 How do you role play military people?, HOW DO ROLE PLAY!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?! |
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 Oct 31 2006, 03:41 PM
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#151
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Target  Group: Members Posts: 23 Joined: 3-October 06 Member No.: 9,527  |
Sadly its not even scrapped in combat zones. Several FOBs in Iraq are considered "salute zones" mostly by officers who apparently would rather not go home to see their family (tho some may have read graves or other WWI officers talking about deteriorating units) I'm on one thats a salute zone and I love how all the AF officers who visit start to take cover when I salute them in the middle of the IZ (Green Zone) because they consider it a "sniper check" I dont disagree with them, but its still funny to watch. |
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Oct 31 2006, 04:02 PM
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#152
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 906 Joined: 16-October 06 Member No.: 9,630 |
Just as a tech note,
I'd bet a sleep regulator would be quite common in shadow run militaries. For what was it 10,000 and 0.15 essence. |
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Oct 31 2006, 04:07 PM
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#153
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
That has always been stupid, but it's not inherently saluting's fault. As dabigz is making clear, not all officers can get over themselves, even when it's obvious to everyone else that they should. :) |
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Oct 31 2006, 04:30 PM
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#154
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,150 Joined: 19-December 05 From: Rhein-Ruhr Megaplex Member No.: 8,081 |
In my time it was a standing order not to salut anybody, not even Generals, unless they saluted first (only the direct superior officers, the flag during flag ceremony and everybody when on guard duty). We were told to give a nice 'Guten Morgen Herr <insert rank>' ('Good morning <rank>', the customary military greeting, even in the evening), when appropriate.
Saved us all from a tennis elbow, I guess. I probably should mention again that I served at the (german) Ministry of Defense. I never had any problem to stop saluting. In fact, in my last days in the army I unintentionally saluted with the left hand (I was holding my application for the rest of my leave in the right hand). The officer, a first lieutnant fresh from armored, who just had signed my application, was not amused. At first, I didn't even know why he started yelling. I really can't explain how that have happened, I saluted thousands of time in a crisp and formally correct manner :D. Seriously, I did basic training in the same batallion that does all the ceremonies and formal stuff in germany. On the other hand, it took me years to regain my ability to start walking with the right leg again, and not to automatically fall in step when someone was walking beside or in front of me... |
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Nov 1 2006, 12:47 AM
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#155
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,286 Joined: 24-May 05 From: A 10x10 room with an orc and a treasure chest Member No.: 7,409 |
I was about to mention that. I've noticed that you can tell when a group of people are military when they are all in step even when walking around town, a bar, a mall, what have you. |
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Nov 1 2006, 02:54 AM
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#156
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Prime Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,577 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gwynedd Valley PA Member No.: 1,221 |
Modern? they were discouraging it in the trenchs of 1914. |
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Nov 1 2006, 03:02 AM
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#157
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,008 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Perhaps not coincidentally, that's right around the start of "modern" in the definition I'm using.
~J |
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Nov 1 2006, 06:09 PM
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#158
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
what's funny is how often a soldier and an officer will come to the mutual, silent agreement that neither one feels like messing around with the whole salute thing, so both angle off in different directions and avoid eye contact. |
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Nov 1 2006, 07:03 PM
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#159
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Freelance Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 |
Much like in a civilian workplace, when people just happen to glance away (after a quick look to make sure the other person is just-happening-to-glance-away) as they pass one another in the hall, to avoid having to stop and greet them. |
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Nov 1 2006, 07:13 PM
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#160
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ghostrider Group: Retired Admins Posts: 4,196 Joined: 16-May 04 Member No.: 6,333 |
Yup, pretty much. Especially Warrant Officers. Those guys, for the most part, seem to fall into two camps. Those that hate being saluted, and those that enjoy it but only because they're so damn amused by the idea that they're being saluted. :)
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Nov 1 2006, 08:17 PM
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#161
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 124 Joined: 26-February 02 Member No.: 2,072 |
Not sure if it was mentioned also but there will be big differences in Military Culture based off of what military you hail from.
Now they all distill down to the basic idea of a Military Officer/Soldier. But there will be subtle (yet big) differences between a Souix, Pueblo, Azzie, Amazonian, Corp, AGS, UCAS, and even CAS soldier. Just by nature of how some of those forces came into being. |
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Nov 1 2006, 09:12 PM
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#162
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,008 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Actually, not all of them do. There was a brief period when the Red Army had no ranks or professional officer corps—officers and other leaders were elected by the general body of the enlisted.
You know, during the whole four or five months that the USSR managed to be heading towards its stated ideals. ~J |
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Nov 1 2006, 10:09 PM
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#163
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Prime Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,577 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gwynedd Valley PA Member No.: 1,221 |
yeah, military by commitee. worked real well.
There is also a level of comtradery between ex military that non-military are excluded from. My father was french navy, enlisted. My father in law was US navy, and officer, but both in the Med in the mid 50's. They clearly shared a bond. DLN's husband is ex-british army, infantry. Her grandfather was Imperial Japanese Navy in WW2, but the two of them get on better than DLN's dad does with his father in law. |
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Nov 1 2006, 10:24 PM
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#164
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,008 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
Do you have a source for any indication of how it worked? As far as I could tell, it got scrapped within a matter of months for being too inconvenient to control by people more interested in dictatorship than communism. ~J |
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Nov 2 2006, 02:42 PM
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#165
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Prime Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,577 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gwynedd Valley PA Member No.: 1,221 |
lol, I was being sarcastic. It was a freaking disaster!
the Communists balked at some of the German demands at the peace table in 1917 , so the Germans went back on the offensive and eviserated the Soviet led forces more easily than even the screw up that was the imperial system. most people don't pay attention to that part of WW1 but when the russians finally agreed to the treaty of Brest-Livosk, the Germans were well into the Ukraine. |
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Nov 2 2006, 02:46 PM
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#166
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Manus Celer Dei Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 17,008 Joined: 30-December 02 From: Boston Member No.: 3,802 |
The Red Army was, IIRC, established after the Germans waltzed through the Ukraine. I ask my question above because unless I'm mixing up my dates, the military-by-committee never actually got tested before it was axed.
~J |
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Nov 2 2006, 04:22 PM
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#167
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
i honestly can't imagine it working very well--at the very best, i doubt it'd work any better than commissioned leadership. allow me to quote a relevant passage from the most holy of holies:
there's more, but that's the important part. electing your officers smacks of choice, and choice--at least, when it comes to the chains of support and command--is not a good thing. when someone of higher rank says to do something, those with lower rank shouldn't factor their own desires into the decision of whether or not to do it. and that goes both ways; those with rank can't allow personal relationships to get in the way of things they need to make people do. officers that have to worry about re-election, and lower enlisted that are constantly considering a recall--stuff like that really fucks with the basic concept of doing things in a military manner. |
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Nov 2 2006, 10:20 PM
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#168
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Prime Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,577 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gwynedd Valley PA Member No.: 1,221 |
In 1917 before the October Boshevick coup, socialists were a part of the revolutionary action. They formed a Soviet (group) for workers and encouraged similar activity in the army. This undercut Karensky's government. and as the Bolshevicks refused to act with the government at all, it crippled it. After the october revolution the military and workers soviets were recognized by the Bolshevicks as expressions of the people's will...etc etc drek etc. (hense Union of the Soviet Socialist Republics) The point is that workers/enlisted men were being encouraged to disregard authroity figures. Who also happened to be the men with the leadership ability. The affect being that when the Russians under Trotsky broke off negotiations with the Gemrans, the German war machines rolled forward and military units run by Soviets wewre loath to give authority back to one man again, even at minor levels, and so ruled by committee. Something which doesn't work in a crisis, and the Germans rolled through disorganized unlead Russians forces even faster than disorganized Russians still in ranks. Remember the rail lines and logistics werem ilitary and they also went to soviets. I think what you are thinking of was the confusion in the Russian army in WW2. THAT was brought on by a diufferent lack of leadership. a year or so before Hitler invaded, Stalin, captain paranoid, ran a purge through his military, to destroy anyone who might threaten him. Pretty much the whole russian army at the rank of Colonel and higher was gutted. Those who survived were terrified and many officers were promoted up to replace the losses did not have a hcance to grow into their roles before the Gemran attack. The one army not purged was safely away in far Siberia. They fought a short sharp war with the Japanese and do drubbed them, that in 1941, when the Japanese would otherwise take on the world, stayed well away from the Soviet troops. That army would come to the aid of Moscow in December of 1941, riding on the wings of the russian winter they dealt the first serious blow on land to the german army. They were lead by a General named Zhukov. |
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Nov 3 2006, 06:30 AM
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#169
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Freelance Elf Group: Dumpshocked Posts: 7,324 Joined: 30-September 04 From: Texas Member No.: 6,714 |
Heehee, she said breast. Heehee. |
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 Nov 4 2006, 03:26 AM
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#170
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Prime Runner Group: Members Posts: 3,577 Joined: 26-February 02 From: Gwynedd Valley PA Member No.: 1,221 |
So, are you Beevus or Butthead? Twit! :newbie:
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Nov 4 2006, 03:45 PM
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#171
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Target Group: Members Posts: 6 Joined: 2-November 06 Member No.: 9,763 |
So, my dad works for the military (as a civilian) at Ft. Benning in Columbus GA. One of the things I've noticed since he's been working with them (something like twelve years now, so the whole culture is pretty ingrained) is the tendency to reduce places and positions to acronyms. That, and converting those acronyms into whole words. So, like, the SAC would be the "sack."
That said, it's important to remember that most military organizations are, in the 6th World, relegated to corporate presences. So, everything that is normally considered "military" has to be couched in that context. The Crack |
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Nov 5 2006, 09:42 AM
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#172
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Immortal Elf Group: Members Posts: 11,410 Joined: 1-October 03 From: Pittsburgh Member No.: 5,670 |
what's funny is how common it is that a soldier will use an acronym every day, and not know what it stands for. it wasn't until my fifth time on CQ that i figured out it meant "Charge of Quarters".
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Nov 6 2006, 05:58 PM
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#173
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Running Target Group: Members Posts: 1,286 Joined: 24-May 05 From: A 10x10 room with an orc and a treasure chest Member No.: 7,409 |
The things you learn on the internet. That was the one acronym I couldn't figure out. Thanks. |
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Nov 6 2006, 07:59 PM
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#174
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Midnight Toker Group: Members Posts: 7,686 Joined: 4-July 04 From: Zombie Drop Bear Santa's Workshop Member No.: 6,456 |
The effectiveness of military by committee depends entirely on the efficiency of the committee. It just happens that a committee of one is very efficient. However, a DNI hivemind would probably work better. (We are the Borg. Resistance is Futile) Plotwank aside.
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Nov 7 2006, 02:30 AM
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#175
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Moving Target Group: Members Posts: 178 Joined: 4-September 05 Member No.: 7,682 |
If the military of the future is anything like today's, a DNI hivemind would likely use either proven technology that is 10 years out of date or cutting-edge stuff with unknown side-effects, either of which could affect it's effectiveness. Additionally, it would be built by the lowest bidder.
What you need to be effective is a single person that has either the brains to do it themselves or the chutzpah to intimidate others into going along with them even if they are wrong. |
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