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 Is this THE Dunkelzahn? |
 Jul 3 2006, 04:11 PM
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#26
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Moving Target  Group: Members Posts: 681 Joined: 28-February 06 From: UK Member No.: 8,319  |
So can someone clear the limo issue up for me?
Back in Earthdawn days, IIRC, it was a major secret that the human 'minion' Dark Tooth was actually Mountainshadow's human form. If the Big D was in a limo then presumably he was openly assuming human form. At what point did he reveal that he could do this? I would have thought it must have created quite a stir, and must have annoyed some people when they discovered that he could have communicated normally if he'd wanted to. |
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Jul 3 2006, 04:18 PM
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#27
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
He definitely openly assumed human form, although I don't know when it would have first happened. How did he communnicate with the first reporters that interviewed him? Did they have to repeat everything he said for the camera or did he say it out loud?
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Jul 3 2006, 05:16 PM
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#28
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 204 Joined: 27-October 05 From: Waterloo, ON Member No.: 7,900 |
He had a bunch of interpreters that did just that.
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Jul 3 2006, 05:19 PM
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#29
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
Is there a definitive point where he first showed up openly in human form?
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Jul 3 2006, 08:33 PM
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#30
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Runner Group: Members Posts: 2,556 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Seattle Member No.: 98 |
Is there some reason a dragon in human form can't use a keyboard or goggles/gloves? |
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Jul 3 2006, 08:38 PM
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#31
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 6,748 Joined: 5-July 02 Member No.: 2,935 |
What self-respecting dragon would use tortoise mode? I mean, really. :P
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Jul 3 2006, 08:41 PM
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#32
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,213 Joined: 10-March 02 From: Back from the abyss. Member No.: 2,316 |
There isnt now, but in first edition there was no rules for running a tortise or cold ASIST, hell a hot ASIST for that matter since they didnt make the distinction till 2nd edition, then third edition introduced trode nets, if I remember correctlly. Its been many years since I looked through the first edition stuff, but Im almost possitive everything was DNI. Im sure any sentient creature could now surf the matrix if they have the physical ability to manipulate the input and output devices. The cyber side of things is trickier since the brain system are different. So yeah If dunky was still around and had a cyber deck with VR googles or even just that roll up screen he could hack a host. Not like fastjack or one of those guys, but he certainly could try. |
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Jul 3 2006, 09:06 PM
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#33
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Horror Group: Members Posts: 5,322 Joined: 15-June 05 From: BumFuck, New Jersey Member No.: 7,445 |
You know, it occurs to me..
A dragon is wealthy enough to afford all delta if they want. A Great Dragon has also probably Initiated so many times that Harlequin would say "Initiation? I think he's well past Initiation. He's in third gear, revving down and shifting to fourth." Given those, I would think that a GD with the inclinatioin could well afford to sacrifice a point of Essense/Magic in order to cram his head full of delta matrixware. |
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Jul 3 2006, 09:18 PM
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#34
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
If the Harlequin adventures are a good bases for the oddities of the metaplanes, I would never do that as a dragon. Who wants a clockwork head? :)
It could definitely be done though. It would require a lot of research, since dragon physiology is different than metahuman physiology. I believe someone already mentioned a dragon with a datajack. Heck, give the guy delta move by wire 3 or 4. :) |
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Jul 3 2006, 09:29 PM
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#35
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Horror Group: Members Posts: 5,322 Joined: 15-June 05 From: BumFuck, New Jersey Member No.: 7,445 |
Great Dragon Cybersammie...
Okay, that's terrifying. |
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Jul 3 2006, 10:07 PM
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#36
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,213 Joined: 10-March 02 From: Back from the abyss. Member No.: 2,316 |
There has been plenty of research with adding cyberware to animals. I believe in first edition you needed a kill switch device or something to kill the animal when (not if, but when) it went mad. They had rules of some kind that you made a willpower check of the animal compared to its essence, failure meant it went ape shit. Ill see if I can find the rules in my old SR1 books.
There was a lot of references to stange expriements Dr Kam and Smiling Bandit conversed back and forth about. Like Bloats, flying jellyfish the size of Zepplins. While extremely silly, it was sort of how biotech stuff was thougth about in first edition then let slide till late 3rd edition. |
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Jul 3 2006, 10:34 PM
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#37
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Horror Group: Members Posts: 5,322 Joined: 15-June 05 From: BumFuck, New Jersey Member No.: 7,445 |
It seems to me that a floating jellyfish the size of a zepplin is a prime target for SAM activity.
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Jul 3 2006, 10:39 PM
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#38
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,213 Joined: 10-March 02 From: Back from the abyss. Member No.: 2,316 |
So are jumbo jets, HCSTs, suborbitals, semiballistics and other zepplins, I dont see your point. The bloats were designed as super cargo carriers. |
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Jul 3 2006, 10:50 PM
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#39
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panda! Group: Members Posts: 10,331 Joined: 8-March 02 From: north of central europe Member No.: 2,242 |
hmm, when did the world go from SR to chi-chian?
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Jul 3 2006, 11:23 PM
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#40
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 681 Joined: 28-February 06 From: UK Member No.: 8,319 |
Hmm. Either nobody knows, or nobody's saying! |
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Jul 3 2006, 11:45 PM
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#41
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Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
It might have been a very big limo.
Instead of getting a datajack or using a tortoise setup it would probably be easier for the average GD to just possess a doublt-digit skill decker. |
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Jul 3 2006, 11:53 PM
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#42
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 681 Joined: 28-February 06 From: UK Member No.: 8,319 |
It was not "a very big limo"! |
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Jul 4 2006, 12:43 AM
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#43
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,213 Joined: 10-March 02 From: Back from the abyss. Member No.: 2,316 |
I hate to keep refering to an adventure I dont have on hand, but I seem to remember the Big D doing talk shows in human form in the Super Tuesday adventure. Im not sure what happens in the novels, Im not a novel reader. Damn I have to find that book. lol ANyone out there have it readily availible? lol
The pictures (not very good ones) on page 11 and 15 of Portfolio of a Dragon, the pictures on 11 of a news feed show what can be assumed the presidential limo as it passes then explodes, its normal size. The page 15 full page picture shows car parts in the air admist the explosion and they look to be normal sized. And wouldnt a dragon sized Limo be more like a Bergen? Also he leave the Watergate Hotel, I have been there, I dont dont think they are going to modify an "historic" building for the dragon to wander around in natural form to go to a party once. Just above the entrance there are a lot of rooms that would need to be taken out tomake the door big enough. ALso the frint of the hotel is sor tof in a recess with the main street in front actually sitting higher then the front door and wher the limo would be to pick up the president, making a really large vehicle out front of the Watergate not an option. But thats real life, not RPG fiction. Not sure what chi-chian is, but if you are referring to the bloats thing my Shadowtech (where the Bloats are first discussed) book has a publish date of 1992, thats when I got it. And it has a special thanks to the GenCon 91 breakfast club, so some where around 91-92. And I agree with hyzmarca, for the average dragon itll be much easier to hire a highly skilled decker to do your dirty work instead of risking insanity to do it themselves. |
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Jul 4 2006, 01:11 AM
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#44
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
That is no longer a factor as of SR4. I don't know if it changed in one of the SOTA books or is new to the edition.
I don't know the particulars of the metamagic, but IIRC there is a Possession metamagic that he might be referring to. Taking over their body as opposed to paying their salary. |
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Jul 4 2006, 01:29 AM
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#45
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,213 Joined: 10-March 02 From: Back from the abyss. Member No.: 2,316 |
I havent seen anything in the SOTA books, cause if it was in there, trust me I would know, our GM would have my running suit made of Milkbones. Unless we both missed it, which is doubtful. I seem to remember some fluff that has indicated there have been major strides in creating non-human interfaces. The dolphine matrix trodes seem to spring to mind, but then again that maybe Johnny Mnemonic coming to mind. I dont play SR4, I like the rules and all, and if it was another game I would play it. But reading the BBB and discussions on this board, Im not giving up characters I like till they release the books to make half their abilities availible. Its just a preference, I dont play DnD d20, but I play a bunch of other d20 games, so its not that I hate the system, just a preference. Well with dealing with dragons possessing a decker could be magically or out right owning them. :) But I do believe the subject of possession has to be magically active and out of his body, or pushed out of his body. I dont think a mundane can be possessed, accept by the Loa and the person being possessed must be in the cult and freely willing to be possessed. You cant fake your way into a Hougans church either, as stated in the books. |
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Jul 4 2006, 01:33 AM
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#46
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Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957 |
That's about the stupidest thing I've ever heard! Not really. Play what you like. :) And thanks for not feeling like you have to come to the SR4 board and bash it. :D |
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Jul 4 2006, 02:06 AM
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#47
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,213 Joined: 10-March 02 From: Back from the abyss. Member No.: 2,316 |
Just checked the Possession rules, yeah only astally active, including dual natured beings can be targeted. And you have to battle them for possession and you can only stay in them for a certain amount of time.
And why would I attack SR4? I was a bit apprehensive when I heard bits and pieces of it, but I wasnt going to insult people for playing it. I didnt like it at all till I sat down and really read the rules and got to know the game. In fact Ill be honest. I actually play SR2 with a heavy dose of SR3. Ill probably steal ideas from SR4 to put into the setting we play in. I dont see the need to crash the enitre matrix to replace it with a wireless matrix. I mean I helped build the new GSM network cellphones use to give you all those new internet features and IMing on the go. We didnt take all the old stuff out of place and knock out all cell phone towers for 5 years to finish the project. In fact if you go into a large amount of cell phone huts today there is still a lot of old equipement in the huts. They are just now slowly taking the old stuff out as people move to newer phones. I know it more then just the matrix, it has to do with the metaplot as a whole, which is something our group used but only paid lip service to. Our characters were just cogs in the machine, the high level stuff was left to who ever wanted it. None of us have met a dragon, or had dinner with damien knight. EH, I have quirks, and one of them is Im only going to go through so many editions of a game till I stop because of lack of interest or the company makes enough changes to the game I dont feel connected to it anymore. Which Fanpro did with SR4 and Wizards did with DnD. But like I said I dont play d20 DnD, just like ADnD 2nd edition more. I do play Star Wars d20, Modern d20 and trying to get a game of Sidewinder d20 going. If Fanpro came out with a game based on the SR4 rules and it was something other then SR and it was something Id be interested in I would probably play it. You also have to realise, and I dont know how old you guys are, its hard enough to get my group together monthly to play (kids, jobs, and all that shit), let alone get them all together and learn a new game, then try to play it, spending more time debugging and houseruling a new game till we are satisfied with it and then get down to playing. Its also hard to talk a group of people into giving up money they may need for gas ($3.08 a gallon here) to get to work and spend it on a new set of books for a game we already play. Be assured Im not going to pop into the SR4 boards and randomly bash stuff because I dont like the game, I may stop in and see what rules are what (seeing that I only have the BBB) and see whats worth stealing and bringing into our cobbled together SR game. :) It is funny though seeing the same rules debates like realistic lifting rules being discussed and the same basic things being said that was said when SR3 was released. |
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Jul 4 2006, 02:26 AM
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#48
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Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
The Astral Gateway power can be used to force astral combat for the purpose of possession. It is sually a Free Spirit power but I'm sure some GDs somewhere have adapted it into a metamagic and those that havn't probably know a Free Spirit or two,
Neverthe ess, you can't ignore the vast community of magically active deckers. |
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Jul 4 2006, 02:39 AM
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#49
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,213 Joined: 10-March 02 From: Back from the abyss. Member No.: 2,316 |
I know its more then probable in this day, but the dragon would also need the high skill to do the actual hacking. The possesser doesnt have access tot he possessies skills. SO the dragon might as well just practice and learn, build a bleeding edge deck, then possess his secetary with a datajack. Or a mage with a datajack and not worry about the gateway power.
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Jul 4 2006, 03:23 AM
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#50
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Target Group: Members Posts: 38 Joined: 12-May 06 From: Melbourne, Australia Member No.: 8,551 |
It's mentioned somewhere (and I can't for the life of me remember where) that a Dragon can "hitch a ride" with a decker when they go into the matrix. That would most likely be how the Big D was posting on Shadowland at the time.
I'll try and find the source and quote it here later. |
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