Movement the Power, How to handle break-neck the Flash speed Options

[Ice Hammer]

I just have a quick question regarding this: say the PC's have their spirit to speed a character up, but they run into a group of NPCs with their own spirit, which decides to try to use its own movement power to slow the target down. Would each of the movement powers just cancel each other out, and the character doesn't receive an increase in his or her movement rate, or would the spirits have to engage in some sort of opposed test to determine which one of them controls the terrain? Or would force determine which spirit controlled the terain? Such as a Force 6 Air Spirit controlling the area, versus a Force 4.

[Eryk the Red]

The way I'd handle opposing movement power uses is to have whichever has a higher Force take effect, but its effective Force is reduced by the lesser. If they are equal, they cancel each other. You could also do it as an opposed test, if that suits you, whereas the winner uses his power at a Force equal to his net hits, limited by his actual Force rating.

[WorkOver]

Sam, once again, you need to grow a set man.

Stop letting these tool players take advatage of you. You are not haiving fun, they are being unfair to you.

Movement does not give you a single die for a dodge test. If they have this power sustained, then make sure you string 30 meters of monowire across doors, and inside of EVERY air duct in your buildings. Let these people keep abusing these spirit powers and hang them with it.

YOU ARE THE GM. Act like it. You do not need house rules, you have a set of rules in fornt of you, use them. Land mines, claymores, and anchored spells on every door way, cmplete with watcher spirits and sustained spirits on mages in the backgorund.

Be extreme and ruthless. Each and everytime they try to buffalo you doing crap like this, make sure your retribution is swift, violent and extreme. Dump a vat of acid on someone, hit people with anchored force 16 manablasts.

When you kill this whole party off, make sure you tell them, as long as they continue to get over on you, you will be using a strong hand. They will get the message, play with out trying to screw you over, and for chrissakes, use something else besides spirits.

If not, they you have many many fun ways to kill players. You could make a game of it, let them succeed the first half of the run, just to kill them with a Force 14 manablast.

Let them actually get to the file cabinet the folder is stored on, but when they open it, there was a concelaed (a force 8 spirit is not too much from a million dollar security contract hired to keep this file safe, is not too much eh?) rating 6 plastic under the file cabinet designed to explode when a certain phermone type doesn't open tghe cabinet.

Count up the number of times they used these same cheese ball tactics up in a game. The next game, make sure there are that number of spirts, that number of booby traps, and that number of locked doors with explosives wating for them.

Use your strong hand. If they where interested in your GROUP having fun, they would not be taking advanyage of YOU. Since they wanna be power gamers, make sure they are skilled at making characters, as they will not be getting more than 5 karma before they meet violent deaths.

[K2Grey]

That seems really heavy handed and a great way to alienate the players.

It's a power that spirits have, its useful for tactical applications, it makes sense and is totally reasonable in-game for people who can summon up spirits with that power to go and sustain it on them. Is the presence of one team making use of this ability so threatening that corps are scrambling to turn their buildings into bizarre deathtraps to anyone who steps in the wrong spot?

[ornot]

While I wouldn't agree with Workover's kill-'em-all attitude if you (the GM) aren't having fun then you definately need to do something about it. Ultimately you are the GM. It is within your power to just say "'You can't do that 'cos I'm the GM".

This is not a tactic GMs ought to be resorting to often as there are other ways to reign in players. A lot of them have been discussed in this thread and others, and I don't believe I can add anything to the things Shrike30 and the like have said. Wards are ultimately the best way to deal with troublesome use of spirits. Players will eventually find them less and less useful if they have to keep dispelling them, losing services each time, to get through even weak wards, unless they want to alert building security. Spirits can also be made so testy and unpleasant to deal with that they are only worth summoning in dire circumstances.

[James McMurray]

[WorkOver]

I wouldn't be as this extreme in every game, just until they stop trying to screw you.

Samuel has made two threads now where this group is screwing him. he is a new GM. They are new SR4 players. You are setting a bad example by letting them get over this much, they are learning bad habits by finding a rule that you are having trouble dealing with.

Magic is great, but technology is just as good.

I would strongly suggest you do not house rule stuff, nor tell your players they can not use these spirit powers, just because you say so.

Give them all the tools they want, but as long as they wish to abuse rules and power game, you, as a GM, get to try out all the dirty tricks of the trade.

When they see that cheeseball tactics stop working, and they can not out power game the guy in charge, they stop.

Its all fun an games until you send a Behemoth AND a Jauggernaught after them.