Character Critique, Rip it to shreds....i dare ya.... Options

[Abbandon]

availability 8 ?? Thats not what my corrected 3rd printing says. It says 12.

[X-Kalibur]

Last I checked the errata (and most of the samples) you can have availability 12 as well. You are right about the correction of Fake SIN avail to 3xrtg which makes the max at creation a rtg 4 fake sin.

[Abbandon]

OK i changed her backstory in the first post. Scope it out and give feedback. I also juggled some bp's and gave her some more contacts although they are crappy.

I am adamant about her pistol skill. The only difference between a swat guy and a elementary school kids skill at firearms is practice and ability which she has both of.

With her charisma and social skills and adept powers she has like 12 dice in normal situations.

Her agility and firearms could reach 15 dice? But she can split those with ambidextrous which also cancel out lasers and smartguns. So 7/8 dice is pretty good for a newbie? Minus any negative mods.

[X-Kalibur]

[Abbandon]

I guess for the same reason you couldnt have two sets of cross hairs laid over your eyes. You cant track two lasers all that well either. Its in the book and im fine with the limitation. if your my gm and you wanna let the lasers count woo hoo!!/

[X-Kalibur]

[Shrike30]

It can become your vision, but it doesn't necessarily do so. Personally, the thought of having my vision jerked off target every time my gun goes off sounds irritating as hell.

I've shot with shooters who could be described as having Pistols 5. These were guys able to shoot tight groups on targets in low light, while moving, from the ground, one-handed or off-handed, from the draw, from a turn, right after a speed-reload... a huge chunk of it is practice, technique, familiarity. Some of these folks have seen combat. Others have not. It's not a requirement for being a good shooter.

Check out some of the combat-style shooting groups... IPSC, USPSA, the NTI. A lot of the participants are phenomenally skilled, despite being unblooded civilians. While the background as-written is a little scanty ("oh, our little daughter watches a lot of action movies and spends hours shooting things while backflipping, let's give her more money to spend on ammo this week, because it's so cute!"), the skill itself is not particularly off the wall. Personally, I like how it's been represented that she's never been in a gunfight with the addition of Combat Paralysis.

I might suggest, rather than Predators, the use of Hammerli's (target pistols) or another light pistol as a preferred weapon, just for style (and that point of built-in recoil compensation). Predators are big, clunky guns, and the thought of trying to conceal a pair of them on the forearms of a wiry, athletic elf girl is a bit much for me. A decent number of people who are fairly skilled shots also tend towards lighter calibers (9mm and .40 S&W) in real life, as having a well-placed shot means a lot more than having a larger, faster slug (10mm/.45 ACP) does, and it's easier to get several quick, accurate shots (like you'd be pulling with adept reflexes), even if you're not a particularly large person. Using that logic, light pistols (even if they're not the Hammerlis) might be more appropriate for the character (who, while athletic, with a strength of 2 strikes me as one of those with more of a "runner" build than a "lifter" build).

[ornot]

Hey Abbandon. Just looked through your rewrite and I'm impressed.

The backstory is much better and I would be much happier with your description of how you developed your skills if I were your GM.

The knowledge skills are a vast improvement, no more work needed there IMHO!

Die's contacts are better rounded now. Sure, none of them care too much about her, but she's not been in Seattle for long. You hardly need the loyalty bonus dice with your social skills anyway.

I would bow to Shrike's superior knowledge about guns. Target pistols do fit the background better than heavy pistols. Incidentally I have a gun bunny street sam in my game who likes to duel wield. You may indeed find the point of recoil compensation invaluable. Remember that the recoil for each gun stacks when firing, making both your second shots at -4, with a split dice pool. The Hammerli's also come with integral smartlink, like the predators, and have heavy pistol ranges. However, the clip is smaller and the cost higher.

[jklst14]

Abbandon,

I gave my own Face character higher Pistol and First Aid skills than her history really warranted. I just wanted her to be able to keep pace with the others if there should be a gun fight, so I understand why you want to keep your character's skill at 5.

A suggestion:

For a Face, it might be worthwhile to raise her Charisma to 7 and gain an extra die to all social skill rolls. This is a lot cheaper to do with Build Points during chargen than with karma later. Also, the first Impression Edge can be very useful for social characters.

JKL

[ShadowDragon]

Smartlinks and dual weild...I can see why a smartlink wouldn't work with both guns, but why doesn't it work with one of them?

Abbandon,

I like the new background much better; and your stats match this one much better. As a GM I'd accept this character, though the uber commlink with a lack of programs would still irk me.

[ornot]

meh.. if he wants to waste BPs on a pointless comlink he's entitled to, although it is a waste.

The smartlinks in the guns do work provided you only fire one weapon per simple action, rather than both. Also saves you from splitting your dice pool, so you end up with a stack load more dice!

[Abbandon]

Ok here are my arguments for the predator pistols...heavy pistols have a conciel mod of 0. That means they are not easier or harder to spot.

Is the problem with using heavy pistols because of her strength? I dont really cherish the thought of having less dmage and losing my armor penetration. I would have to constantly roll with special ammo if i went with the lighter pistols. Anyways her strength will eventually get raised.

That would be sweet having the hammerli's w/ the gas vents. That would counter semi auto fire recoil.

Hmmm damage or accuracy. What if she has her predators in quickdraw holsters and she has 2 light pistols in the arm slides? Hmmm She could be kinda like a samurai with swords only in reverse. She could have two light pistols on slids and one predator in a concealed holster, like two little swords and one big one hehe. That sounds pretty kool.

Ornot Are you sure you mean -4? The second target for a semi auto shot during a combat phase is -1. And dual firing makes recoil on each weapon count towards each other. So it would be -2 on each gun.......

[fool]

boarder smuggler? what this guy smuggle stuff into boarding school students?

[Abbandon]

Yes mom.

[Taki]

[Glyph]

She has a Body of 4, though, so she is more fit than average. With 400 build points, you simply can't get every Attribute as high as you would like. You could certainly justify an athletic person with a low Strength by saying that they are slight of build and built more for endurance than, say, powerlifting.

I probably would change the last line of her physical description, though. "Athletic build with muscles easily defined" doesn't fit someone with a Strength of 2. Something like "petite but toned" or "wiry build" would fit better in my opinion.


Combat Paralysis is something else that I would change. I won't say it doesn't fit you character concept, because it does. Basically, someone who has trained a lot for combat but hasn't actually seen any real combat. But I think that would be better as something to roleplay out for her first few combats. Taking that flaw, on a character where you have invested so much on combat ability, is like taking Simsense Vertigo for a decker. You are hobbling yourself in an area of your specialty. If you are okay with that, then more power to you. But be aware that Shadowrun can be a lethal game, and a disadvantage like that can really cost you.

[Abbandon]

Ok juggled some Knowledge skills to switch a point from logic into strength. I guess it fits more with her not being very smart or technical as a majority of the logic skills have to do with machines and devices.

[Taki]

[ornot]

Hey Abbandon. The increase in strength is a good idea.

The lighter pistols just sit better with the character concept. Your reasons for having heavy pistols are entirely mechanics related. Also, as you want to be considered a face, the -2 dice penalty applied to anyone trying to spot your guns would pay dividends.

I think you are right about the recoil penalties however, with the Hammerlis you negate that penalty altogether which makes the -2 for shooting a different target much less unopleasant. Worth bearing in mind unless you expect to be shooting the same target 4 times /IP.

[Shrike30]

The thing with not strapping heavy pistols to your forearms is pretty simple: they're ungainly, bulky, and heavy.

A loaded Glock 20 runs about 3 pounds, and that's about as light as "heavy pistols" get. They're five and a half inches tall (noticeably bigger than my forearm) and eight inches long (meaning that if I strapped one to the inside of my forearm, far enough up my sleeve that it wouldn't be easily visible, it would nearly reach my elbow). The kind of clothing you'd need to wear to conceal these and yet still be able to extend them into your hands for shooting would most easily be described as "ponchos" or "priest's robes." Swinging that much weight around on the inside of your arm all day would get irritating as hell, especially when you're trying to do something like climb over a fence or carry an armload of stuff, when your forearms encounter solid objects pretty regularly. In all honesty, I'd feel most light pistols were too big to be carried this way, as well. This is really a way to carry a hold-out.

However, there is no RAW reason you can't put a heavy pistol in an arm slide, just some real life details.

The suggestion of light pistols over heavies was, again, a real-life thing. A lot of skilled shooters realize that shot placement is more important than having a heavier caliber, and they can fire much more quickly and much more accurately with what we'd describe as being "light" pistols. While you've subsequently bumped your character's strength to 3, when I initially made the suggestion I had the impression the character wasn't particularly large (she could be a range of sizes, now), and felt the change in caliber might generate recoil more suited to her as a shooter. Again, real life stuff, not anything that has an in-game effect.