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Bira
post Apr 21 2010, 04:09 PM
Post #1


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Well, it looks like the "Unbreakable Encryption" thread has derailed into a discussion of why the Matrix system as a whole sucks, and what should replace it. I decided not to participate in that derailment, and instead open a thread for people who want to post their own alternate systems here.

I don't mind having an abstract system to handle hacking. In fact, I think one of the problems with the current system is that it's not abstract enough. Even though it's simpler in 4th Edition, it's still in that "Uncanny Valley" where it's abstract, but still detailed enough that it bugs people when it deviates from reality. The main cause of that, in my mind, is the big emphasis put on programs.

In addition to being a fiddly subsystem, programs (including OSs) are being balanced as if they were a piece of physical equipment. Each has a very specific function and a rating. The more programs you have, and the higher their ratings, the better you can be at hacking. The main limiting factor on the number and rating of your programs is money. If you can somehow get your programs for free, there wouldn't be anything stopping you from having all programs at the highest rating you can fit in your commlink. However, it turns out software is indeed different than physical equipment. For one, it's much easier to obtain for free! If Shadowrun bears any resemblance at all to our world, it could even be done legally for most programs that aren't actually restricted by law. Those could be gotten fairly easily by the big bad hackers shadowrunners are supposed to be.

To "counter" this, they introduced program update rules on Unwired, where only legally purchased proprietary software gets regular updates. If you want to keep up with your cracked copies or (gasp!) free software, you have to dedicate every waking moment of your PC's time to patching it. I don't remember the specifics, but I think there was also a strong implication that the character would have to either do all of this on his own, since for some reason there weren't any networks of people dedicated to maintaining free software or cracking proprietary programs, unlike in real life.

My proposed solution would be a system where programs don't matter at all for the rules. Oh, sure, they're still there in the setting, but you don't need to keep track of how much they cost or how up-to-date they are. Why should you? Your character is a big bad shadowrunnin' hacker with loads of points invested in mental attributes and computer skills, let him worry about all of that. Just assume he's either using free software and/or cracked programs he obtained for free, and they're all so good at their functions the only limiting factors are the speed of his hardware and his own personal skill. So that's all you need to track. The only relevant gear-derived numbers are now Response and Signal. Signal is mostly there to determine your radio range.

Hacking is a contest of the hacker's Logic + Skill + Response against the Logic + Skill + Response of the target system's administrator. If the hacker suceeds, he's in, if he fails, he suffers consequences dependent on what sort of security measures are installed in the system. For example, you could apply the net sucesses of the target as successes towards a trace on the hacker, or damage boxes to his persona or to his brain. The target's system security programs probably aren't cracked, but they're assumed to also be as good as the system itself can handle, and are limited by the same factors as the hacker's attack programs. Multiple retries are allowed for the hacker, with the usual penalties. Taking extra time to probe the system beforehand gives the hacker bonus dice in proportion to the time he took. Hot Sim adds its usual bonus. Multiply all hardware costs by a factor that makes you comfortable, to compensate for the fact hackers don't need to pay for software anymore.

Technomancers use Resonance + Skill instead, and can use Threading to get additional bonuses here, in place of the hacker's fixed Response bonus. They always get the Hot Sim bonus.
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Posts in this topic
- Bira   Alternate Hacking Systems   Apr 21 2010, 04:09 PM
- - tete   QUOTE (Bira @ Apr 21 2010, 04:09 PM) My p...   Apr 21 2010, 04:23 PM
- - Teulisch   i like the no programs idea, but have an idea for ...   Apr 21 2010, 04:41 PM
|- - Bira   QUOTE (Teulisch @ Apr 21 2010, 01:41 PM) ...   Apr 21 2010, 08:19 PM
- - Ascalaphus   On the one hand, I like the idea of buying program...   Apr 21 2010, 05:47 PM
|- - Bira   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Apr 21 2010, 02:47 PM...   Apr 21 2010, 08:14 PM
- - Walpurgisborn   What about capping a program's dice pool bonus...   Apr 21 2010, 06:57 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Walpurgisborn @ Apr 21 2010, 01:57...   Apr 21 2010, 07:41 PM
- - Synner667   Jumping into what could end up being interesting, ...   Apr 21 2010, 08:20 PM
- - Bira   I didn't actually change anything about the se...   Apr 21 2010, 08:25 PM
- - Dr. Funkenstein   Logic + Computers + System roll vs. appropriate ro...   Apr 21 2010, 08:29 PM
- - WeaverMount   QUOTE Programs would have an Availability; but unl...   Apr 22 2010, 01:47 AM
- - Mongoose   Simple solution? Have the hacker tell the GM what...   Apr 22 2010, 03:58 AM
- - The Monk   I've been rolling this over in my head, haven...   Apr 22 2010, 05:03 AM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (The Monk @ Apr 22 2010, 01:03 AM) ...   Apr 22 2010, 01:08 PM
|- - The Monk   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 22 2010, 09:08 AM) ...   Apr 22 2010, 09:01 PM
- - hobgoblin   i dreamed up a framework back when SR4 first launc...   Apr 22 2010, 10:30 AM
- - Wandering One   The biggest problem with the Matrix, in general, i...   Apr 22 2010, 09:28 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Wandering One @ Apr 22 2010, 05:28...   Apr 22 2010, 09:31 PM
- - hobgoblin   that can be done today, with spoof, AR and a secur...   Apr 22 2010, 09:43 PM
|- - Wandering One   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Apr 22 2010, 02:43 PM)...   Apr 22 2010, 09:49 PM
|- - hobgoblin   QUOTE (Wandering One @ Apr 22 2010, 11:49...   Apr 22 2010, 09:53 PM
|- - Wandering One   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Apr 22 2010, 02:53 PM)...   Apr 22 2010, 10:24 PM
|- - hobgoblin   QUOTE (Wandering One @ Apr 23 2010, 12:24...   Apr 23 2010, 12:14 PM
|- - Wandering One   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Apr 23 2010, 05:14 AM)...   Apr 23 2010, 05:10 PM
|- - hobgoblin   QUOTE (Wandering One @ Apr 23 2010, 07:10...   Apr 23 2010, 06:57 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Apr 23 2010, 02:57 PM)...   Apr 23 2010, 07:12 PM
||- - hobgoblin   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 23 2010, 09:12 PM) ...   Apr 23 2010, 08:14 PM
|- - Wandering One   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Apr 23 2010, 11:57 AM)...   Apr 23 2010, 09:33 PM
|- - The Monk   QUOTE (Wandering One @ Apr 23 2010, 04:33...   Apr 23 2010, 10:28 PM
- - Draco18s   I think I'll make a slightly different analogy...   Apr 22 2010, 11:10 PM
- - Saint Sithney   I like using programs in the same way as an autopi...   Apr 23 2010, 12:50 AM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Saint Sithney @ Apr 22 2010, 08:50...   Apr 23 2010, 01:24 AM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 22 2010, 06:24 PM) ...   Apr 23 2010, 01:26 AM
- - Draco18s   While (possibly) true, it is by and large such a t...   Apr 23 2010, 01:29 AM
|- - Tymeaus Jalynsfein   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 22 2010, 06:29 PM) ...   Apr 23 2010, 01:52 AM
|- - The Monk   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 22 2010, 08:29 PM) ...   Apr 23 2010, 04:30 PM
|- - Wandering One   QUOTE (The Monk @ Apr 23 2010, 09:30 AM) ...   Apr 23 2010, 04:56 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Wandering One @ Apr 23 2010, 12:56...   Apr 23 2010, 05:20 PM
|- - The Monk   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 23 2010, 01:20 PM) ...   Apr 23 2010, 08:54 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (The Monk @ Apr 23 2010, 04:54 PM) ...   Apr 23 2010, 11:04 PM
- - darune   I don't really see the big issue with RAW. Ye...   Apr 23 2010, 10:29 AM
- - Emeraldknite   You know I have been thinking about this issue for...   Apr 24 2010, 06:54 PM
- - Ascalaphus   Well, this topic has fallen quiet again, shame rea...   Apr 27 2010, 02:34 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Apr 27 2010, 10:34 AM...   Apr 27 2010, 03:08 PM
|- - Wandering One   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 27 2010, 08:08 AM) ...   Apr 27 2010, 07:09 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Wandering One @ Apr 27 2010, 03:09...   Apr 27 2010, 07:40 PM
- - The Monk   The thing about the Matrix is that it effects ever...   Apr 27 2010, 08:10 PM
- - Draco18s   Mechanically you have to make it advantageous for ...   Apr 27 2010, 08:36 PM
- - Bira   I refer you to the first post in the thread .   Apr 27 2010, 08:39 PM
- - Ascalaphus   With regards to VR/AR, my thoughts are these: - V...   Apr 27 2010, 10:37 PM
|- - hobgoblin   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Apr 28 2010, 12:37 AM...   Apr 29 2010, 01:12 AM
|- - Ascalaphus   QUOTE (hobgoblin @ Apr 29 2010, 02:12 AM)...   Apr 29 2010, 02:34 AM
- - Crusher Bob   The reason the brain hacking was included in Frank...   Apr 28 2010, 05:08 AM
- - Cthulhudreams   Bob is correct that you need an incentive to peopl...   Apr 28 2010, 06:38 AM
- - Ascalaphus   What exactly do you mean by "forcing to care ...   Apr 28 2010, 09:50 AM
- - Crusher Bob   Read Frank's opeing post: Nash Equilibria and ...   Apr 28 2010, 10:38 AM
|- - Ryu   QUOTE (Crusher Bob @ Apr 28 2010, 12:38 P...   Apr 28 2010, 11:06 AM
|- - Cthulhudreams   QUOTE (Ryu @ Apr 28 2010, 09:06 PM) The i...   Apr 28 2010, 12:54 PM
- - Blade   That's one of the biggest issue I have with Fr...   Apr 28 2010, 12:07 PM
- - Blade   What's the probability of getting hacked? What...   Apr 28 2010, 01:34 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Blade @ Apr 28 2010, 09:34 AM) Mos...   Apr 28 2010, 02:23 PM
|- - Crusher Bob   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 28 2010, 10:23 PM) ...   Apr 28 2010, 02:46 PM
- - Crusher Bob   Because the people who use one password for everyt...   Apr 28 2010, 01:50 PM
- - Cthulhudreams   We're talking about the end of town that doesn...   Apr 28 2010, 02:08 PM
- - Blade   The people who use one password for everything are...   Apr 28 2010, 02:30 PM
|- - kzt   QUOTE (Blade @ Apr 28 2010, 07:30 AM) The...   May 2 2010, 04:34 AM
- - Ascalaphus   Okay, so I plowed my way through that flame-hammer...   Apr 28 2010, 02:48 PM
|- - Blade   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Apr 28 2010, 04:48 PM...   Apr 28 2010, 03:30 PM
|- - Ascalaphus   QUOTE (Blade @ Apr 28 2010, 04:30 PM) Coo...   Apr 28 2010, 04:55 PM
||- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Apr 28 2010, 12:55 PM...   Apr 28 2010, 05:16 PM
||- - Ascalaphus   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 28 2010, 06:16 PM) ...   Apr 28 2010, 05:36 PM
|- - Wandering One   QUOTE (Blade @ Apr 28 2010, 08:30 AM) Coo...   Apr 28 2010, 07:42 PM
- - Ascalaphus   Matrix Banking is actually fairly simple. Credsti...   Apr 28 2010, 08:19 PM
- - Wandering One   My problem isn't with a hardware credstick, bu...   Apr 28 2010, 08:37 PM
|- - Ascalaphus   QUOTE (Wandering One @ Apr 28 2010, 09:37...   Apr 28 2010, 08:47 PM
|- - Mongoose   QUOTE (Ascalaphus @ Apr 28 2010, 08:47 PM...   Apr 29 2010, 03:11 AM
- - Draco18s   Its because observing the data stream changes it. ...   Apr 29 2010, 03:56 AM
- - Mongoose   Exactly. So, somebody sends you a one time pad us...   Apr 29 2010, 04:06 AM
- - Blade   Personally, I explain the possibility of secure tr...   Apr 29 2010, 09:16 AM
- - hobgoblin   also, transactions will be bank to bank, with the ...   Apr 29 2010, 01:27 PM
- - Ascalaphus   Okay, that quantum encryption bit was an interesti...   Apr 29 2010, 05:39 PM
- - Dixie Flatline   I didn't read the thread, so I may be reiterat...   May 1 2010, 02:26 AM
- - Draco18s   ....That looks pretty nice. I remember glancing o...   May 1 2010, 03:22 AM
|- - Dixie Flatline   QUOTE (Draco18s @ Apr 30 2010, 08:22 PM) ...   May 1 2010, 06:35 AM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Dixie Flatline @ May 1 2010, 02:35...   May 1 2010, 04:27 PM
- - Ascalaphus   Interesting.. I'm gonna let this sink in, it...   May 1 2010, 10:08 AM
- - The Monk   I like the concept above. How would multiple IC/H...   May 2 2010, 12:57 AM
|- - Dixie Flatline   QUOTE (The Monk @ May 1 2010, 04:57 PM) I...   May 2 2010, 01:54 AM
- - Heath Robinson   Dixie, Why wouldn't a network want to have all...   May 2 2010, 01:07 AM
|- - Dixie Flatline   QUOTE (Heath Robinson @ May 1 2010, 05:07...   May 2 2010, 01:44 AM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Dixie Flatline @ May 1 2010, 09:44...   May 2 2010, 03:46 AM
- - nemafow   Pretty decent, might give it a shot sometime   May 2 2010, 01:28 AM
|- - Dixie Flatline   QUOTE (nemafow @ May 1 2010, 05:28 PM) Pr...   May 2 2010, 01:59 AM
- - Redcrow   I've read the Matrix rules for SR2, SR3 & ...   May 2 2010, 05:16 AM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Redcrow @ May 2 2010, 01:16 AM) Th...   May 3 2010, 02:52 AM
- - Earlydawn   I'd like to see hacking stratified into two ty...   May 3 2010, 05:49 PM
|- - Draco18s   QUOTE (Earlydawn @ May 3 2010, 01:49 PM) ...   May 3 2010, 07:58 PM
- - JoelHalpern   To return to the Quantum Communication item for a ...   May 3 2010, 08:06 PM
- - Draco18s   QUOTE (JoelHalpern @ May 3 2010, 04:06 PM...   May 3 2010, 08:42 PM
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