House rule: discretionary funds

House rule: discretionary funds

James McMurray View Member Profile	Jul 6 2006, 02:50 PM Post #51
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957	Nope, what I'm looking at is a minor alteration to make a player forgetting to buy something the character would buy easy to rectify with a small framework of rules in place. What you're looking at is totally revamping the monetary system of SR. As I've already said, it ain't my cup of tea whether it models purchases or not. Not modeling purchases and characters being unable to save up money for a single purchase just makes it even less my cup of tea. There are plenty of resource systems that model purchases and saving up just fine. I can understand why you might want to not allow for that possibility if you feel that buying things is boring. It's cool. It just isn't for me. We now return you to your regularly scheduled derailed thread. Thank you for shopping Dumpshock. :)

Brahm View Member Profile	Jul 6 2006, 04:35 PM Post #52
Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,635 Joined: 27-November 05 Member No.: 8,006	It isn't as far as you want to go in clearing up bean counting, fine. But one flows from the other. It is actually on the same topic, and as a whole satisfies the original goal along with the related stuff that flowwed naturally out from that discussion. Like the problem of doing an endrun around around spending cash.

James McMurray View Member Profile	Jul 6 2006, 04:40 PM Post #53
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957	How does it satisfy the original goal of discussing a specific house rule? I see where it flows from that point, but the OP is a very specific topic.

Brahm

Jul 6 2006, 04:53 PM

Post #54

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QUOTE (James McMurray)

How does it satisfy the original goal of discussing a specific house rule? I see where it flows from that point, but the OP is a very specific topic.

Here is an idea. Make it a priority for you to understand what you are reading.

The initial point of the first paragraph of this thread seems to me to be talking about a way to help avoid the diddling around with the last bit of cash during character generation. You then set into suggestions about that topic.

My suggestion here also deals with that, and coupled with a Resources + Logic roll for items missing from the inventory sheet covers large swaths of it. With the added bonus of helping to encourage characters to emerse themselves in a blackmarket economy instead of more player detached Sears Roebuck catalogue view of the world.

James McMurray View Member Profile	Jul 6 2006, 04:57 PM Post #55
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957	Cool, we just have a different understanding of what I wrote. I was looking for a specific discussion, but apparently my wording left room for a more general topic.

Brahm

Jul 6 2006, 05:19 PM

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QUOTE (James McMurray @ Jul 6 2006, 11:57 AM)

Cool, we just have a different understanding of what I wrote. I was looking for a specific discussion, but apparently my wording left room for a more general topic.

You put the problem right up there in the first paragraph. However what I'm really suggesting is that in your inital suggested house rule you missed some aspects of the underlying causes in your analysis. Among other things that being that if you don't use up all that money at chargen then when you start play it is mostly gone, and the overall grouping of nearly all procurements along with monthly Lifestyles under the running count of explicit nuyen.

So yes, this is talking about that house rule. Albeit tied via the inital paragraph of your post. Which is what you were trying to address, right?

James McMurray View Member Profile	Jul 6 2006, 05:27 PM Post #57
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957	This rule would fix the "loss of starting money" problem because no matter what portion of your last monetary BP was unspent, it would always be less than 5000 :nuyen: and could therefor be put into your discretionary fund. It's the reason I chose 5,000 as the cap. My group has always hated losing that money and either tends to dump it into extra months of a weak lifestyle or spend a lot of time trying to spend every last drop.

Brahm View Member Profile	Jul 6 2006, 05:39 PM Post #58
Shooting Target Group: Members Posts: 1,635 Joined: 27-November 05 Member No.: 8,006	:\| sigh It's like the thread never happened for you.

James McMurray View Member Profile	Jul 6 2006, 05:48 PM Post #59
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957	I'm sorry if me not getting converted to a resource stat/skill system is upsetting. I was looking for discussion about my proposed house rule. I'm not in the market for a new system. Please finish it though, as it's definitely interesting.

Cain

Jul 6 2006, 05:49 PM

Post #60

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QUOTE (James McMurray)

QUOTE (Cain @ Jul 5 2006, 09:12 PM)

I agree that adding detailed rules is largely unnecessary. If someone forgets something really egregious, you should let them have a limited amount of ret-conning, especially if it's a minor detail. For example, I always see players forget to buy clips for all the ammo they're purchasing. Given how cheap they are, I find that it's not worth the time to track clips and ammo, and I give them clips for free.

I like adding the rules to it because it makes borderline cases easy to moderate, no matter who is GMing that week. If it were a one GM setup die rolls probably wouldn't be necessary, although I do still like tying it to knowledge skills for flavor.

We don't charge for extra clips either. Bean counting has a place in our games, but sometimes too much is too much. :)

I still suggest that you go with the toolkit idea: if someone's got a generic package of stuff that'd reasonably have what you want, there's no need to itemize the exact contents. If someone's got an Electronics toolkit, you can safely assume he's got solder, a soldering iron, wire clippers, etc. Wire clippers are a specific item, mentioned elsewhere, but why should you make them buy one specal?

And I do agree with you on the bean-counting thing, but my point was more along the lines of this: if a player forgot to buy clips, and he's trying to reload in the middle of a firefight when he discovers this, I'd safely ret-con it into letting him have a free clip, already loaded. I wouldn't make any Shadowrunner make a knowledge roll, or anyone for that matter: it's just ludicrious to assume that you're carrying 15 loose rounds without realizing they're not in a clip.

James McMurray View Member Profile	Jul 6 2006, 05:54 PM Post #61
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957	I wouldn't suggest a knowledge roll to have a clip either, but would want one to show if they have a keycard sequencer or not, because it isn't something that's blatantly obvious you'd need. Kits: we have these in other systems, although I don't think anyone has made them for SR because for some reason this is the game we really get down the the details on. But even in other games they're just a set group of gear put together in one handy container, not a nebulous catchall of stuff. That's just our style though.

Moon-Hawk

Jul 6 2006, 06:03 PM

Post #62

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QUOTE (Cain)

I still suggest that you go with the toolkit idea: if someone's got a generic package of stuff that'd reasonably have what you want, there's no need to itemize the exact contents. If someone's got an Electronics toolkit, you can safely assume he's got solder, a soldering iron, wire clippers, etc. Wire clippers are a specific item, mentioned elsewhere, but why should you make them buy one specal?

I'm waiting for emo to post his "being awesome" toolkit that contains anything one might reasonably need to be awesome. And of course, that's "reasonably" as in, emo samurai campaign "reasonably."

We love you emo. :D

Brahm

Jul 6 2006, 06:11 PM

Post #63

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QUOTE (James McMurray @ Jul 6 2006, 12:48 PM)

I'm sorry if me not getting converted to a resource stat/skill system is upsetting.

No, the problem is that you seem to me to have missed the flow of the thread that lead us to here. I just don't feel up to reinterating the thread.

Bira

Jul 7 2006, 01:22 PM

Post #64

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QUOTE (James McMurray)

I don't have any of those, can you give a brief rundown? Is it a setup where you let the players add bits to their environment, such as grabbing a brick off the ground in a fight in an alley when the description given by the GM doesn't mention any bricks? If so I don't know how well that would work, since it's pretty rare to find the crowbar you forgot to buy sitting right next to the window you need to pry open, then finding the keycard sequencer sitting right next to the lock. ;)

It's a bit more involved than that. Adventure! characters have an attribute called Inspiration, which they can spend to insert elements into the story. The more these new elements affect what's happening, the more it costs.

"Grabing a brick off the ground" is too minor to count as dramatic editing. Something very minor, or that only comes into play after a certain amount of time ("My gang buddies are going to get here in 15 minutes to help me out") costs a point. Something minor but immediate costs 2, something major costs 3 and something huge that blatantly contradicts previous descriptions costs 4.

Each "edit" demands an appropriate explanation and must be approved by the GM. All of these expenditures are temporary: Edge/Inspiration should refresh normally after being used for dramatic editing.

Having a crowbar or wire cutter on hand is probably something I'd charge 1 Edge for. It gets you a tool you didn't have, but you still have to make the appropriate tests to use it.

Having a backup weapon after being searched and disarmed is probably worth 3 points, and requires an appropriate explanation.

Demon_Bob

Jul 18 2006, 02:23 PM

Post #65

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QUOTE (James McMurray)

Nope, what I'm looking at is a minor alteration to make a player forgetting to buy something the character would buy easy to rectify with a small framework of rules in place.

GM's Option Rule baised on character background.

James McMurray View Member Profile	Jul 18 2006, 03:06 PM Post #66
Great Dragon Group: Members Posts: 5,430 Joined: 10-January 05 From: Fort Worth, Texas Member No.: 6,957	That's kinda where the knowledge skills come in. If something fit really well within the background I'd let them default the knowledge check.

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