 Vehicle Combat Initiative, Init Enhancers count? |
 Oct 23 2005, 01:34 AM
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#1
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Neophyte Runner  Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364  |
Under previous editions, the only form of Reaction and/or Initiative Enhancement that counted when you were in control of a vehicle was the vehicle control rig. Other Reaction/Init enhancements in the forms of magic, adept powers, and implants, were not allowed to be counted when controlling a vehicle.
Try as I might, I can't seem to find anything that states this is still the case in SR4. Has the philosophy behind this changed under the new edition, or am I just missing some disclaimer somewhere? |
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Oct 23 2005, 02:21 AM
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#2
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
not sure as i dont have a book to refrence but from what i gather here on the forum it seems that as long as your in AR rather then VR then physical ractions count, be them wired or not. go VR and only the type of sim your running counts. atleast thats how it looks to me so far...
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Oct 23 2005, 02:33 AM
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#3
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,590 Joined: 11-September 04 Member No.: 6,650 |
yup which means the drivbing adept can be significantly better than a rigger now
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Oct 23 2005, 02:35 AM
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#4
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
well, as both will max out at x number of initiative passes, the only diff will be who can go first...
hmm, that makes me think how they will present move-by-wire in the new system. even more initiative passes? |
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Oct 23 2005, 02:48 AM
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#5
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,590 Joined: 11-September 04 Member No.: 6,650 |
okay the adept will max out at 4 initiave passes and from what i have read the rigger maxes out at 3
the adept can also have more dice |
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Oct 23 2005, 02:54 AM
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#6
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,479 Joined: 6-May 05 From: Idaho Member No.: 7,377 |
The book states all over that the max is 4 for init passes. Makes me wonder if they will even make it.... |
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Oct 23 2005, 03:00 AM
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#7
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,590 Joined: 11-September 04 Member No.: 6,650 |
4 init passes with extra actions in the first and second init passes :P
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Oct 23 2005, 06:15 AM
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#8
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
nasty truely nasty. but as i said, im base my view of things on the stuff i have read so far on this forum, not on the text in the book itself... |
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Oct 24 2005, 04:34 PM
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#9
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 914 Joined: 26-August 05 From: Louisville, KY (Well, Memphis, IN technically but you won't know where that is.) Member No.: 7,626 |
However the rigger with a control rig will need 1 less success for any test with a threshold >1, which equates to about a +4 die bonus. |
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Oct 24 2005, 06:00 PM
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#10
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 403 Joined: 27-August 02 From: Scotland Member No.: 3,175 |
+3 bonus dice surely.
Anyway, about 4 being the absolute limit for initiative passes (which has nothing much to do with this thread) - does that mean that the option of using an Edge point to get another pass is no longer an option for someone with, for example, Wired Reflexes 3? Or is it one of those "limits" that's not really a limit. MBW would be interesting, and I'd imagine they'll add it in somehow. Although extra actions seems a bit too powerful, considering everyone else is banned from having more than 4 (or 5 perhaps). Apologies for perpetuating the thread hijacking. :) |
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Oct 24 2005, 06:10 PM
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#11
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
A possibility for Move-By-Wire is that it pushes the character up to the always-first tier of initiative, but that's pretty damn powerful given that normally you have to spend a point of Edge every time you want to get that. Maybe an extra Free Action? Although that is likely going to be a relatively rare use. *shrug* P.S. DSF is one big thread highjack. ;) |
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Oct 24 2005, 06:23 PM
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#12
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
Depends on how you look at it. If you look at it from the law of averages, it's +3. If you look at it from the standpoint of spending dice to buy an automatic hit, then a -1 to Threshold is worth the 4 dice you would have had to spend to get 1 hit.
I'm the one who started this thread, and I don't consider it hijacked in the least. I wanted to spark off a discusion of this particular change in the game, and tangently related subjects, like initiative. |
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Oct 24 2005, 06:32 PM
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#13
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 403 Joined: 27-August 02 From: Scotland Member No.: 3,175 |
Aha, fair enough. 4 passes is the absolute limit no matter what. At least that's definite. I shall read my books more closely in future.
Point taken about +3/+4 dice as well. |
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Oct 25 2005, 12:19 AM
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#14
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,665 Joined: 26-April 03 From: Sweden Member No.: 4,516 |
Move-by-wire could easily just push your actions up... IP 1:act once at normal Initative, act again after everyone else, IP:2 Act at normal initiative, act again after everyone else. IP:3 no more actions for Mr.Move-by-Wire...
This could end up being a drawback sometimes, though, but that may be the price you pay for acting before you even have the time to react, much less think twice about what you are doing... (Anyway, not really a suggestion - just a thought) |
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Oct 25 2005, 01:32 AM
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#15
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 458 Joined: 12-April 04 From: Lacey, Washington Member No.: 6,237 |
Vehicle drivers use their physical initiative. There's nothing about that being limited to unaugmented initiative.
As for Move By Wire, they may have it provide additional dice for the Athletics Skill Group and for Infiltration. Fine control added, but not game breaking. |
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Oct 25 2005, 02:13 PM
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#16
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,651 Joined: 23-September 05 From: Marietta, GA Member No.: 7,773 |
Could also bump up movement rates a little. |
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Oct 25 2005, 09:54 PM
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#17
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,219 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Lofwyr's stomach. Member No.: 1,320 |
Or we can just break the rule. After all, it was made in the main rule book, where there is no Move by wire. Move by wire is the thing, and the ONLY thing, that can give you that last extra initiative pass. Take that, Adepts!
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Oct 26 2005, 01:22 PM
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#18
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
Oh, I don't think the Adepts will be too terribly put off when 6 months down the line the M-B-W guy dies of one or more of the nasty brain disfunctions that piece of hardware induces. Though it is 2070 now, maybe they've finally worked the bugs out. |
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Oct 26 2005, 02:35 PM
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#19
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,219 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Lofwyr's stomach. Member No.: 1,320 |
I don't think they would have, after all, there has to be a good drawback if it breaks the rules. See my cyberware thread for how I put Move by wire into SR4.
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