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> Paranoia evolved.
emo samurai
post Mar 13 2006, 06:50 PM
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A mage runner could just find a random apartment somewhere, go to the basement, dig into the wall, and make his own little hobbit-hole that no one but a mage that finds his astral signature could get into. He doesn't even need to ward the place or pay rent; no one knows that he's even there, and no one could find his place with astral projection or Search because it's in the middle of the earth. If there are people on the other side, he'll just tunnel his way out into another basement or something.

I also realized something. Each spell gives the mage, like, one X-Men power that they can basically use at will. That's insanely awesome.
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Apathy
post Mar 13 2006, 07:11 PM
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I'm sure I don't get what your trying to say here:
QUOTE
go to the basement, dig into the wall, and make his own little hobbit-hole

digging into the basement wall of a building in the middle of the sprawl has a high probability of

  • cave-ins
  • hitting power/water/telecom/sewage lines (resulting in giving away your presence, electrocution, drowning, additional chances of cave-ins, or just general gross-ness.)
  • creating structural weaknesses in the building above you.

QUOTE
that no one but a mage that finds his astral signature could get into.

The superintendent is likely to notice a big gaping hole beside the boiler. If you're planning to hide the entrance with magic, then the spell would have to be anchored or quickened in order to keep it up all the time requiring initiation and karma sunk into the spell. Even then, the presence of the spell would be obvious to any searching hearth spirit, unless the entrance was also warded with a masking ward (requiring additional initiation.)

Ignoring all this, he's still stuck living in an unfinished dirty hole-in-the-wall, with no running water, no toilet, no lights, no heat... He'd be better off just summoning a spirit to conceal him at the beginning of each night, and sleeping in the lobby.
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emo samurai
post Mar 13 2006, 07:16 PM
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Can't you just cast the spell again to put the wall back?
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Brahm
post Mar 13 2006, 07:21 PM
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Cement yourself into a hole the the ground? I guess you could create some sort of spell to do that. You still can be found by astral search though since you have created a hole in the giasphere. Unless you have also brought along a rebreather, have an appropriate spell, or somehow otherwise deal with the lack of fresh air you might as well have hidden by sticking your head in a plastic bag. ;)
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emo samurai
post Mar 13 2006, 07:58 PM
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They can find the hole in the gaiasphere even though it's hidden deep within solid astral matter? You could also have a quickened oxygenate spell on the hole or something. Which would also be hidden by being buried in dirt. I'm also assuming that you could just haul in building materials and reinforce the hole that way. Or you could build your hole somewhere outside city limits and reinforce the walls with shaped concrete.
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FrankTrollman
post Mar 13 2006, 08:06 PM
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Astral Search doesn't literally involve the spirit running around looking for stuff - that's just Astral Movement. The Search power involves the creature standing in one place concentrating until they know where the object is.

So impenetrable astral stuff being between the spirit and the target is useless against Search. An astral barrier disturbs the mana flow and hinders Search, but just hiding in a bubble suurounded by Earth is no defense at all.

-Frank
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emo samurai
post Mar 13 2006, 08:11 PM
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So a ward that costs nothing but time would stop the search? There are still huge benefits to hiding in a well-furnished earth-bubble. And you could always have an earth and water spirit to work together to divert a spring toward you.
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Brahm
post Mar 13 2006, 08:18 PM
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QUOTE (emo samurai @ Mar 13 2006, 02:58 PM)
They can find the hole in the gaiasphere even though it's hidden deep within solid astral matter? You could also have a quickened oxygenate spell on the hole or something. Which would also be hidden by being buried in dirt. I'm also assuming that you could just haul in building materials and reinforce the hole that way. Or you could build your hole somewhere outside city limits and reinforce the walls with shaped concrete.

You punched a hole in the gaiasphere. The concrete isn't part of the gaiasphere. Trying to backfill dirt? There isn't really any canon that I know of that talks about fill back in manmade holes in the gaiasphere and how long that takes to reestablish on the astral. It could take a while, hard to say.

Besides I really don't get what you want to accomplish? A secure safe place to stay on the cheap? A Fortress of Solitude that is a Street Lifestyle? Because you are talking about a lot of hassle for something that isn't really going to get you much more than just not doing stupid stuff to have people hunting you down.
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mfb
post Mar 13 2006, 08:23 PM
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QUOTE (emo samurai)
There are still huge benefits to hiding in a well-furnished earth-bubble. And you could always have an earth and water spirit to work together to divert a spring toward you.

if the mage were paranoid, and didn't value physical socialization, this would be workable. the kind of life you're talking about, though, is worse than most first-world prisons. there'd have to be something wrong with your wiring to want that kind of life.
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emo samurai
post Mar 13 2006, 11:05 PM
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Most first-world prisons don't let you roam free. If he just slept there and didn't spend much time in his earth bubble, that would be okay. If he had a separate place to play video games, store his stuff, and cook, that would probably not add to his "on the radar" rating much, if at all. This is just a good place to avoid having someone knife you in your sleep and stay away from organized crime.
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nick012000
post Mar 14 2006, 12:13 AM
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Two words: Bomb shelter. The only place to live for the truly paranoid.
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Shrike30
post Mar 14 2006, 12:45 AM
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Two words popped into my head when I read this: Saddam Hussein.

QUOTE
If he had a separate place to play video games, store his stuff, and cook, that would probably not add to his "on the radar" rating much, if at all.
I guess that all depends on how much time he's gonna spend playing video games.
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Dashifen
post Mar 14 2006, 12:50 AM
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QUOTE (Shrike30)
Two words popped into my head when I read this: Saddam Hussein.

QUOTE
If he had a separate place to play video games, store his stuff, and cook, that would probably not add to his "on the radar" rating much, if at all.
I guess that all depends on how much time he's gonna spend playing video games.

And if the video games are online, now we have a datatrail.
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emo samurai
post Mar 14 2006, 12:51 AM
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He'll spend, like, 80% of his waking hours away from his hole. Plus, this is a great way to stash the group's weaponry. Assuming the hole stays up.
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Lagomorph
post Mar 14 2006, 01:19 AM
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Shape change into a man-turtle, learn kung-fu and live in the sewer. I think thats the most simple solution.

Actually, I was going to say that my mage lived in a painfully bland box apartment building. It was so manufactured that it had background count, making it unpleasent for astral people.

This post has been edited by Lagomorph: Mar 14 2006, 01:21 AM
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emo samurai
post Mar 14 2006, 02:20 AM
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Ow. You can do that? I thought magic was supposed to make your life more transcendent.
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mfb
post Mar 14 2006, 03:55 AM
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QUOTE (emo samurai)
He'll spend, like, 80% of his waking hours away from his hole. Plus, this is a great way to stash the group's weaponry. Assuming the hole stays up.

all an enemy mage has to do is track the guy astrally when he's not at home (which, like you said, would be a lot of the time), and then follow him.
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emo samurai
post Mar 14 2006, 04:13 AM
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Could my player anchor a ward onto an article of clothing?
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Dissonance
post Mar 14 2006, 04:16 AM
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I am under the impression that wards are immobile.
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emo samurai
post Mar 14 2006, 04:25 AM
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All the RAW says is that it has to be linked to an object. It says that "a ward cannot be moved from its physical component to another location." But if it's still with its physical component, then I don't see the problem if the physical component's carried.
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Brahm
post Mar 14 2006, 09:47 AM
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QUOTE (emo samurai @ Mar 13 2006, 11:25 PM)
All the RAW says is that it has to be linked to an object. It says that "a ward cannot be moved from its physical component to another location." But if it's still with its physical component, then I don't see the problem if the physical component's carried.

Next step, grasshopper, is to argue that you can ward bullets to use them to negate Immunity to Normal Weapons of a spirit or to shoot astral only beings. ;)
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Ranneko
post Mar 14 2006, 12:40 PM
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You can ward something like a car, or a van, something with rigid, enclosed sides and structure.

Clothing moves around a fair bit, and alters shape too much.
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The Jopp
post Mar 14 2006, 12:47 PM
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QUOTE (Ranneko)
You can ward something like a car, or a van, something with rigid, enclosed sides and structure.

Clothing moves around a fair bit, and alters shape too much.

So then we ward a helmet and headbutt spirits. :rotfl:
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Crusher Bob
post Mar 14 2006, 12:50 PM
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Here is the previous thread about the uses and abuses of wards. :(
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Dissonance
post Mar 14 2006, 07:07 PM
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Thanks, folks. At the time I saw the reply, I was too tired and wasn't nearly drunk enough to argue that kind of logic.
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