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> Essense Loss and Magic Increase, Where has the magic gone?
Nightwalker450
post Jan 14 2008, 04:05 PM
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Ok last session my group had an in character discussion, that then had to go out of character to speak mechanics.

The in character discussion, our cyber face trying to explain to a (technologically inept) adept that he could increase his peformance by adding cyberware, if he went sparingly and selective the boosts out of the cyberware could offset his loss of magic prowess.

The mechanics, when do you increase your magic? Before implant, after the implant, or it doesn't matter. The player that is the face is of the opinion that since your magic drops, from 5 to 4, the cost to raise your attribute is 15 Karma (New attribute value x 3). This is the base reading from the book. But I feel that since cyberware inhibits your magic you would still have to pay for it compensating for the essense loss. Since in creation this must be done, it only makes sense for it to be done during play as well. Unfortunately there is no place in the book that goes into this.

Here's where I see the problem with just allowing the attribute x 3. Here are 3 characters that are exactly alike, only difference is their timelines. The cyber spirit slayer, has 1 adept power of astral sight, 5 essense worth of cyberware installed, and carries a weapon foci.. All of these end with Magic of 1, and Essense of 1

1-Ready at creation (65 BP)
2-Basic Adept (Mag 1, 0 BP), who increased his Magic over time to 6 (60 Karma), then decided to go chrome and replace everything with cyber except for the 1 point. (0 BP, 60 Karma)
3-The Muchkin... Basic Adept (Mag 1, 0 BP) In Game Increases his magic by 1 (6 Karma), then installs another Essense of Cyber (Magic +1, Essense -1) Rinse and Repeat this until he is the same as the others
(0 BP, 30 Karma)

So there's the breakdown should the Muchkin be able to do this using half the karma as the other person. Creation doesn't differentiate from when you got the gear so why should in game?
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Posts in this topic
- Nightwalker450   Essense Loss and Magic Increase   Jan 14 2008, 04:05 PM
- - Kyoto Kid   ...the way I understand it, if the character loses...   Jan 14 2008, 04:36 PM
- - Dashifen   @Nightwalker: You have one problem with your examp...   Jan 14 2008, 04:45 PM
- - Ryu   You can save a few points of karma if you go with ...   Jan 14 2008, 04:52 PM
- - Exodus   Yes Actually, I'm planning on making an adept ...   Jan 14 2008, 06:44 PM
- - Nightwalker450   Adept Power Astral Sight, not Astral Sight Positiv...   Jan 14 2008, 07:55 PM
- - Ryu   What is the problem with different costs for diffe...   Jan 14 2008, 08:21 PM
- - DireRadiant   There is a tradeoff. It's not like someone is ...   Jan 14 2008, 08:47 PM
- - Jhaiisiin   It'd take more bookkeeping, but I'd prefer...   Jan 14 2008, 09:28 PM
- - Kyoto Kid   .in previous editions this was the way I went with...   Jan 14 2008, 09:37 PM
- - Ryu   The way I´m comming from, you are not improving y...   Jan 14 2008, 09:41 PM
- - Jhaiisiin   EDITED: Recreating this post due to me being able...   Jan 14 2008, 09:50 PM
- - Ryu   Ah ok, that is valid. Deviations from RAW are par ...   Jan 14 2008, 10:05 PM
- - Jhaiisiin   Don't have my books with me, atm due to being ...   Jan 14 2008, 10:12 PM
- - FrankTrollman   QUOTE What is the problem with different costs for...   Jan 14 2008, 10:21 PM
- - Riley37   I'd write MAG stat in a format similar to aume...   Jan 15 2008, 02:09 AM
- - Ravor   Do you also do the same for Edge?   Jan 15 2008, 02:35 AM
- - Riley37   Cogent point - if you burn Edge for Hand of God, w...   Jan 15 2008, 03:24 AM
- - Ravor   My perhaps mistaken understanding is that the Devs...   Jan 15 2008, 03:28 AM
- - Nightwalker450   Justifications- For various things As to metatype...   Jan 15 2008, 05:37 PM
- - Jhaiisiin   In the case of a permanent burn of Edge, sure, I...   Jan 15 2008, 06:05 PM
- - Moon-Hawk   QUOTE (Nightwalker450) And for metatypes with bonu...   Jan 15 2008, 06:14 PM
- - Jhaiisiin   Hmm... Yeah, attribute improvements like that woul...   Jan 15 2008, 07:54 PM
- - Moon-Hawk   QUOTE (Jhaiisiin) Of course, all this leads to a s...   Jan 15 2008, 08:05 PM
- - Karaden   I'll present you with a bit of research I came...   Jan 15 2008, 11:57 PM
- - Karaden   QUOTE (Nightwalker450) Can only ask so much from t...   Jan 16 2008, 12:01 AM
- - Fortune   QUOTE (Karaden @ Jan 16 2008, 10:01 AM) The r...   Jan 16 2008, 12:24 AM
- - Karaden   Odd, could have sworn I read that, and I know I...   Jan 16 2008, 12:42 AM
- - Cthulhudreams   I think the 'rules as written' support the...   Jan 16 2008, 03:38 AM
- - Jaid   QUOTE (Cthulhudreams) I think the 'rules as wr...   Jan 16 2008, 04:17 AM
- - Ravor   In Fourth Edition "Hand of God" is somet...   Jan 16 2008, 06:03 AM
- - Ryu   QUOTE (Cthulhudreams) I think the 'rules as wr...   Jan 16 2008, 10:32 AM
- - Cthulhudreams   I'm playing in a game using frank's rules ...   Jan 16 2008, 10:36 AM
- - Ryu   Oh, the rules are quite clear. Implants lower esse...   Jan 16 2008, 11:23 AM
- - Stormdrake   Well all I can say is my group seems to be sufferi...   Jan 16 2008, 09:23 PM
- - Fortune   QUOTE (Stormdrake) Are we way off here or am I mis...   Jan 16 2008, 09:28 PM
- - Stormdrake   Ok, so I am not nuts just behind the times. So 4t...   Jan 16 2008, 09:44 PM
- - Fortune   QUOTE (Stormdrake) So 4th edition lowers your max....   Jan 16 2008, 10:00 PM
- - FrankTrollman   QUOTE I´d personally walk down the other road (on...   Jan 16 2008, 10:08 PM


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