 What's your Favorite SMG?, Voice your opinion. |
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 Oct 26 2005, 03:35 AM
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#51
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 140 Joined: 26-July 05 From: Calgary Alberta, CANADA Member No.: 7,519  |
Depends, am I packing a Carbine and have the drop on you? It's not the firearm, its the operator. I know men who have used Browning HPs to kill soldiers armed with Port Said AK-47s. |
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Oct 26 2005, 03:37 AM
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#52
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 140 Joined: 26-July 05 From: Calgary Alberta, CANADA Member No.: 7,519 |
Heh, Pack 'em too tight and you have trouble getting the buggers into battery! |
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Oct 26 2005, 03:40 AM
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#53
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Man In The Machine Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,264 Joined: 26-February 02 From: I-495 S Member No.: 1,105 |
Wow, I was going to vote for the Tomson (I did anyway), but the idea of a mac-10 in .45 just seems like a lovely way to ruin your wrist (and everyone downrange's day). |
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Oct 26 2005, 03:41 AM
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#54
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Freelance Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 |
Nope, the 19's just their compact (not sub-compact, mind, just compact) 9mm. Either that, or there's some super secret "full auto" button somewhere on mine that I just haven't found yet, in which case I'm very excited. ;) |
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Oct 26 2005, 03:48 AM
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#55
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 140 Joined: 26-July 05 From: Calgary Alberta, CANADA Member No.: 7,519 |
Not so fast there tex. According to your logic every HRT would be kitted out with Glock 18s and M93Rs. Yet we still see full size firearms. The reasons being, accuracy (longer barrel, better sight radius), controllability (more mass and surface area/length to help absorb recoil), heat dissipation, optionability (the accessories (crap) you throw on the weapon) & the benefit of a full buttstock (collapsible, fixed or nonconventional). These things are important for any HRT, accuracy will mean you kill the terrorist and not the hostage, controllability will mean the second and third round will be closer to the mark when you Mozambique him and the heat dissipation means you don't burn your little fingers when there is a protracted engagement. Optionability is a benefit because it can do a lot to improve your weapons performance. Now having said that, sometimes you just need to go through a window with no more than a 9mm pistol and a few extra 20rd magazines. |
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Oct 26 2005, 03:50 AM
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#56
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 140 Joined: 26-July 05 From: Calgary Alberta, CANADA Member No.: 7,519 |
When you find that secret button, be sure that you're ready for it, them Glock19s ain't too heavy... :grinbig: |
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Oct 26 2005, 03:56 AM
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#57
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
It's not that bad...
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Oct 26 2005, 03:58 AM
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#58
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,901 Joined: 19-June 03 Member No.: 4,775 |
Personally, I'm a big fan of the .380ACP M11. 1600 rounds per minute is death-hose beautiful. Second place for the .45ACP M10, but only with the ridiculously large suppressor. |
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Oct 26 2005, 04:05 AM
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#59
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 140 Joined: 26-July 05 From: Calgary Alberta, CANADA Member No.: 7,519 |
Looks to me that he was ready for it. ;) |
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Oct 26 2005, 04:46 AM
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#60
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 519 Joined: 27-August 02 From: Queensland Member No.: 3,180 |
Eddie, Cray74 was talking about SR and without the optional Heat Dissipation rules. :D
As for favourite SMG, I went for the MP5. Like BMW, Bose & Beckenbauer, it has that germanic quality of precision with a dash of style. |
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Oct 26 2005, 05:01 AM
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#61
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 149 Joined: 21-March 05 From: UCAS (if its tuesday) Member No.: 7,200 |
as has been said, take the tool for the job. I stated my prefrence, and why I didn't pick some of the others. and so what if some of my logic os a bit off. reason is reality, if I think somehting is true, it will effect the way I operate correct? if I think that my p-90 could have a problem hitting the floor then I won't dive so hard, may mean I'm a bit slower, see my point. I did a training course where the weapon to be issued was way our of date, and was considerably weak. ( a 4" .38 is very low on my list of wepons to take to a fight) however the reason was, they were proven, indestructable, and you would never have to worry about the gun. any moron could run one, it takes some stress out of the firefight. of course unless there was a real need for it, I'd rather carry buckshot than an SMG. funny, russian federal HRTs (no longer spetsznaz) got issued ak-74s, threw 'em out and swiched to back to shotguns for pretty much all CQB work. they have a few tricks. I love dumpshock and its perpensity for apples vs. oranges vs. mustardball arguments
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Oct 26 2005, 05:15 AM
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#62
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Freelance Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 |
Why do you seem so stubbornly decided on remaining willfully incorrect, though? I mean, you made a mistake -- accept it, and move on. Don't stand by your mistake, clinging to it like a drowning man with a piece of driftwood, or something. You were wrong, someone called you on it -- thank them for their knowledge, and truck on with the conversation. If you're wrong and someone tells you so (and they're correct), change your outlook and opinion, having had the chance to learn something. Don't go "oh yeah? well I think this is right, so even though it's not right, I'm gonna go on thinking that it is!" like you seem to be doing. It's kind of jackassish, and immature. |
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Oct 26 2005, 05:23 AM
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#63
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Resident Legionnaire Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,136 Joined: 8-August 04 From: Usually Work Member No.: 6,550 |
Hehe, the myth of the 31-round AR15 mag ;) |
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Oct 26 2005, 05:28 AM
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#64
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 149 Joined: 21-March 05 From: UCAS (if its tuesday) Member No.: 7,200 |
exactly how is that. yes I was corrected on one point. a technical detail. my bad. however I seems interesting to me that when my opinions do not mesh with someone elses world view, that I'm utterly wrong. my original post contained one techical detail, (yes I was wrong) one bit of half remembered speculation and some opinion. I accept the fact that yes having not handled any fully automatic weapons my personal experiance is not the best sourse of information. I also am a student of history, and certain weapons tend to expend more ammo to hit a target than others. I feel that it is telling that police in confrontations often worry more about the stray rounds heading past them than rounds that could hit them. unrelated question, am I the only person here that thinks that preseption is more improtant to reality? sorry bout my misinformedness jacking the thread
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Oct 26 2005, 05:56 AM
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#65
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,065 Joined: 16-January 03 From: Fayetteville, NC Member No.: 3,916 |
You can make any pointed thing into a successful weapon with enough motivation, but the practical application of what essentially becomes a short spear strikes me as...well...limited. I seem to recall something similar about the shortage of assault rifles, but don't quote me. -Siege |
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Oct 26 2005, 06:03 AM
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#66
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
No better example of natural selection at work. It takes some effort to be that stupid. ;) |
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Oct 26 2005, 12:36 PM
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#67
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
very literally.
why isn't my baby, the HK227-S, up there? small size, high cap, high damage, integral suppression--no full-auto is the only downside. |
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Oct 26 2005, 12:54 PM
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#68
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
You attach a bayonet to your pistol so that when you throw it at superman, you can be sure he will duck to get out of the way.
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Oct 26 2005, 03:45 PM
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#69
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 164 Joined: 7-July 03 Member No.: 4,891 |
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Oct 26 2005, 03:53 PM
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#70
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 523 Joined: 13-March 05 Member No.: 7,155 |
Thanks for the link Raygun. I never would have guessed that they would be so controllable...one handed even. I am assuming that the gun in the clip was 9mm, do the Glock MPs come in other claibers? I think 10mm would be nice, .45 too, but wouldn't that break your wrist? Does anyone here use Flechette ammo in their SR SMGs? It seems like the bonuses you get for burst or full auto fire would make up for the armor bonus. Especially in the Supermach to make up for the lighter ammo it uses. |
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Oct 26 2005, 04:05 PM
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#71
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Man In The Machine Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,264 Joined: 26-February 02 From: I-495 S Member No.: 1,105 |
Very nice. Much tighter package then a P90, or a Mac-11. |
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Oct 26 2005, 05:37 PM
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#72
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,889 Joined: 3-August 03 From: A CPI rank 1 country Member No.: 5,222 |
The Fire Selector System for Glock Pistols can be installed on any Glock pistol, yes, including the subcompact 10mm Auto Glock 29. Breaking your wrist should be unlikely, since automatic fire is more like a steady push than a sudden slap, but I wouldn't bet on you being able to point the thing downrange for the full 10 rounds. |
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Oct 26 2005, 05:42 PM
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#73
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Freelance Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 |
Depends. From the looks of some of the guys I've seen at the gun shop I shoot at, "downrange" counts as anything in your front arc.
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Oct 26 2005, 09:00 PM
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#74
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Mostly Harmless Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 937 Joined: 26-February 02 From: 44.662,-63.469 Member No.: 176 |
Like Aus said, the FSSG is a very simple device that can be mounted to any model of Glock pistol (except the Glock 18, which is already select fire), and Glock makes pistols in .380 Auto, 9x19mm, .357 SIG, .40 S&W, 10mm Auto, .45 ACP, and .45 GAP. The majority of the shots in that clip are of either Glock 17s or 19s (both 9x19mm), but at about 9 seconds in, you'll see close-up profile shots of two different guns firing. The first to fire is a Glock 17 (fires 18 rounds without the slide locking back, at around 1200 rpm). The second is obviously another model firing a different cartridge, but which model it actually is, I can't be sure. The ejected cases definitely look like .45 ACP, but the frame looks like a compact (as opposed to a full-size or subcompact). However, Glock doesn't make a compact .45 ACP (and this video was out a couple of years before the Glock 38 was introduced). The next closest things would be the subcompact Glock 30 or the Glock 23 in .40 S&W. Anyway, it fires 10 rounds without slide lock (at about 985 rpm). In these two shots you can also clearly see the FSSG attachment protruding from the rear end of the slide.
To back up Aus again, yeah, very unlikely. It would certainly open up your pattern dispersion. Even when he fires that .45 ACP (or at least, what I'm pretty sure is a .45 ACP), you can tell he has to fight against it a bit more. |
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Oct 27 2005, 03:38 AM
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#75
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 140 Joined: 26-July 05 From: Calgary Alberta, CANADA Member No.: 7,519 |
I've seen it from time to time. Hell the Canadians had these cheap plastic Mags that they were fond of calling thier "28 round" magazines! |
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