[X] My Assistant

[Entropy Kid]

[Kagetenshi]

Ah. I'd somehow managed to miss that note.

~J

[Cain]

The RAS override is the key difference, I think. As Entropy kid pointed out, most simsense devices have one built in, to prevent people from moving around while using simsense. That seems to lend credence to the theory that ASIST usage overrides the existing senses.

Meanwhile, Kagetenshi managed to hit my other points. If you're watching a silent TV show on your plasma-screen TV, you're still recieving a sound channel, it's just blank. If you're looking at something that has no audio/olfactory/tactile data, that doesn't mean that you're not using the bandwith to recive all that data; it's just that those signals are idle.

[BlackSmith]

i was a sec worried here...
like sai RAS overrides (shuts down) your muscle nerves to prevent you walking around the house while in matrix but nothing more.
ASIST handels the sense feed but it does not interact with your muscle system. your brain sends a message to punch and in matrix you hit the IC but without the RAS your hitting the wall at home at the same time, because of the ASIST you wont feel the pain&broken bones from your hand.

and i was never saying that every thing DOES have a taste/other sensation.
if it has but you are laking it, you are not geting the full 100% effect thus you cant work with full 100% to the situtaion.

IF it would be something else than "all or nothing" how effective it would be then?
because without the direct neural feed you are turning some of your sense "cool" to get the same data.

replacing your limited simring with ASIST might work but then you need modifications or othervise you would only feel what the gun "feels" or what you feel.
limited simsense enables you to feel both at the same time.

who said this conversation is hypothetical?
every one here has experienced ASIST.
no im not kiding.
now your using your eyes to read this and using your ears to hear that music.
3.. 2... 1...
your a sleep.
you dream about having PERFECT sex with a PERFECT woman.
...while eyes are seeing compleat black, all images are feed directly from your imagination to your experience system, specialy to your sight/touch/sound/smell.
you still move yourself but your SENSES are overriden by the dream.
moving your hand/taking a leak/farting is NOT a sense. touching/smelling/hearing something IS.

..and thats the wonderfull world of ASIST.
thanks for your attention.
next time put your RAS on so you might have dry pants.

[Siege]

ASIST is technology used to convert, communicate or interpret signals based on organic perceptions.

So no, this discussion is very hypothetical unless you're admitting to having cyber-augments.

-Siege

[BlackSmith]

... convert, communicate or interpret signals based on organic perceptions.

your memory is converted to something that you can feel and touch and taste while in sleep.

you got problem with cyber legs?

[Siege]

Sleep and dreaming are still organic processes -- ASIST might be a comparable parallel, but it's not the same thing.

And while modern prosthetics are marvels, cyberlegs they're not. Unless they've improved nerve-splicing and artificial stimulation while I wasn't looking.

Which, to be fair, is a distinct possibility.

-Siege

[BlackSmith]

ok.
im ready to hear your version of it.
if the way senses transport their info to brain and it is processed there has changed while i haven't looked i would like to hear your way then.

[Siege]

ASIST is artificial -- sleep is not.

-Siege

[BlackSmith]

and if you are in coma?

[BitBasher]

A coma is still your bodies own reaction to some abnormal stimulus.

Let's face it here, this is a GM's call because it isn't addressed either way in the rules. I lean twards no because ASIST is, by the acronm Artificial Sensory Input. It is actually injected senses.

[BlackSmith]

coma is artifical sleep.
you dont have brain activity but your body still reacts to sense impulses.

ASIST does just the opposite. shuts down senses and translates brain activity to data.

[CanvasBack]

Basically this is a discussion about simsense right? Because when it comes down to it, Deckers and and Riggers are having a simsense experience when they do what they do. The nature of their tasks and their hardware(plus software for deckers) pretty much dictacte what they get out of the experience. In either case, you're not going to be doing much else. Total immersion.

Think about the difference between regular sim-sense entertainment chips and BTLs. Certain governments have a problem with BTLS because their high sensory input can be very dangerous/addicting. They scale back the input, so that hopefully, after the experience is over you'll return to being a content SINner who pays his taxes instead of a crazy lunatic that's a drain on the system. Aside from the government, the only things limiting how much sensory information you get are the actual production qualities (How tricked out was the simrig the actor/actress was equipped with? How good was the sim-star?) and the quality of your own chipreader. The whole idea of chipping an experience is to sit back and enjoy the ride, even if you were able to, why would you want to get up and do other stuff? With BTL's it's pretty much impossible anyway. Again, Total Immersion. But it's scalable.

On the other hand, with a datajack you can jack into your car or truck, and have access to a virtual dashboard that will allow for "hands free driving" without having to go all the way in and assume the body of the vehicle like a rigger with a VCR. Is the virtual dashboard simsense? It sort of has to be since it isn't actually there... Not Total Immersion.

So, for my 2 :nuyen: it all depends on the nature of the hardware. Simsense is a scalable technology that can work with other systems in some instances, but the normal use of it is a total immersion experience and too much input can fry your brain. :wobble:

[Kagetenshi]

It's simulated sense, but it isn't SimSense™.

~J

[Siege]

That's an interesting point:

What is the difference between "simulated sense" and "Simsense"?

The virtual dashboard only requires a datajack (or a trode rig) without the driver having an image link or a display link.

-Siege

[BitBasher]

Because the expensive datajack adaptation for the car already has an ASIST converter built in so you dont need a cyber one, thus allowing people with minimal cyber to use that interface. :D

EDIT: also IIRC the ASIST converter for a datajack just allows UMC code fromt he matrix, which is not actually an ASIST feed, to be converted to an ASIST feed for the user to interface with. This is needed because when jacking into a Cyberdeck, Remote Deck, Vehicle with adapter, or SimChip The incoming signal is already an ASIST signal that the barin can interpret via datajack. In the case of decking like an Otaku, the Matrix signal is not natively ASIST, normally your deck interprets it into that. Its naturally just data your mind cannot interpret, thats what the ASIST converter does in that sense.

That word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

[Kagetenshi]

"Simulated sense": sight is a sense. The datajack port is overlaying sights that aren't there.

~J

[Arz]

I think this topic is fast broadening over it's stated intent. So I'll add more.

Many of the tasks that you are talking about have little to do with the intent of the very vague device, ASIST Converter, which is intended solely for otaku much the same as the Memory Stimulator for cyber-zombies.

I agree that these tasks should be accomplished through ASIST but honestly feel that you should work on your own original implants to do them.

Along these lines I've been tinkering with a redesign similar to the Smartlink component breakdown for the implants for decking, rigging, and simsense. I'll post my old notes if anyone wants them.

I think many of your concerns should be covered in another SOTA book that isn't just a reprint of old ideas. Shadowrun needs to move forward.

[Siege]

ARGH! "Princess Bride" quotes where one doesn't expect to find "Princess Bride" quotes!

Ok, so the technology does exist for this "virtual sense" to be accessed through either a datajack or a trode rig.

And this signal can be highly specific -- in the example, the car "virtual dashboard" without including things like the car's emotional context at the time.

So the answer is essentially, yes: you can replace the image link/display link with external hardware routed through either a datajack or a trode rig.

-Siege