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Jackpoint, SR3 software suite

eidolon View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 07:21 AM Post #51
ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333	When purchasing gear, I ran into the following: When you input a new vehicle, there is no way to put in both handling ratings. The program will not allow a slash in the input box, so you can only put one or the other. Also, above the box, "handling" is spelled "handleing". The typo things are minor, to be sure, but I figure you'd want to know about them. Also, I continue to be amazed at the amount of detail and effort you put into this. It's fantastic. (And eventually, I'll get into the rest of the program. Right now I'm focusing on the character generator because I've been waiting for a decent, non spreadsheet character generator for a long time.)

eidolon View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 07:36 AM Post #52
ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333	ignore

eidolon View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 07:41 AM Post #53
ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333	It took me this long to see that one of the selections for "Character is" is "An Idiot." Don't change this. It's vital. :D Was it intentional for the program to "warn" me that the character doesn't have an adrenal pump every time I mark damage? (Honestly, I would think that not having one is more a rule than an exception.) Gotta hit the sack now. I'll mess with it more over the week.

Snowduck View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 12:16 PM Post #54
Target Group: Members Posts: 1 Joined: 13-February 06 Member No.: 8,257	Wonderfull, awesome program! :love: Shadowrun is such a complex, time-consuming system to play that we really need to design programs like yours to speed up the gameplay. I particularly enjoy the automated perception tjecks and the combat maps. I intend to test out the program with my group in 2-3 weeks. I have a 15.4" laptop that I can use to show the combat map to my players. It's gonna be great! :D I detected a few flaws. * Force 4 Air elementals do not have 27 ini dice. ;) * When you mark damage the program complains that the selected character do not have a adrenal pump. * The program does not compute reaction ratings acurately. * When you roll a closed test roll, the rule of 6 is not applied. I have a few suggestions. * The perception test box does not allow different t# for different characters due to low-light, thermografic etc. It would be nice if you could define vision type/ hearing amps etc. when you create the character. * It would be nice if you could include an input box in the perception test box for a custom t# * The combat map is wonderfull, but we need a little more features * zoom in/out * the god/bad guy markers need to have something that shows what direction the character is facing. * a range ruler, so you can tjeck the range from one person to another * If you could make the good guy/ bad guy markers skinnable it would be awesome!! I can contribute with icons if you want it. * We need a few vehicle markers. You are the man! :cyber:

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 03:05 PM

Post #55

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QUOTE (Taran @ Feb 12 2006, 06:46 PM)

In the GM Console, under "Character Stats", the 'clone' button should reselect the character cloned, so that it's possible to (say) generate six identical gangers by pressing 'clone' six times, rather than having to go back and reselect the original ganger by hand each time.

excellent point...i will definitely fix that.

QUOTE (Taran @ Feb 12 2006, 06:46 PM)

Also, how do you give an NPC combat pool? My cloned adepts all showed up with a combat pool of zero, and I couldn't figure out how to give them any. Clicking the little arrows did nothing.

you can't at the moment. reason being that i didn't make the character updater yet because i wanted to use the character creator as my foundation - but i wanted to have you guys test the creator first and weed out all bugs before i then copy it and modify it to be the updater. and again, sorry for only 1/2 creating 1 sample character...i just didn't have time or energy to do more for the beta release.

QUOTE (Taran @ Feb 12 2006, 06:46 PM)

The security system creator seems fine. Fewer lines of defense than something I'd write by hand, but since those defenses have to be aware of one another that's a bit outside the scope of a random generator.

i'm glad to hear it seems to work ok. i do want to expand it later, but i figured this was a good start.

QUOTE (Taran @ Feb 12 2006, 06:46 PM)

The magical group generator is great.

good :)

QUOTE (Taran @ Feb 12 2006, 06:46 PM)

Why is it irreversible to buy knowledge points?...

lazyness. i will come up with a purchace/spend back system for both.

QUOTE (Taran @ Feb 12 2006, 06:46 PM)

It's friggin' awesome.

thanks :)

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 03:23 PM

Post #56

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QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 12 2006, 09:48 PM)

I seem to have found a fairly nasty bug.

I'm trying to create a full shaman. I set the attributes, make him a full shaman using the drop down, and then start picking skills. This is where I run into the bug.

When I try to give him Sorcery, the box pops up asking me what rating I want it at. When I click a rating and hit okay, it adds "Sorcery/Knowledge/(blank)" to the skills list, and the "pick a rating" box comes right back up. (It charges you build points twice in the process.) When I pick a rating, I get the following error message:...

i know exactly why this happened, and i will go through the database again (i've done it once already) to find any other occurrences of this flaw.

the 'Sorcery' skill is in the database twice, once as an active skill and once as a knowledge skill. 2 skills cannot have the same name...'Sorcery' the knowledge skill needs to be changed to 'Sorcery Background', or something that is more appropriate to what it is. (i can only assume for now that i meant for it to be the background skill)

QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 12 2006, 09:48 PM)

Oh, also, found another typo. In the drop-down for selecting type of magician, Adept is spelled Adapt twice. ;)

adapt :upsidedown: that's funny - i'll change it. and just keep pointing out those misspellings 'cus i'm sure there's a lot of 'em.

QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 12 2006, 09:48 PM)

Still loving it.

good :)

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 03:40 PM

Post #57

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QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 12 2006, 11:39 PM)

New ?bug?.

I got this error message, the gist of which was that it couldn't find the file "Jackpoint>JPFs>DBs>Stuff.xml"

I got to looking, and it appears that nearly every file was installed with the extention ".jpf". I backed up the Stuff.jpf file in another folder, and renamed the original to "Stuff.xml" and it fixed the problem.

I'm wondering if everything is supposed to be an xml file? Right now, I'm just going to keep playing with things until I get bugs and see if I can't figure out how to work around them.

I guess my main question regarding this one is how is everything supposed to look when installed? What are the various files supposed to be? (as in XML, JPF, etc.) Should I just rename everything as XML files? And if so, any clues as to why it would have installed everything so wonky? I'm wondering if it's just my machine.

at which point in the program did you run into this message?

everything in the 'JPFs' folder is supposed to be .jpf - everything in the 'GMFs' folder should be .gmf

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 03:42 PM

Post #58

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QUOTE (Jrayjoker @ Feb 12 2006, 10:45 PM)

Can't get it to load on any of my machines, I am sad.

AMDs, WinXP Pro and home.

I can't help but feel I am missing out.

aw crap!

i'll see if i can track down an AMD box to test it on. any chance you can tell me exactly what happens when you try to install?

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 03:43 PM

Post #59

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QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 12 2006, 11:54 PM)

New bug.

I added the edge "Bonus Charisma Point", but then decided that I'd rather the character have a bonus intelligence point, so I removed "Charisma Point". However, when I tried to then give him the bonus intelligence point, it gave me a dialog box that said "You have already used the Bonus Attribute Edge to raise an attribute above it's limit" and wouldn't let me do it.

ok - this one's fixable too...by rules, you can use the bonus attribute edge to raise one (and only one) of your attributes above it's normal limit. i have a flag in the program that gets 'checked' when someone does raise one attribute over it's normal limit, so that they cannot do it again on another...i guess i missed 'unchecking' this flag when removing the bonus attribute edge that raised it.

QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 12 2006, 11:54 PM)

New bug.

Before I describe it, I should note that this only comes up when you try to use the program in a manner other than intended: typing things directly in rather than selecting them through buttons. Therefore, it isn't so much a bug as something you might want to consider making impossible to do. You'll see why:

Under edges and flaws: You can type in anything you like into the boxes (this isn't the bug). For example, I typed in "Cool Hair Cut" and gave it a value of 5.

First part of bug: When I assign a typed in value to something, it doesn't reflect in the "points left" box.

Second part: Then, I highlighted Cool Hair Cut and hit "Remove". When I removed it, it gave me 5 free build points. :) Munchkins are gonna love this. SHHHHHHH, don't tell them.

the reason i didn't make all the tables read-only was that some of them have notes fields that i wanted people to be able to use for adding notes. i can see now i'm going to have find another solution.

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 03:52 PM

Post #60

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QUOTE (eidolon)

This seems to be more stylistic than anything, but when buying cyber, if you select something at alpha, and the math causes it to be a repeating number (my alpha headware 200MP ended up being .6666666666666666667 E, for example) it actually carries it out for several decimals before rounding. I don't know if this is intentional for calculation purposes, unintentional but does factor in to the calculations, or something that could be limited without any effect.

i will look at that - thanks!

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 03:53 PM

Post #61

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QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 13 2006, 01:21 AM)

When purchasing gear, I ran into the following:

When you input a new vehicle, there is no way to put in both handling ratings. The program will not allow a slash in the input box, so you can only put one or the other.

ok, i knew i'd miss something with either adding cyberdecks or vehicles...i created those input windows at the last minute and i knew i'd mess something up. i'll fix it.

QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 13 2006, 01:21 AM)

Also, above the box, "handling" is spelled "handleing".

The typo things are minor, to be sure, but I figure you'd want to know about them.

i do want to know about every last one.

QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 13 2006, 01:21 AM)

Also, I continue to be amazed at the amount of detail and effort you put into this. It's fantastic.

(And eventually, I'll get into the rest of the program. Right now I'm focusing on the character generator because I've been waiting for a decent, non spreadsheet character generator for a long time.)

:oops: and with everyone's help pointing out my mistakes, this will hopefully be a 'decent' program suite.

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 03:58 PM

Post #62

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QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 13 2006, 01:41 AM)

It took me this long to see that one of the selections for "Character is" is "An Idiot."

Don't change this. It's vital. :D

;)

QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 13 2006, 01:41 AM)

Was it intentional for the program to "warn" me that the character doesn't have an adrenal pump every time I mark damage? (Honestly, I would think that not having one is more a rule than an exception.)

nope - another bug...it checks every character to see if they have one, so it can turn it on if they do (since pain activates it)...but it's only supposed to warn you that they don't have one if you try and check the 'Pumping Adrenalen' box under 'Character is:' and they don't have one.

QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 13 2006, 01:41 AM)

...I'll mess with it more over the week.

good - please do...i obviously need the help!

eidolon View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 03:59 PM Post #63
ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333	Gotta head to work right now, I'll see if I can duplicate that error this afternoon and I'll let you know where it hits.

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 04:01 PM

Post #64

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QUOTE (eidolon @ Feb 13 2006, 09:59 AM)

Gotta head to work right now, I'll see if I can duplicate that error this afternoon and I'll let you know where it hits.

cool - thanks

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 04:09 PM

Post #65

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QUOTE (Snowduck @ Feb 13 2006, 06:16 AM)

...a few flaws
1. Force 4 Air elementals do not have 27 ini dice. ;)
2. When you mark damage the program complains that the selected character do not have a adrenal pump.
3. The program does not compute reaction ratings acurately.
4. When you roll a closed test roll, the rule of 6 is not applied.

1. you are correct - i'll look at that.
2. eidolon also pointed this out...i'll look at that too.
3. any chance you could provide an example or 2 of what the attributes where and what the incorect reaction came to be?
4. isn't that correct? a closed test roll should not apply the rule of 6, and an open test should. (hence the reason it's 'open')

QUOTE (Snowduck @ Feb 13 2006, 06:16 AM)

...a few suggestions.
1. The perception test box does not allow different t# for different characters due to low-light, thermografic etc. It would be nice if you could define vision type/ hearing amps etc. when you create the character.

2. The combat map is wonderfull, but we need a little more features
A. zoom in/out
B. the god/bad guy markers need to have something that shows what direction the character is facing.
C. a range ruler, so you can tjeck the range from one person to another
D. If you could make the good guy/ bad guy markers skinnable it would be awesome!! I can contribute with icons if you want it.
E. We need a few vehicle markers.

1. it does actually. you probably didn't get the users guide (which i meant to include in the download and didn't :dead: ), so i'll explain:

if you are making a vision test and the character has low-light (for example), then select said character and then click on "Augmented Vision" and then on "Low-Light Vision" under the heading "Per-Character Modifiers"...this will apply the correct modifiers to that person only.

i didn't add hearing amp to the sound test because i didn't see it in the table of perception test modifiers in SR3...i'll look into that.

2. the map is rather complex...i'm not sure how much i'll be able to do with it in the future, but i do want to make it as flexable as i can. (i.e. i don't know if skins and zooming will be possible)

E. the vehicle markers idea is a great one!

C. would you need a range ruler if you knew that 1 space is 2 meters? i meant to put something like "1 block = 2 meters" on the screen somewhere, but forgot.

B. and i do want to make the markers rotateable to show better direction.

QUOTE (Snowduck @ Feb 13 2006, 06:16 AM)

Wonderfull, awesome program! :love: Shadowrun is such a complex, time-consuming system to play that we really need to design programs like yours to speed up the gameplay. I particularly enjoy the automated perception tjecks and the combat maps. I intend to test out the program with my group in 2-3 weeks. I have a 15.4" laptop that I can use to show the combat map to my players. It's gonna be great! :D

thank you :)

i'm starting my first programing job today :talker: with the excitement of that and all of this talk about the bugs in my system, i may just have Beta2 ready by the time you meet with your group.

craigpierce View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 04:47 PM Post #66
Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 398 Joined: 25-August 04 From: Denver, CO Member No.: 6,599	a big thank you to everyone for jumping in on the testing so far (especially eidolon). i want you all to know that the amount of participation has reenergized my enthusiasm for Jackpoint. i was honestly worried about walking into the SR3-program world under mcmackie's shadow, but the support so far has been great. really, i think it may have just been my code-fried brain bringing me down last week :) i expect to begin work on fixes/upgrades soon...if not this week, then this coming weekend for sure. so please, keep the bug reports/suggestions coming! it's apparently fuel for my fire :spin: p.s. i've got to get ready for work before i'm late my first day :dead: - i'll add all the bugs to the known-bugs list in the first post as soon as i can.

Jrayjoker

Feb 13 2006, 05:06 PM

Post #67

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QUOTE (archimagus)

QUOTE (Jrayjoker @ Feb 12 2006, 10:45 PM)

Can't get it to load on any of my machines, I am sad.

AMDs, WinXP Pro and home.

I can't help but feel I am missing out.

aw crap!

i'll see if i can track down an AMD box to test it on. any chance you can tell me exactly what happens when you try to install?

I'll work on it, I do know that the .net stuff downloaded fine, but when I ran the program it said something like, "can't download the application," or something like that.

I will give you more exact information in the following days.

Thanks.

Tanka View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 05:11 PM Post #68
Chrome to the Core Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,152 Joined: 14-October 03 From: ::1 Member No.: 5,715	Did you have an active firewall that could've blocked the program? Try running it as an Administrator (if you aren't one) and with the firewall turned down/off. That seems to fix a lot of installation problems that I've had.

Jrayjoker

Feb 13 2006, 06:30 PM

Post #69

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QUOTE (tanka)

Did you have an active firewall that could've blocked the program?

Try running it as an Administrator (if you aren't one) and with the firewall turned down/off.

That seems to fix a lot of installation problems that I've had.

Yeah, I use the windows firewall, but the stuff from .Net should be trusted (accepted certificates and all that) and I run as administrator. I will play around with it and see what is what later in the week.

:silly: If it isn't reproducable outside my little network I will put on a dunce cap and do a happy dance, all the while declaring my ignorance of all things computer. :silly:

Tanka View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 06:40 PM Post #70
Chrome to the Core Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,152 Joined: 14-October 03 From: ::1 Member No.: 5,715	Well, good luck to you. It really is a wonderful tool. Once it gets out of beta, I'll be spreading the word all over the place.

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 07:16 PM

Post #71

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QUOTE (tanka @ Feb 13 2006, 12:40 PM)

It really is a wonderful tool. Once it gets out of beta, I'll be spreading the word all over the place.

:rollin:

it's nice to have that kind of support already!

craigpierce

Feb 13 2006, 07:19 PM

Post #72

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QUOTE (Jrayjoker)

I will play around with it and see what is what later in the week.

let me know what you find out!

in the meantime, i'm still gonna try to track down at least a non-intel PC to load it onto.

Tanka View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 07:48 PM Post #73
Chrome to the Core Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 3,152 Joined: 14-October 03 From: ::1 Member No.: 5,715	I'll try having one of my friends install it on his AMD system and let you know what comes of it.

Aku View Member Profile	Feb 13 2006, 08:45 PM Post #74
Running, running, running Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 2,220 Joined: 18-October 04 From: North Carolina Member No.: 6,769	following instructions helps too. it wasnt until i actually read the directions i realized it wants to be installed in a particular place. is there any chance that can be changed?

Tanka

Feb 13 2006, 08:48 PM

Post #75

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QUOTE (Aku)

following instructions helps too. it wasnt until i actually read the directions i realized it wants to be installed in a particular place. is there any chance that can be changed?

*facepalm*

I'd like to see that implemented too. I tend to install things to /bin/ (yes, on an XP system) simply because /Program Files/ is where I normally leave Windows things to do their business.

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