Dec 5 2004, 11:28 AM
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Target ![]() Group: Members Posts: 77 Joined: 5-December 04 Member No.: 6,869 |
Something that's been bugging me about Shadowrun is Elementals for Mages. To me they seem prohibitively expensive. If you try to conjure a force six spirit with six levels in Conjuring. You'll roll about one service from it, and it'll cost you a cool $6,000 nuyen. You can use one service from it and then it's gone forever.
Basically a $6K grenade. Even if you lower it to Force four it's still alot less powerful and you'll only get an extra one or two services out of it. So what's the big deal with them? Why would you want to spend the time and energy trying to summon up these cash guzzlers? One theory I have is that with the Aid Sorcery service, after the Spirit is reduced to 0 and vanishes, you can recall the spirit with an exclusive complex action and have it go back to Aiding Sorcery without expending another service. This would make it much much more useful. I could see summoning up some force two and three elementals to get those few dice out of them for a whole run (and not just a single spell), and having different types of elementals bound for different spells. Is that how it works, or does it take a whole new service after it gets reduced to 0 and gets Recalled to get your Elemental Aiding Sorcery again? Is there something else I'm missing? Something I'm not getting? Please let me know. Convince me that Elementals are a good investment for a SR Team and not a waste of nuyen. |
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Walknuki Elementals Dec 5 2004, 11:28 AM
Fortune Using Enchanting to create your own Conjuring Mate... Dec 5 2004, 12:23 PM
Seizure Permanent circles are a big help too. They cost a... Dec 5 2004, 02:52 PM
toturi Wait till you initiate... Great Form Elementals on... Dec 5 2004, 03:05 PM
Synner Enchanting and using permanent Hermetic Circles ar... Dec 5 2004, 03:10 PM
Crusher Bob The way I always looked at it was that thy were ch... Dec 5 2004, 03:26 PM
Snow_Fox I prefer shamanistic characters but the elements a... Dec 5 2004, 03:56 PM
Cray74 Can't you attempt to get more services out of ... Dec 5 2004, 04:30 PM
Doctor Funkenstein No, you need more material components for the addi... Dec 5 2004, 04:37 PM
Fortune D'oh ... I knew that too! Dec 5 2004, 05:24 PM
hyzmarca Elementals have to avantage that that you can send... Dec 5 2004, 06:17 PM
lodestar Elementals can also help with spell research, maki... Dec 5 2004, 06:39 PM
Walknuki I suppose refining your own materials would save a... Dec 5 2004, 08:17 PM
Eyeless Blond Look at Magic in the Shadows. Raw herbal or iron-b... Dec 5 2004, 08:43 PM
Doctor Funkenstein "Unrefined summoning materisl" are Refin... Dec 5 2004, 08:45 PM
Moonstone Spider This leads to an interesting question. If materia... Dec 5 2004, 08:46 PM
Doctor Funkenstein Because prices for magic, software, and cyberware ... Dec 5 2004, 08:47 PM
Kagetenshi I personally think that the rules for creating mag... Dec 5 2004, 08:50 PM
HMHVV Hunter QUOTE (Moonstone Spider @ Dec 5 2004, 04:46 P... Dec 5 2004, 08:51 PM
Eyeless Blond Even moreso because they can't be mass-produce... Dec 5 2004, 09:00 PM
Doctor Funkenstein QUOTE (Kagetenshi @ Dec 5 2004, 02:50 PM) I p... Dec 5 2004, 09:01 PM
ES_Riddle QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein @ Dec 5 2004, 04:01... Dec 5 2004, 09:53 PM
Jason Farlander QUOTE (ES_Riddle) QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein)That... Dec 5 2004, 10:33 PM
Cray74 QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) Both are, but the creat... Dec 5 2004, 11:10 PM
Kagetenshi Out of interest, how much will they cost?
~J Dec 5 2004, 11:20 PM
Eyeless Blond Well, as an analogy it's probably why governme... Dec 5 2004, 11:35 PM
Doctor Funkenstein Read/Write is not "special hacking software,... Dec 5 2004, 11:58 PM
Shockwave_IIc QUOTE (Cray74 @ Dec 5 2004, 11:10 PM) I can e... Dec 6 2004, 12:31 AM
Jason Farlander QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) Read/Write is not ... Dec 6 2004, 01:02 AM
Kagetenshi QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein @ Dec 5 2004, 06:58... Dec 6 2004, 01:03 AM
Eyeless Blond QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein @ Dec 5 2004, 06:58... Dec 6 2004, 01:06 AM
Doctor Funkenstein Find me a quote that says that all Utilities are f... Dec 6 2004, 01:10 AM
Kagetenshi QUOTE (Matrix p38)Automatic System Tests: Having t... Dec 6 2004, 01:20 AM
Doctor Funkenstein Well fine, try this on for size.
Matrix p. 68: ... Dec 6 2004, 01:24 AM
Kagetenshi I can't imagine how, but I can't argue wit... Dec 6 2004, 01:28 AM
ES_Riddle QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) Operational Utilities l... Dec 6 2004, 01:35 AM
Jason Farlander *baleeted*
eh, nevermind. Dec 6 2004, 01:35 AM
Doctor Funkenstein You download the file. Edit it. Upload it back. ... Dec 6 2004, 01:39 AM
Kagetenshi But they for the most part (especially Read/Write... Dec 6 2004, 01:44 AM
Doctor Funkenstein The quote you referred to does. The simple exista... Dec 6 2004, 01:50 AM
Kagetenshi Well, I think a big part of the argument for the p... Dec 6 2004, 01:53 AM
Doctor Funkenstein An Availability of 4 strongly suggests otherwise. ... Dec 6 2004, 01:55 AM
Cray74 QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein)Read/Write is not ... Dec 6 2004, 02:01 AM
Doctor Funkenstein QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein)Matrix p. 68: "Util... Dec 6 2004, 02:04 AM
Jason Farlander Again, Dr F, you are wrong in your interpretation ... Dec 6 2004, 02:07 AM
Cray74 QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) Good luck to any of you... Dec 6 2004, 02:09 AM
Doctor Funkenstein Compressor 6 costs exactly the same amount. The o... Dec 6 2004, 02:13 AM
ES_Riddle QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein)The quote you referred t... Dec 6 2004, 02:14 AM
Cray74 QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) That still doesn't ... Dec 6 2004, 02:15 AM
Doctor Funkenstein You mean like the price for WinZIP's equivalen... Dec 6 2004, 02:18 AM
Cray74 QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) You mean like the price... Dec 6 2004, 02:23 AM
Doctor Funkenstein Explain to me why that analogy doesn't work (w... Dec 6 2004, 02:34 AM
Kagetenshi Aid you in performing them when the system doesn... Dec 6 2004, 03:01 AM
Jason Farlander *shrugs* Perhaps the file formats used in the 2060... Dec 6 2004, 03:03 AM
Doctor Funkenstein QUOTE (Kagetenshi) Aid you in performing them when... Dec 6 2004, 03:13 AM
Eyeless Blond QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) QUOTE (Kagetenshi ... Dec 6 2004, 04:17 AM
John Campbell The rules for Compressor are totally wacked, anywa... Dec 6 2004, 04:46 AM
hyzmarca Considering the cost of everything else in Shadowr... Dec 6 2004, 07:43 AM
Eyeless Blond Except guns, some vehicles, and lower-class housin... Dec 6 2004, 08:05 AM
Eyeless Blond QUOTE (John Campbell) The rules for Compressor are... Dec 6 2004, 08:27 AM
Jason Farlander So yeah... elementals... I like them. Theyre pri... Dec 6 2004, 08:34 AM
Club QUOTE (Cray74 @ Dec 5 2004, 06:10 PM) QUOTE (... Dec 6 2004, 08:40 AM
Joe Outside As another point to Doc Funk's side, it's ... Dec 6 2004, 08:45 AM
Jason Farlander Right, they dont have a legality rating, which mea... Dec 6 2004, 08:51 AM
ES_Riddle QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) Hell. According to som... Dec 6 2004, 10:14 AM
Crusher Bob There's nothing 'inherently' illegal a... Dec 6 2004, 11:32 AM
apple You forget that you need several programs for data... Dec 6 2004, 11:48 AM
mintcar I can only say that for me, the utilities must be ... Dec 6 2004, 01:13 PM
Dissonance Besides, we all know that no company would ever, ... Dec 6 2004, 04:14 PM
lorthazar Illegal compressor? I can see it after all only a... Dec 6 2004, 05:59 PM
draco aardvark QUOTE (hyzmarca) If you like the more hand-on apro... Dec 6 2004, 10:04 PM
hyzmarca Spirit Strength is an Awaken Compound found in Man... Dec 6 2004, 11:01 PM
Doctor Funkenstein But disregard the consequences of its use. Most p... Dec 7 2004, 12:16 AM
hyzmarca QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) But disregard the conse... Dec 7 2004, 12:31 AM
Jason Farlander Honestly, the negative aftereffects arent *that* b... Dec 7 2004, 12:33 AM
Doctor Funkenstein It also lacks a price, Availability, legality, and... Dec 7 2004, 12:38 AM
Jason Farlander Oh, of course its not as if it would be an easy th... Dec 7 2004, 12:50 AM
draco aardvark QUOTE (hyzmarca)Spirit Strength is an Awaken Compo... Dec 7 2004, 02:54 AM
Jason Farlander Channeling is a metamagic technique that appears i... Dec 7 2004, 03:18 AM
Doctor Funkenstein Leaves you with a nasty case of Deadly drain after... Dec 7 2004, 03:20 AM
Fortune QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein) Why does nobody every i... Dec 7 2004, 03:22 AM
Kagetenshi Because if people considered the consequences, the... Dec 7 2004, 03:23 AM
Herald of Verjigorm QUOTE (Doctor Funkenstein)(Why does nobody ever in... Dec 7 2004, 03:24 AM
Jason Farlander *shrugs* I also didnt mention the conjuring test a... Dec 7 2004, 03:25 AM
hyzmarca Hmmmm.... Is the Immunity to Normal Weapons power ... Dec 7 2004, 07:19 AM
Jason Farlander Spirit's Force. Dec 7 2004, 07:31 AM
Club If you are in the wilderness, shaman have it all o... Dec 8 2004, 09:29 AM
Mr.Cato yeah I like elementals.
The biggest use for me an... Dec 8 2004, 12:18 PM
apple QUOTE (Club)The spirits of man, however, have stat... Dec 8 2004, 01:33 PM
ES_Riddle QUOTE (Mr.Cato) by the way... can they decide when... Dec 8 2004, 04:55 PM
Bigity Hm, I thought a spirit could be told to "obey... Dec 8 2004, 05:05 PM
ES_Riddle QUOTE (Bigity) Hm, I thought a spirit could be tol... Dec 8 2004, 06:51 PM
nezumi Alright, I'm going to resurrect a dead thread,... Jan 19 2007, 06:50 PM
Herald of Verjigorm QUOTE (p. 186 "Summoning Elementals" Par... Jan 19 2007, 07:12 PM
nezumi Mine doesn't say that. Hm... Ah, in the erra... Jan 19 2007, 07:34 PM![]() ![]() |
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