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> Is War! Really that Bad?, Fatum: I moved it here. Let's continue.
longbowrocks
post May 28 2011, 04:15 AM
Post #1


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I've noticed before that War! gets a lot of guff, but only recently took an interest in the perception of it. I chose the wrong thread to start that discussion in, so I'm picking it up here.

QUOTE (longbowrocks @ May 26 2011, 08:57 PM) *
I really don't understand all the hate war gets. Without war, street sammies would be able to one-shot anything the GM could throw at them (they still can, but now it's harder and only has a 50% success rate in the more extreme cases).
People are going to powergame one way or another. At least now you can't get any item listed in any book you want (restricted gear) at chargen.


I was then asked for references to my claims.

Here we go:
For tougher opposition, I was talking about the meanest vehicle in the game: the Aztechnology Cuanmitztli main battle tank, which is followed by many more of the toughest vehicles in the game (Strictly speaking, there's one main battle tank in MilSpecTech that gets second place for the title of "meanest").
There is also the Aesir weapons satellite. Normal players can't afford these things, but a GM can use them. Some may say these weapons are overkill, and in most games they'd be right, but if everyone's powergaming, these may be necessary since there are builds that can kill that tank in 1 IP (or even one hit) from chargen.

As for "At least now you can't get any item listed in any book you want (restricted gear) at chargen", most of the stuff in War! is over 20 availability. Now I have something to do with my cash other than hoard it for delta grade synaptic boosters.
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Posts in this topic
- longbowrocks   Is War! Really that Bad?   May 28 2011, 04:15 AM
- - Yerameyahu   I'm pretty sure no one's complaining about...   May 28 2011, 04:32 AM
- - Socinus   When used properly, most of the stuff in War! ...   May 28 2011, 04:41 AM
- - CanRay   I think the major issue was that it was promoted a...   May 28 2011, 04:50 AM
- - Medicineman   QUOTE Is War! Really that Bad?, Fatum: I moved...   May 28 2011, 04:55 AM
- - Daishi   There are some components of War! that are usa...   May 28 2011, 05:30 AM
- - Faelan   Generally speaking a bunch of the crunch is unnece...   May 28 2011, 06:59 AM
|- - Socinus   QUOTE (Faelan @ May 28 2011, 06:59 AM) La...   May 28 2011, 09:28 AM
||- - Faelan   QUOTE (Socinus @ May 28 2011, 05:28 AM) T...   May 28 2011, 11:28 AM
||- - Demonseed Elite   QUOTE (Socinus @ May 28 2011, 05:28 AM) T...   May 28 2011, 12:40 PM
||- - Fatum   QUOTE (Socinus @ May 28 2011, 01:28 PM) T...   May 28 2011, 06:47 PM
|- - KarmaInferno   QUOTE (Faelan @ May 28 2011, 01:59 AM) Ge...   May 28 2011, 01:12 PM
|- - Faelan   QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ May 28 2011, 08:12 ...   May 28 2011, 03:03 PM
|- - Mäx   QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ May 28 2011, 04:12 ...   May 29 2011, 10:27 AM
- - Fatum   QUOTE (longbowrocks @ May 28 2011, 08:15 ...   May 28 2011, 09:05 AM
|- - longbowrocks   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 28 2011, 01:05 AM) Als...   May 28 2011, 02:27 PM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (longbowrocks @ May 28 2011, 08:27 ...   May 28 2011, 02:54 PM
|- - longbowrocks   QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ May 28 2011, 06...   May 28 2011, 02:58 PM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (longbowrocks @ May 28 2011, 08:58 ...   May 28 2011, 03:01 PM
- - Yerameyahu   Also, video games have them. What? Don't look...   May 28 2011, 01:19 PM
- - Prime Mover   1. War did not burn my eyes out. 2. War could have...   May 28 2011, 02:27 PM
|- - Method   QUOTE (Prime Mover @ May 28 2011, 09:27 A...   May 28 2011, 07:36 PM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (Method @ May 28 2011, 11:36 PM) I ...   May 28 2011, 08:20 PM
|- - Method   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 28 2011, 02:20 PM) I a...   May 28 2011, 08:48 PM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (Method @ May 29 2011, 12:48 AM) If...   May 28 2011, 09:32 PM
|- - Method   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 28 2011, 04:32 PM) Als...   May 29 2011, 01:08 AM
- - CanRay   "Battle Rifles" are also called "De...   May 28 2011, 03:45 PM
- - KarmaInferno   Well, I think I get what you are saying. "As...   May 28 2011, 03:52 PM
|- - Faelan   QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ May 28 2011, 11:52 ...   May 28 2011, 04:15 PM
- - Yerameyahu   Damage Code and Ranges, too—not that range tends t...   May 28 2011, 03:56 PM
- - Irion   QUOTE And we head back into the area of Shadowrun ...   May 28 2011, 04:06 PM
- - CanRay   "It's not the bullet with your name that ...   May 28 2011, 05:08 PM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (CanRay @ May 28 2011, 10:08 AM) ...   May 28 2011, 05:11 PM
- - Irion   Well, a problem with shadowrun is the way it is bu...   May 28 2011, 09:12 PM
- - James McMurray   I personally don't see the problem with the Sl...   May 28 2011, 09:27 PM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (Irion @ May 29 2011, 01:12 AM) And...   May 28 2011, 09:34 PM
||- - James McMurray   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 28 2011, 04:34 PM) Ah,...   May 28 2011, 09:44 PM
||- - Fatum   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 29 2011, 01:4...   May 28 2011, 09:58 PM
||- - Demonseed Elite   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 28 2011, 04:4...   May 28 2011, 10:18 PM
||- - Fatum   QUOTE (Demonseed Elite @ May 29 2011, 02...   May 28 2011, 10:21 PM
||- - KarmaInferno   QUOTE (Demonseed Elite @ May 28 2011, 05...   May 29 2011, 12:00 AM
|- - Irion   Also very nice is the Technomancer Radar. I guess ...   May 28 2011, 09:51 PM
- - James McMurray   QUOTE (Irion @ May 28 2011, 04:51 PM) Als...   May 28 2011, 10:19 PM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 29 2011, 02:1...   May 28 2011, 10:28 PM
|- - longbowrocks   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 28 2011, 02:1...   May 29 2011, 08:57 AM
- - Irion   QUOTE Better yet I roll over you with a car. Now n...   May 28 2011, 10:30 PM
- - James McMurray   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 28 2011, 05:28 PM) An ...   May 28 2011, 11:48 PM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 29 2011, 03:4...   May 29 2011, 12:09 AM
|- - Nevermind   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 28 2011, 11:4...   May 29 2011, 01:02 AM
- - KarmaInferno   Slow is pretty much an impenetrable bullet shield ...   May 29 2011, 12:16 AM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ May 29 2011, 04:16 ...   May 29 2011, 12:33 AM
|- - KarmaInferno   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 28 2011, 08:33 PM) Ah,...   May 29 2011, 01:36 AM
|- - longbowrocks   QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ May 28 2011, 05:36 ...   May 29 2011, 09:06 AM
- - Stahlseele   Yes, a Tank can squash the mage . . But if you ne...   May 29 2011, 12:53 AM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (Stahlseele @ May 29 2011, 04:53 AM...   May 29 2011, 02:59 PM
|- - James McMurray   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 29 2011, 09:59 AM) The...   May 29 2011, 06:03 PM
- - Yerameyahu   That, and the snarky/angry tone *everywhere* in th...   May 29 2011, 01:43 AM
- - jizo   would you guys rule that it affected lasers, or HE...   May 29 2011, 02:37 AM
|- - Nevermind   QUOTE (jizo @ May 29 2011, 02:37 AM) woul...   May 29 2011, 03:16 AM
- - Yerameyahu   To repeat words from above, 'aren't photon...   May 29 2011, 03:18 AM
- - James McMurray   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 28 2011, 07:09 PM) Tro...   May 29 2011, 04:24 AM
- - James McMurray   Huh, never knew there was a limit to the number of...   May 29 2011, 04:25 AM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 29 2011, 08:2...   May 29 2011, 03:16 PM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 29 2011, 09:16 AM) Goo...   May 29 2011, 04:41 PM
||- - Fatum   QUOTE (Tymeaus Jalynsfein @ May 29 2011, 08...   May 29 2011, 05:52 PM
|- - James McMurray   QUOTE (Fatum @ May 29 2011, 10:16 AM) Unt...   May 29 2011, 05:58 PM
|- - Fatum   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 29 2011, 09:5...   May 29 2011, 06:44 PM
- - James McMurray   QUOTE A levitating mage some meters in the air wit...   May 29 2011, 04:25 AM
|- - KarmaInferno   QUOTE (James McMurray @ May 28 2011, 11:2...   May 29 2011, 05:19 AM
- - Jhaiisiin   One comment from earlier about a lack of playteste...   May 29 2011, 05:54 AM
- - Ryu   Slow works until a mass of (200kg*net hits) is mov...   May 29 2011, 08:59 AM
|- - longbowrocks   QUOTE (Ryu @ May 29 2011, 12:59 AM) Slow ...   May 29 2011, 09:08 AM
- - Irion   @Ryu QUOTE Slow works until a mass of (200kg*net h...   May 29 2011, 10:43 AM
- - Fauxknight   I don't mind the power creep thats in it, most...   May 29 2011, 10:47 AM
- - Stahlseele   Earth is moving. WAY more than force*200 kg. Nowh...   May 29 2011, 12:11 PM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (Stahlseele @ May 29 2011, 06:11 AM...   May 29 2011, 02:31 PM
- - Irion   @Stahlseele QUOTE Nowhere does it say in relation ...   May 29 2011, 12:12 PM
|- - Medicineman   QUOTE (Irion @ May 29 2011, 07:12 AM) @St...   May 29 2011, 12:56 PM
- - Irion   QUOTE Maybe thats the Reason why its omitted in th...   May 29 2011, 01:41 PM
- - Prime Mover   Haven't used anything in War in a game yet. B...   May 29 2011, 02:17 PM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (Prime Mover @ May 29 2011, 08:17 A...   May 29 2011, 02:21 PM
- - Irion   @Tymeaus Jalynsfein QUOTE That is 18,941 J Thats n...   May 29 2011, 03:11 PM
- - Irion   QUOTE Good job converting energy to mass. Could yo...   May 29 2011, 03:23 PM
- - Stahlseele   The Mass Levitate is how the German War! takes...   May 29 2011, 05:40 PM
|- - KarmaInferno   QUOTE (Stahlseele @ May 29 2011, 01:40 PM...   May 29 2011, 06:26 PM
|- - Stahlseele   QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ May 29 2011, 08:26 ...   May 29 2011, 06:30 PM
- - Faelan   A simple smoke grenade, flare combo screws the spe...   May 29 2011, 06:21 PM
|- - KarmaInferno   QUOTE (Faelan @ May 29 2011, 02:21 PM) A ...   May 29 2011, 06:30 PM
|- - Faelan   QUOTE (KarmaInferno @ May 29 2011, 02:30 ...   May 29 2011, 06:36 PM
- - Irion   @James McMurray QUOTE But, you seem like another c...   May 29 2011, 06:25 PM
|- - Mäx   QUOTE (Irion @ May 29 2011, 09:25 PM) @Ja...   May 29 2011, 06:27 PM
|- - Irion   QUOTE (Mäx @ May 29 2011, 07:27 PM) No he...   May 29 2011, 06:36 PM
|- - Mäx   QUOTE (Irion @ May 29 2011, 09:36 PM) Oh,...   May 29 2011, 06:40 PM
- - Yerameyahu   Obscures the mage's vision? Are you kidding?   May 29 2011, 06:32 PM
|- - Faelan   QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ May 29 2011, 02:32 PM...   May 29 2011, 06:50 PM
- - Yerameyahu   QUOTE Now I do realize many mages will have optics...   May 29 2011, 06:51 PM
|- - longbowrocks   QUOTE (Yerameyahu @ May 29 2011, 11:51 AM...   May 29 2011, 06:56 PM
- - Irion   @Mäx Players tend to not give in any second earlie...   May 29 2011, 06:59 PM
- - Faelan   Smoke would still obscure on the Astral since it i...   May 29 2011, 07:00 PM
- - Yerameyahu   Smoke does not. That's why there's FAB.   May 29 2011, 07:02 PM
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