 Bound Spirit Services, Spirits |
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 Sep 26 2006, 08:50 PM
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#1
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Target  Group: Members Posts: 20 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Whiteland, IN Member No.: 9,169  |
Ok, I have a bound spirit that I assign to search for the holy grail for which I somehow have a mental image of. How long does it search before it gives up?
Oh, and the answer that it would be up to my gm is not the answer I'm looking for as he asked me to post this for him. gunsnammo |
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Sep 26 2006, 08:57 PM
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#2
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Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
well, I guess as long as it takes won't help then?
Another thing that may be important, this is assuming that the spirit can't find the holy greail then, right? 'cause if it can, that changes things. |
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Sep 26 2006, 09:11 PM
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#3
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 324 Joined: 18-July 06 From: Charleston, SC Member No.: 8,911 |
Probably would never return, considering anything as magical potent as the holy grail would be warded in the least and guarded by some hefty spirits/cult/anchored spells or whatever.
More importantly, asking a spirit to do something near impossible without some support will only make it angry towards you. So if your asking the spirit to search the world with nothing but a mental picture, he may bring you back something that looks like the grail. But more probably you'll just make him and his friends mad. If its a task he'll be at for a long time, your GM should probably require you to pay Karma to make it a semi-permanent task. Now if your GM wants you to find the holy grail and simply didn't give you any means to hunt it down, decided it was unguarded in some ditch, and thinks that a spirit loves giving up years to one service...and wants to roleplay you eagerly awaiting the spirits return in the hopes that he found it, then you don't even need a book or the boards help. If you as a player are just wondering how long a service is and what you can feasibly do with it, consider that spirits have sapience and edge and would resent such a service as much as you'd resent your boss expecting you to fly unaided to the moon tomorrow and bring him back some cheese. |
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Sep 26 2006, 09:41 PM
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#4
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Prime Runner Group: Banned Posts: 3,732 Joined: 1-September 05 From: Prague, Czech Republic Member No.: 7,665 |
What you're going to want here is a maximum number of attempts before the test fails. The book suggests (dicepool) attempts before the test is a success or failure, but personally I prefer (Skill +3) tests. Regardless, a Spirit is going to be making a Search test every Initiative Pass and it gets two of those every 3 seconds.
So a Force 6 Spirit would repor failure after a little less than 20 seconds as per the book. Now, it's a bound spirit. You could plausibly give it an extended task to search for the Holy Grail everywhere in which case the GM might allow it to reuse the power again and again for up to a year and a Day, coming up empty about 3 times a minute... -Frank |
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Sep 26 2006, 10:31 PM
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#5
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 829 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 770 |
er...no, not every initiative pass - the interval on the search power is 10 minutes.
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Sep 27 2006, 02:51 AM
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#6
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 615 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,895 |
Hmm, Perhaps I am blind... But while this is a house rule I have often used. Is there anything 'official' that caps a 'bound' (or registered sprite) spirit, to 'a year and a day' I have rarely given 'long term' task, nor had players, but never seen anything RAW that state a limit to a remote service (or technically a local service). peace |
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Sep 27 2006, 04:23 AM
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#7
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Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
well, there is taht one where if you want to set a spirit on a remote task for a long period , such as 'guard this site', you need to pay karma equal to it's force, which sets it for most a year and a day. That's in SM pg 94
Of course, if it's not bound, it would stop at sunrise/sunset Even if it's not expressly for this point, I'd say it sets precedent. |
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Sep 27 2006, 04:55 AM
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#8
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 615 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 1,895 |
aah have got, but haven't really had a chance to go through SM yet... Figure haven't started running a SR4 yet, and the one I play in I am a TM so SM doesn't help me... BBB couldn't find anything that limits the length of a remote services, but year and a day certain sounds reasonable. Probably have to make sure my GM reads the relative page of SM, and probably have him house rule TM's and sprites the same Though dang if they cost karma now to send on long term services, SPrites for the 'ultimate' in security just got alot more expensive and agents once again look the way to go. |
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Sep 27 2006, 07:04 AM
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#9
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 750 Joined: 9-August 06 Member No.: 9,059 |
In SR3 bound elementals just hanging around or engaged in a long term service lost a service per 24 hours elapsed. Bring that back if you the feel need, or even make it kick in at sunrise/sunset. It's not like spirits got weaker in the move to SR4.
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Sep 27 2006, 12:13 PM
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#10
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Target Group: Members Posts: 20 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Whiteland, IN Member No.: 9,169 |
Interesting ideas but I guess I chose a bad example to use as we seem to have gotten stuck on the search power. What about magical guard? Could I bind a plant elemental and then tell it to provide counter-spelling for the entire group for a year and a day? I'd say not likely. Seems a bit abusive to me.
I also like the idea of setting a limit on how many times the spirit can try before it gives up but since search is an extended test it is really only trying once. The threshold and interval just determine how long it takes to succeed. At least that's how I interpret it. gunsnammo |
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Sep 27 2006, 01:25 PM
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#11
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 633 Joined: 23-February 06 Member No.: 8,301 |
The optional rule about limiting attempts that Frank referred to actually limits the number of rolls made when performing an extended test. It would mean that if you don't succeed within a certain number of rolls, the action is considered a failure. In this case, it would cost a service, even though it didn't succeed.
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Sep 27 2006, 09:47 PM
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#12
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Uncle Fisty Group: Admin Posts: 13,891 Joined: 3-January 05 From: Next To Her Member No.: 6,928 |
for the counter spelling, I'd say sure. You're going to run into problems pretty quickly though. Say.. as soon as you walk in to a warded building. Or if it's a higher force spirit, as soon as a LS mage sees you w/ a Force 6 spirit without a permit. Spend your karma how you like.
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Sep 28 2006, 03:28 PM
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#13
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 324 Joined: 18-July 06 From: Charleston, SC Member No.: 8,911 |
Entire group? I doubt it, Magical Guard as a service would cost one service/task per person in the group. A year and a day seems unlikely as well (unless your paying karma for long term), but even if you allow this, whats the chance the spirit will get banished or killed long before a month (with any serious action going on). I'd probably balance somewhere in between with you could use a service to defend the group, but every time a player used the Counterspelling dice it would take a service. As long as you rebound the spirit you could do this indefinitely, but binding comes with its own costs. |
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Sep 28 2006, 03:59 PM
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#14
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 750 Joined: 9-August 06 Member No.: 9,059 |
Why? "Kill that group" is one service, and it will generally require multiple attacks and power uses to pull off. "Protect that group" should be no different, although you will need to specify who to follow if the group breaks up and the spirit can't maintain LOS on everyone. |
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Sep 28 2006, 08:12 PM
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#15
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Target Group: Members Posts: 20 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Whiteland, IN Member No.: 9,169 |
One task per person? That seems excessive. Is that how you run it or is there a rule to back that up? The magical guard power allows you to lend counterspelling to a number of individuals equal to your magic, similar to the standard guard power. That would be like asking a bound spirit to use weather control to bring in some fog to cover sneaking past some guards and then the spirit saying "sorry boss there are 10 guards and I only owe you 3 services so I can't do that. Makes zero sense to me.
Now that makes sense to me. The year and day thing came from something someone else mentioned earlier in the thread. I wasn't talking about using karma to bind it to me or anything. |
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Sep 28 2006, 08:24 PM
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#16
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Target Group: Members Posts: 20 Joined: 19-August 06 From: Whiteland, IN Member No.: 9,169 |
Really? Wow, that is generous. Are you a gm?
Sure, wards are always a problem.
Actually all of my spirits are perfectly legal as our group are a strike team for a fledgling corporation that specializes in the paranormal. So we are actually full employees with full citizenship in the corporation. But this is a bit OT. sorry. :)
Not spending any karma on the spirit, just asking what the duration of a service like magical guard would last. |
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