 Why Doesn't every Runner have a drone? |
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 Dec 24 2005, 04:05 AM
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#1
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 909 Joined: 26-August 05 From: Louisville, KY (Well, Memphis, IN technically but you won't know where that is.) Member No.: 7,626  |
Maybe I've been watching too much Ghost in the Shell on G4 but I just realized how useful the small drones are to pretty much any runner. For 2-3k each you can get an iball or the MCT fly and equip it with ultrasound, upgraded optics and audio gear that they get to roll 6+ dice each for perception tests! (sensor:3 + enhancement:3 +2 spatial analyzer/clearsoft rating)
Equip the toys with skinlink and imagelink for the extra 100Y and you can wear them like gaudy jewelry and tap their sensors at will (it also lets you stay passive, assuming you shut off the active ultrasound). Since they are non-combat types you don't need much beyond a Command:2 soft on your comm for the rare time you jump into them; mostly you're just going to order 'em to circle at a distance or follow a given target. Heck, the iball can be equipped with flashpack and a smoke grenade, making it an incredibly effective toy to keep on your keyring. When I suggested this to some friends they looked at me like I was loony. |
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Dec 24 2005, 04:08 AM
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#2
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,026 Joined: 23-November 05 From: Seattle (Really!) Member No.: 7,996 |
The short answer to your question; money. You need the drone plus the control rig (or do you could you just let the drone go on it's own pilot and periodically issue a command or two?)
Side note: this every runner with a drone idea reminds me of MAGS from the Phantasy Star Online games |
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Dec 24 2005, 04:14 AM
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#3
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 388 Joined: 24-October 05 Member No.: 7,885 |
only drones my char ever used were pre-programed for home security.
Anything on the job, cost to much to be autonimous, and represented too much of a liability if it got lost behind or compromised. |
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Dec 24 2005, 04:47 AM
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#4
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,283 Joined: 17-May 05 Member No.: 7,398 |
In SR4 all you need to command your drones is a commlink with a simlink, and who doesn't have one of those?
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Dec 24 2005, 04:55 AM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 388 Joined: 24-October 05 Member No.: 7,885 |
you don't really like the idea of that drone you're trusting to help you, to suddenly turn and riddle your butt with lead because a security rigger took it over.
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Dec 24 2005, 05:49 AM
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#6
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 753 Joined: 31-October 03 Member No.: 5,780 |
Indeed. a drone in this day an age is either a reliable tool or a liability when runners are nearby. Since you're pretty much a runner by default, it's a permanent 'liability' unless you are a well practiced rigger/hacker/whatever.
Now, if you were to disable it's wireless and leave a couple agents inside, you could use visual cues or other such things to communicate and whatnot. This is limited in some respects, but you won't be in paranoia mode 24/7 (unless your paranoid). That'll help keep out the hackers for awhile. Otherwise just turn off your wifi and leave a datajack string to the floating ball, lol. It's your technomagical yoyo! |
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Dec 24 2005, 08:50 AM
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#7
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
I'd just like to echo Liper's and Cold-Dragon's statements. While there are ways to resonably ensure that your drones don't get co-opted by the opposition, it usually ends up dominating the character's investment in time and resources.
I'm not saying it's not a good idea for every member of the team to have a small, cheap drone, I'm just saying that their use should be limited, to keep from exposing the team to undue risks. And it's a good idea to have the team's drone hacker look after the task of keeping the whole team's drones secure. |
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Dec 24 2005, 02:14 PM
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#8
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
One possibiility is the 'shoulder drone' which is solely skinlinked and has no wireless connection.
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Dec 24 2005, 04:55 PM
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#9
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 753 Joined: 31-October 03 Member No.: 5,780 |
Why not go with a full body suit that skin links (eww)? But that's not a bad idea right there. :)
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Dec 24 2005, 06:14 PM
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#10
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 909 Joined: 26-August 05 From: Louisville, KY (Well, Memphis, IN technically but you won't know where that is.) Member No.: 7,626 |
I agree that combat-capable drones are too expensive for every 'runner to port around but the unarmed mini drones are relatively cheap (under 3,000Y), fit in your pocket (eyeball sized) and low risk. I assume you'd rely on skinlink-issued commands until the drek hits the fan. If they get compromised after that, odds are the enemy already knows your location and better they waste time hacking an unarmed sensor drone than try to crash your comm net.
Their pilot ratings are surprisingly high (R:3 like all the rest) so they aren't dumb. Using the "dog brain" threshold, their job is pretty similar to any of the pointer dogs. "Look for X and let me know if you see it." |
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Dec 24 2005, 07:28 PM
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#11
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,089 Joined: 4-October 05 Member No.: 7,813 |
actually, the minidrones aren't quite that small. you're thinking of microdrones.
the lone star iball is probably about the size of a softball, not the size of an eyeball (although the cyberware ocular drone is obviously the size of an eyeball). |
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Dec 24 2005, 07:52 PM
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#12
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Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,512 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 392 |
If you don't put any weapons on a drone they aren't that big of a liability. Especially if you downgrade their signal from 3 to 0 or 1. Makes the drone cheaper and unless the intruding spider's broadcast is coming from within 15m or less then he can't hack it. Also since it's skinlinked you don't have to worry about jamming taking it out.
Wow, that's a really cool idea. Wish I'd thought of it. :( Just about every character I make has drones now. For 1 BP you can have a pretty respectable drone that can do whatever you want it for--combat, surveillance, electronic warfare, etc. It has even gotten to the point where I seriously consider making mages that have a couple of drones/weapon platforms instead of combat spells. |
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Dec 24 2005, 08:01 PM
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#13
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Hoppelhäschen 5000 Group: Members Posts: 5,807 Joined: 3-January 04 Member No.: 5,951 |
Forget about skinlinking... it's a spider, after all:
A coil of microwire on the drone serving as optical fiber makes it not only non-hackable, but gives it the ability to rappel - now add a dispenser for an adhesive, and it can even lay ugly traps. |
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Dec 25 2005, 02:15 AM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 909 Joined: 26-August 05 From: Louisville, KY (Well, Memphis, IN technically but you won't know where that is.) Member No.: 7,626 |
I'm not sure about the size; I'd think the ocular drone would have a lower body if it wasn't roughly the same size as the iBall. But even at softball sized, that's about the size of a grenade so we aren't talking a huge amount of extra mass to be carting around. Just imagine having one or two "grenades" on your combat harness that automatically made spot checks for you with between 3 and 9 dice (Sensor:3, +3 possible points of audio/video enhancement, +3 possible points of Clearsight Autosoft). Trick them out with different sensor packs to increase your safety margin/utility. A skinlinked combat variant of the iBall with the flashpack & smoke grenade is an automatic defensive weapon, or even a self-propelled smoke grenade! The only real downside I can see is the speed; if you're forced to run you'll leave the minidrones behind (top speed of 15). Small drones are a touch too large for anyone but a troll to really carry around just for extra input. Of course, you could just buy an Agent and an external sensor pack and it might be cheaper but you lose the option of remote operation. |
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Dec 25 2005, 03:28 AM
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#15
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,598 Joined: 15-March 03 From: Hong Kong Member No.: 4,253 |
You could also run the drones literally like dogs, with no radio comms at all. Get high pilot ratings and direct them with voice commands and gestures. Most good drone brains can figure out things like 'follow me', 'kill that', 'bark if you see X', or whatever.
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Dec 25 2005, 03:41 AM
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#16
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,089 Joined: 4-October 05 Member No.: 7,813 |
and then someone with a voice modulator comes along and you've lost your drone again.
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Dec 25 2005, 04:10 AM
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#17
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 753 Joined: 31-October 03 Member No.: 5,780 |
That might work if they can't see you to realize you didn't give the command, but probably doesn't do jack if they can see whos speaking.
Provided it's an intelligent program of course. a basic command-react drone is your own problem. |
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Dec 25 2005, 07:38 AM
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#18
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,086 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 364 |
So, do you want the drone to be watching your environment or watching your face to make sure you're the one speaking commands to it? I suppose if a drone had multiple cameras, it could be doing both, but that locks you into using a minidrone or bigger. Running voice commands by themselves, with no other verification, is just asking someone with a voice modulator to give you trouble. Hell, voice modulators can give biometric voiceprint scanners trouble. A drone, even one running clearsight to enhance its processing of sensory input, shouldn't stand a chance. Of course, nothing's stopping you from adapting the electronics/code out of a maglock voiceprint scanner to add security to your drone, but then you're looking at added expense on something that was supposed to be a cheap option for every member on the team. |
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Dec 25 2005, 04:45 PM
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#19
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,089 Joined: 4-October 05 Member No.: 7,813 |
personally, i say it only really works (as a cheap option) if you have a technomancer with lots of command sprites available, each being a high rating sprite with an equally high rating clearsight autosoft :P
plus a few courier sprites to send commands and whatnot. now that would be a secure system :D |
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Dec 26 2005, 04:09 PM
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#20
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 909 Joined: 26-August 05 From: Louisville, KY (Well, Memphis, IN technically but you won't know where that is.) Member No.: 7,626 |
Yes, because during a run every security force you face will have voice modulators and, in the course of a firefight, the time and inclination to copy your voice. Do a risk/benefit analysis using unarmed mini drones: Benefit: expendable scouts, extra set of "eyes", could be equipped with alternate sensors Risk: the drones may be used to gather information above and beyond my general location and the existence of drones. Chance of failure: Low. If the enemy compromises my comm system/voice commands they have spent time they could have used to kill me breaking my systems to gain control of unarmed systems. The information they gain is likely non-critical to the success/failure of the mission. Plus, if I am using my drone's sensors (via imagelink) I will notice if the drone suddenly starts scanning my group, providing information the comm net has been hacked. The risk goes up if you get the flashpack/smokegrenade iBall but you can a) install a manual safety on it so the drone can't fire them until armed or b) configure the drone to require passwords to un/lock the weapons (I don't want my drones firing flashpacks willy-nilly). I'm assuming only a rigger will bother with drones with firearms or even the "small" drones with more extensive sensor packs given the expense. |
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Dec 26 2005, 04:23 PM
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#21
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 7,089 Joined: 4-October 05 Member No.: 7,813 |
well, at that point you may as well just use RFIDs, IMO.
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Dec 26 2005, 04:30 PM
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#22
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Neophyte Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,174 Joined: 13-May 04 From: UCAS Member No.: 6,327 |
Argh, all this talk has made me think of K-9 who'll follow the runners around, taking orders literally and having sensors and a frigging laser in its nose... :silly: Anyway, seriously, I can see huge benefits for characters to use a simple iball drone for seeing what's around the corner and you can just leave it off until you need it. As kigmatzomat mentioned about risk/benefit, I think the benefit is much more than the risk. Though, it's probably best to only use it sparingly. |
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Dec 26 2005, 04:37 PM
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#23
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Hoppelhäschen 5000 Group: Members Posts: 5,807 Joined: 3-January 04 Member No.: 5,951 |
If you want to monitor things happening in 3m range as long as you stay in a 40m range... |
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Dec 27 2005, 11:43 AM
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#24
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 135 Joined: 30-July 04 From: Orebro, Sweden Member No.: 6,523 |
There is absolutley no reason for a runner _not_ to have 1-2 MCfly spy drones with diffrent sensor sets.. they cost about 3-4k a pop.. hardly expensive and they are sooooo helpful.. =)
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Dec 27 2005, 01:59 PM
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#25
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 751 Joined: 7-June 02 From: Hamilton.LTG.on.ca Member No.: 2,853 |
In SR-4 i'm going to try to make a charater that is very versitile, but not every one is going to use a drone.
Thats why groups should make a well rounded team. |
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