 Shadowrun . . . alas, it fades |
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 May 15 2006, 02:31 AM
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#76
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 355 Joined: 24-August 02 From: Magna, Ute Nation Member No.: 3,166  |
BESM has a tri-stat and a D20 also. I don't know about how different they are, I only play tri-stat. So, they're different "editions" then, huh? |
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May 15 2006, 02:51 AM
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#77
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
You'd have to have beer on tap and free hookers (and quality ones; none of those cheap $20 trash, or your sister) to get me to sit at any table you were at. You'd then have to cut your tongue out to get me to stay. At that point you could decide to use whatever rules you wanted, I'd just drink, "socialize", and generally ignore both you and the game. 8) |
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May 15 2006, 03:08 AM
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#78
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
You suggest staffing up. Where do you expect the money to come from? If you think that FanPro would see two or three times the sales by bringing out all the books at once (faster than D&D 3e) instead of over a range of time similar to SR3 then you are seriously delusional. You might get an initial surge somewhat higher than just releasing one book, but you'll see trailing off. Meanwhile you now have 2 or 3 times the payroll to feed. So you what? Turf these guys you just hired on and got up to speed? |
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May 15 2006, 03:09 AM
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#79
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
Snow Fox: I'm getting at least 4 hours a day, I promise. I'm actually crunching hard to finish the new Classic BattleTech core book, as it's being printed overseas, so it needs to go to press before the end of the month.
Yes. There are only two books that are available for both BESM Tri-Stat [second edition] and BESM d20, and those are Centauri Knights and Uresia, both setting books with minimal game mechanics content. In terms of original content, the BESM Second Edition line was more or less stagnant by the time BESM d20 came out ... I think the only non-licensed BESM Tri-Stat book that came out after BESM d20 was BESM Space Fantasy. There were also a couple licensed anime books [Hellsing and Trigun] that shared the same source material, but had rules/stats for each system, and a series of licensed anime books [Slayers] that had Tri-Stat and d20 versions that were entirely different, even the source material. [I worked for Guardians of Order full-time for about two years, from late 2002 to late 2004, which is why I can remember all this stuff just like I was there -- because I was. ;)] |
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May 15 2006, 03:13 AM
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#80
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
Woo hoo! There's no chance blakkie will ever come to one of my gaming sessions! Scratch that one off the nightmares list. Whew! :grinbig: Out of curiosity, what's so wrong with you that you'd have to get high priced hookers drunk to get some? I mean apart from your social and intellectual autism? -zing!- |
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May 15 2006, 03:22 AM
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#81
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
"Zing"? :/ |
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May 15 2006, 03:30 AM
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#82
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
Sorry, I suppose that flew over your intellectual radar.
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=zing Look at the third block, first definition. If you need any of the bigger words explained I'l be happy to help. :) |
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May 15 2006, 03:33 AM
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#83
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
Admin post: Both of you will be zinging and zanging while I'm banning if this continues.
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May 15 2006, 03:45 AM
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#84
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
Sorry, it was all meant in fun (hence the smileys).
Back on topic: It would be great if FP could hire a few temporary folks to push the product out the door. I know my group would snatch them up as quick as possible. And as long as the people hired knew it was a temporary contrctual gig there'd be no concerns of unfair practices or anything like that. But I'm from the software world, where about 1/3 of any given business can be short term contractors. I'm not sure if freelance writing works the same or not. |
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May 15 2006, 03:46 AM
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#85
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,589 Joined: 28-November 05 Member No.: 8,019 |
I'm sure that if it did, there'd be 300% more problems with canon.
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May 15 2006, 03:55 AM
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#86
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
Not as long as the final product was put through a rigorous approval process by the bigwigs in charge. Heck, even just a "this is how to convert stuff" and a "here are your 4 chapters" could speed the process up greatly by putting the tedious conversion process into other hands while the primary differences between the editions (major rules changes and unwired for example) were left in more canon-capable hands.
I know it won't happen though. It's just a dream of mine to be able to stroll into my FLGS and grab every Shadowrun book on the to be released list. :) |
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May 15 2006, 03:58 AM
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#87
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
FanPro does use freelancers for many tasks, just like most gaming companies do. That's what I am; I have no salary, no benefits, nobody buying me a new office chair when it breaks [which sucks, because I'd really like a new chair]. There are, however, only so many people that are willing to work for game industry rates that also possess the necessary understanding/skills in order to do the work.
You can't just add people and expect stuff to magically get done faster. As I'm sure you've seen in your field, sometimes adding people can actually make the process slower and lower quality, and some processes simply can't be sped up all that much [I'm thinking specifically of writing, which, if you speed up by adding multiple people, requires more time to edit/develop into a more cohesive whole, and playtesting, which, no matter how many playtest groups you have, will still take a certain number of weeks to do -- and the more playtesters you have, the more work it is to take the feedback and integrate it...] |
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May 15 2006, 04:21 AM
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#88
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Target Group: Members Posts: 58 Joined: 9-May 06 From: Right behind you! Member No.: 8,538 |
Brooks' law: adding more people to a late software project will only make it later. (Paraphrased: nine women cannot make one baby in one month). That applies to other kinds of projects, of course...
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May 15 2006, 05:48 AM
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#89
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 355 Joined: 24-August 02 From: Magna, Ute Nation Member No.: 3,166 |
Oh, you think SR has a low fan base. I see. I disagree, but then again, maybe I'm just "delusional". If they produced books faster, they would make profit faster. Get it? If you produced books and then stopped, you'd be correct. I'm talking about making books contantly, not stopping. Stopping production stops profits. Slow production = slow profits. Fast production = fast profits. That makes more sense. And besides, I've said it 3 times now, not my problem, I want my books now. |
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May 15 2006, 08:25 AM
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#90
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,314 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Lisbon, Cidade do Pecado Member No.: 185 |
Shadowrun does have a small fanbase, comparatively. There's a reason why, even with SR4, FanPro only climbed to 3rd in industry share last year (at least according to pundits). Compared to WotC and WW (together about 80% of the market), FanPro's SR market is small and print runs are planned accordingly. Furthermore your analysis is incorrect because it fails to take into account elements like distribution, store presence, or the target audience's acquisition rate and a number of other realities of the speciality publisher's market and the current state of the RPG industry. Releasing 1 book a month does not equate to 1 book on the shelves per month. Nor does it guarantee that "fast profits" since a) there is a time lapse between release and it showing up at the FLGS which is out of the publishers hands for the most part, and b) the fact that the book is on sale does not equate to immediate sales or even guaranteed sales. Having 2-3 books out in short order means you've got a significant amount of operational capital tied up in each which might or might not see fast returns. Ideally, FanPro would like to release 4-6 books a year, and that's what they'll be going for as soon as they get over the initial core book hump. |
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May 15 2006, 11:39 AM
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#91
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
I am aware of the word. I was just dismayed by you thinking that YOUR inability to read constituted a "zing". I don't know, maybe your post would have more traction if i didn't personally know autistic kids that are still too young for grade school that would give your reading comprehension a run for it's money inspite of their difficulties with some literary devices. :( Anyway, back to topic......
You wanting their books now is indeed your problem. :) Your simplistic model of everyone that normally buys SR books will buy whatever they put on the shelf. 12+ SR books per year @ $20-$30 a pop for an extended period? I don't spend $300/year on P&P in total, and certainly wouldn't. There might be a few "gotta catch them all" folks that might, but even among them a lot would become entirely disgusted by what they'd see as them being milked and step off the train entirely. I'm with you that i'd like to have seen Street Magic early. Probably by about 2 months ago. But i'm partially consoled to hear that at least part of the reason is that they are delayed is they are attempting to have all those *books work with each other before releasing the first one. |
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May 15 2006, 03:10 PM
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#92
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
4-6 Shadowrun titles, of course. Certainly more than 6 books on the overall FanPro schedule this year... :-) |
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May 15 2006, 03:32 PM
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#93
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 976 Joined: 16-September 04 From: Near my daughters, Lansdale PA Member No.: 6,668 |
I know where I work when they rush in new people I seem to spend most of my day correcting their problems. I think the complaint about the speed on the 4th ed is that they have planned the release poorly. That there are books they knew about needing. Books they could have had partially done when 4th ed came out, but did not.
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May 15 2006, 05:49 PM
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#94
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 355 Joined: 24-August 02 From: Magna, Ute Nation Member No.: 3,166 |
Well, if I have to wait this long for every book, maybe SR's fanbase will shirnk a little smaller.
I easily spend $300 a year on RPG stuff, maybe I'm just hardcore. I know a few "gotta catch them all" folks, I certainly was 1 with 3rd Ed. And I was disgusted with all the good stuff coming out, then the switch to 4th. I didn't really see it as being milked though, oh well. Alright then, you guys win. I'll make up my own stuff and not wait around for Fan Pro to put out canon material. That way I know the setting won't suck and I'll have more money! :nuyen: |
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May 15 2006, 06:52 PM
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#95
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
This from a guy who apparently couldnt' read Adam's post. :)
Too true. I've seen it happen. What's really funny (or tragic, depending on your perspective) is when they add several new people without clearances to a cleared project, when that project is using a new tool that none of the new people have experience with. Then they start having a meeting every day to try and figure out why schedule keeps slipping. :eek: I'm not sure where the cutoff line is for sourcebook creation, but a template [plus conversion standards might speed the process some, putting the editing of those sections more into a "check for spelling and grammar." But like I said, my experience with writing RPGs is practically nil. It's more of a "want more now!" then a "this is what I know would work." :) |
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May 15 2006, 07:18 PM
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#96
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 511 Joined: 19-August 02 Member No.: 3,139 |
Truth there. Gamer shows up to store with money, looks for newest SR product and doesn't find it. Most gamers I've seen, will look for something else - either in a another line they play, or will shop around for something new - Gamers can't hold onto money long, when they get it they want to buy something. They go back a month later with more money, and still no New SR materiel. But look, theres something else in some other line they play. Pretty soon, the SR materiel drops down a few notches due to inactivity, and it won't be the first thing they look for anymore. Or they could be buying other companys products to add into their existing SR Game; d20 cyber this, Gurps that, someone elses magic supplement, then shoe horn it into their game. Pretty soon, they aren't even looking for SR because it does not seem that the company is supporting it anymore. It seems a little insane that this two person show is adding another line, when they cannot seem to keep up with what they have. |
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May 15 2006, 07:50 PM
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#97
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
The Degenesis line is being managed by someone who was not currently doing much work for FanPro -- Davidson Cole, who used to work for FASA.
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May 15 2006, 08:32 PM
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#98
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Dragon Group: Members Posts: 4,718 Joined: 14-September 02 Member No.: 3,263 |
Woooott!!!!!! Way to STFU!!!! Bye. |
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May 15 2006, 08:48 PM
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#99
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
LOL
What's the Degenesis line? I couldn't find a readily available link to it on fanpro.com. |
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May 15 2006, 08:50 PM
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#100
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Prime Runner Group: Retired Admins Posts: 3,929 Joined: 26-February 02 From: .ca Member No.: 51 |
FanPro.com is FanPro GmbH's site; FanProGames.com is FanPro LLC's site for English-language products.
http://www.fanprogames.com/?p=32 for the Degenesis press release. |
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