, 10:44 PM) 3) Spel... Jul 4 2007, 03:51 AM
Particle_Beam Yes, going through high-force bound spirits to thr... Jul 4 2007, 03:52 AM
DireRadiant Using bound spirits is expensive. But can accompli... Jul 4 2007, 04:50 AM
Cain QUOTE I'm not so sure a bound spirit is easy t... Jul 4 2007, 06:22 AM
toturi Remember you need Binding for your Ally. Jul 4 2007, 06:41 AM
Wasabi Several Bound Guidance/Guardian/Plant spirits with... Jul 4 2007, 07:50 AM
Particle_Beam Way too expensive. If you need to wreck another en... Jul 4 2007, 02:05 PM
Wasabi Expensive is a relative term. If you make 15k on a... Jul 4 2007, 04:05 PM
Particle_Beam Well, your 3k-expense-example would either be for ... Jul 4 2007, 04:26 PM
twilite Just a note from the dice pools from the OP:
Only... Jul 4 2007, 05:16 PM
Particle_Beam Well, spell binding won't make all spirits to ... Jul 4 2007, 05:30 PM
Eleazar One aspect I haven't seen mentioned that perta... Jul 4 2007, 05:33 PM
Wasabi QUOTE (Particle_Beam) Well, spell binding won... Jul 4 2007, 06:45 PM
Lilt Binding is an option, not a necessity. It allows t... Jul 4 2007, 09:02 PM
bibliophile20 QUOTE (Lilt) [*]Consider using karma on the bondin... Jul 4 2007, 09:05 PM
Jaid i assume he's confused karma pool with edge =P Jul 4 2007, 09:06 PM
Cain Actually, you can use karma. If you burn a point ... Jul 4 2007, 09:18 PM
Lilt Eep... Jaid's right. Edited.
Not played for a... Jul 4 2007, 09:55 PM
Particle_Beam Depends. One conjurer who got bad vibes will surel... Jul 4 2007, 10:22 PM
laughingowl QUOTE (Lilt)
I'd expect a bound spirit to mor... Jul 4 2007, 11:15 PM
Wakshaani And mad props, here, for the Life and Death notice... Jul 4 2007, 11:16 PM
laughingowl AS a sideline to the whole thing if you are going ... Jul 4 2007, 11:25 PM
Mistwalker If you really like binding, and get the Invoking M... Jul 5 2007, 01:13 AM
Particle_Beam That's of course assuming the heavy drain of a... Jul 5 2007, 01:27 AM
Dancer QUOTE (Mistwalker) Guardian and Task spirits have ... Jul 5 2007, 02:09 AM
Buster QUOTE Luckily, you have a Spirit of Man on call... Jul 5 2007, 02:26 AM
Dancer An aside from Binding - is 'cast and sustain t... Jul 5 2007, 02:39 AM
Jaid 2 things (to 2 separate posts):
1) having a spiri... Jul 5 2007, 03:08 AM
Particle_Beam QUOTE (Buster)For gather raw materials, an unbound... Jul 5 2007, 03:13 AM
Wasabi QUOTE (Particle_Beam) That's of course assumin... Jul 5 2007, 03:38 AM
Buster QUOTE (Buster @ Jul 3 2007, 10:43 PM) I'm... Jul 5 2007, 04:20 AM
laughingowl Any good math majors out there? /em duck ...
Lo... Jul 5 2007, 10:07 AM
Buster Seems fair to me, a metamagic power is definitely ... Jul 5 2007, 12:20 PM
Buster QUOTE (Particle_Beam @ Jul 4 2007, 10:13 PM) ... Jul 5 2007, 10:33 PM
FrankTrollman Urgh. I get so mad about that sometimes. Here... Jul 5 2007, 11:05 PM
Particle_Beam QUOTE (Buster) Wait, Search is a power, not a perc... Jul 6 2007, 12:46 AM
Da9iel Except that they look different on the astral. And... Jul 6 2007, 01:25 AM
Particle_Beam They don't look different. They only have a ma... Jul 6 2007, 02:03 AM
laughingowl QUOTE (FrankTrollman) Urgh. I get so mad about tha... Jul 6 2007, 10:47 PM
FrankTrollman QUOTE So your intentions were Ally couldn't Ai... Jul 6 2007, 10:53 PM
laughingowl QUOTE Ally spirits did the same thing that they di... Jul 6 2007, 11:09 PM
FrankTrollman QUOTE The true same (actually add to magic rating ... Jul 6 2007, 11:15 PM
laughingowl So how upset would an Ally spirit be if:
You give... Jul 6 2007, 11:26 PM
laughingowl QUOTE (FrankTrollman) QUOTE If just Force extra di... Jul 6 2007, 11:46 PM
FrankTrollman QUOTE (laughingowl)
So how upset would an Ally spi... Jul 6 2007, 11:47 PM
laughingowl Frank how is it illegal?
No using Sustain Spell m... Jul 7 2007, 12:06 AM
laughingowl Also sticking to 'raw'.
Does anything sta... Jul 7 2007, 12:08 AM
laughingowl Hmm:
Aid Study says only a spirit can add to the... Jul 7 2007, 12:16 AM
Buster QUOTE (Particle_Beam @ Jul 5 2007, 09:03 PM) ... Jul 7 2007, 02:42 AM
bibliophile20 Except look at the Search modifiers table--if you... Jul 7 2007, 02:59 AM
Buster QUOTE (laughingowl @ Jul 6 2007, 07:16 PM) Hm... Jul 7 2007, 03:01 AM
Big D Hmmm. Maybe I was just assuming too much, but I t... Jul 7 2007, 09:42 PM
FrankTrollman The magical service "sustain spell" does... Jul 7 2007, 10:42 PM
Big D Wow. I guess that's what I get for assuming t... Jul 8 2007, 12:07 AM
Buster No limit. Jul 8 2007, 01:48 AM
Jaid there is no official limit. i believe it has been ... Jul 8 2007, 01:50 AM
Narmio Is there anything anywhere that opposes Launghingo... Jul 8 2007, 02:20 AM
FrankTrollman QUOTE Is there anything anywhere that opposes Lau... Jul 8 2007, 02:43 AM
odinson QUOTE (Buster) QUOTE (laughingowl @ Jul 6 200... Jul 8 2007, 03:50 AM![]() ![]() |
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