Magical Threats, Mundane ways to take em out? Options

[Apathy]

Ever since SR4 came out I've been reading threads about how powerful magic is. It seems like there are a lot of critters out there that can only be hurt by magic, but there's pretty much nothing out there that can resist the mage by gets sliced and diced by the samurai.

• Regenerating creatures bounce right back from physical attacks, but go down vs spell attacks like a blonde on prom night.
• High force spirits are basically immune to firearms, but just as vulnerable to spells as anyone else.

My problem with this is that if a high force spirit shows up the sammy's got to just sit on his hands and wait for the mage to fix it.

Has anybody thought about making the following changes in their games?

• Regeneration works against magic damage, but at only half effectiveness (i.e. need two successes for every box healed)
• Bring back Will+Charisma attacks to bypass Spirit Immunity to Normal Weapons

Is this a good idea, or a bad idea? Has anybody tried it?

[fistandantilus4....]

With a Sam, you can always try the whole 'escalated response'. Assault Rifle didn't work? Time to pull out the Assault CANNON. But in the end, let's remember that they are spirits, they aren't people. There is no reason that you should be able to shoot a spirit/ghost. So be happy with what you get, life isn't always fair.

I do personally like the contest of Will though.Not sure how viable it is though, since attributes are harder to get. What would you roll, Will+cha for the attack, Will/2 (like with melee, but will) for the damage?

[nick012000]

[fistandantilus4....]

good call, sounds like good reasoning. Does the astral combat skill required being awakened? I would assume that it would, but I just thought I'd check, since drugs like deepweed and astral shallows can make mundaes astrally percieve, and therefore capable of practicing/learning a skill.

So there you go. If you run in to a spirit, take deep weed.

[nick012000]

[fistandantilus4....]

sorry, isn't that the effect of Deepweed, making mundanes astrally percieve?

[nick012000]

No, deepweed forces the Awakened to astrally perceive, even if they normally lack the ability.

[hyzmarca]

Drones and vehicles resist the mage but get sliced and diced by the samurai.

[MaxMahem]

[nick012000]

But the Sam will be packing grenades, and can chunky salsa the vehicle into schrapnel. Just roll the grenade under the undercarriage...

[Crusher Bob]

Yes, so notice the typical system problem of things that have hardened armor either laugh at the attack or explode into bloody chunks, there is usually no middle ground.

[Shadowmeet]

Personally, I've always enjoyed the idea of a Talismonger enchanting bullets for a group.
It's another kind of high priced ammo, very expensive, and lots of fun.

I tend to have people go down that road.

[Moon-Hawk]

Are you talking about using bullets as expendable anchoring foci?

[Shadowmeet]

I've done the expendable anchoring foci

I've also, at another time, ruled that the Talismongers made the bullets out of strange materials, carved them with runes, and basically made the bullets into a sort of Expendable Mini Weapon Focus.

It was a house rule, but it worked well, and the players, both mages and sams, enjoyed it.

[Crusher Bob]

If your game is of a more humorous bent, he takes genetically altered mice (that have human DNA added) infects them with some strain of HMVV, lets then get really hungry, them puts them into the anti-spirit mouse gun, which then fires them off at the offending spirit. Hopefully the mouse gun fires the mice fast enough so that they die on impact (and you don’t have to dealt with Return of the Vampire Mice, Part Two) but the fraction of a second they survive while impacting the spirit gives it a world of hurt.

[Azralon]

Lessee if I remember my SR3 anchoring focus rules.

Virginal telesma (lead + orichalcum slug) with a touch-range Detect Spirits in the trigger event and the touch-range version of Slay Spirit as the effect.

Of course, at that point it's almost more efficient to just manually throw the whole clip at the bugger without even bothering with the firearm itself.

[Moon-Hawk]

[Azralon]

I don't remember anchoring foci causing drain upon use. Wasn't that one of the benefits?

[Moon-Hawk]

[Shadowmeet]

Sorry, I should have clarified.

Mine was a Talismonger house rule for 4th, not third.

[Azralon]

[Magus]

Just Keep a Ghoul on hand for the Troll Sammie to swing as a club!! (referencing old thread) The Ghoul is dual natured as is the spirit, instant Weapon Foci for the Mundane!! Hey- Hey!!

[Lagomorph]

One thing mundanes always have against mages is FAB

[RunnerPaul]

[Kerberos]